Post-Game Talk: Jack Campbell is a Toronto Maple Leaf. Leafs win.

[zeke]

Sure they have. That's exactly what I stated in my post and you agreed. If you don't agree with that criticism that's cool but it's pretty confusing when you say you do.

People have also said that Fred is single handedly responsible for our losing streak. One player deserves 100% of the blame for all those losses. How do you feel about that? More fair criticism? Or are some people being irrational and unfair?

Yes everyone thinks the leafs would be posting shutouts every game if not for Fred.

For sure.

And then you claim other posters are making things up.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

The "over the top" slandering of Andersen is really only a response to absurd defence of him since early March. No goal was ever on him and it was always some excuse like it was a deflection, or he was screened, blah blah blah. Never once did it occur to the Andersen Defence League that this could be done for any goalie and any team, and pointing out every giveaway or missed assignment on a goal against didn't absolve a goaltender of allowing a muffin or a bad angle shot to squeeze through. Hockey is a game of mistakes, Lord knows we capitalize on enough of them, but at the end of the day the goalie needs to stop at least some of those chances against, and it doesn't help that the Leafs skaters really were doing a good job of limiting high danger chances against and yet the few they allowed still ended up in the net.

The results did not match what was going on on the ice, so really criticism of Andersen is defence of our skaters who've performed admirably defensively and still have allowed the fewest goals against in the division despite this rough stretch of goaltending. Hell league wide we rank 10th in raw goals against, 9th in goals against per game, and 8th in shots allowed per game, and that's playing in the offensively inclined North Division.

@Zybalto did a good job of showing our advanced metrics defensively as well.

All Canadian division teams Defensive numbers:

Fewest Shots Against/60:

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Calgary
4. Edmonton
5. Winnipeg
6. Ottawa
7. Vancouver

xGA/60 Ranking:

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Calgary
4. Edmonton
5. Ottawa
6. Winnipeg
7. Vancouver

Goals Against/60 Ranking:

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Edmonton
4. Winnipeg
5. Calgary
6. Vancouver
7. Ottawa

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yes everyone thinks the leafs would be posting shutouts every game if not for Fred.

For sure.

And then you claim other posters are making things up.

So you don't want to answer the question, why am I not surprised. I can only assume that you've realized that blaming one player 100% for a string losses is absurd but you just can't bring yourself to say that he doesn't deserve 100% of the blame either.

 

[zeke]

So you don't want to answer the question, why am I not surprised. I can only assume that you've realized that blaming one player 100% for a string losses is absurd but you just can't bring yourself to say that he doesn't deserve 100% of the blame either.

nobody blamed anyone 100% for anything. this is you making things up. Fred isn't responsible for every loss or every goal against, and nobody has claimed anything close to taht.

But by every measure and observation the following are all true:

1. Team offense has been very good
2. Team defense has been very good
3. Backup goaltending has been great
4. Starting goaltender has been bad.

 

[ToneDog]

So you don't want to answer the question, why am I not surprised. I can only assume that you've realized that blaming one player 100% for a string losses is absurd but you just can't bring yourself to say that he doesn't deserve 100% of the blame either.

Versteeg agrees with you:

What can get the Maple Leafs' top lines firing again? - Sportsnet.ca

 

[Notsince67]

I pointed to something this stupid fan base say Andersen never does in the playoffs. Steal games. Video evidence. Statistical evidence. NOW SIT DOWN.

Vasilevski's career playoff SAV% is .918. He won a cup with a .927 SAV% last year. Freddy puts up .922 and .936 in back to back years and hes the issue in this town. RIGHT

clowns in this town have to trade someone every year. Freddy is just the flavor of the month. Hey I wonder how Kappinen is doing in PITT, or Kadri in COL.....

ALSO, talking about your low lite reel.....every player has one. that is why career numbers matter. At the end of the day you are who your stats say you are.

LAST season Adrei Vasilevski had a 20 game stretch where he posted a .901 SAV%.

2 years ago, 3 of his 7 games were below a 902 sv%. We lost all of those games.
3 years ago, 4 of 7 were below a 875 sv%. Lost all of those. These are middling stats. Total garbage when under pressure

 

[Joey Hoser]

So you don't want to answer the question, why am I not surprised. I can only assume that you've realized that blaming one player 100% for a string losses is absurd but you just can't bring yourself to say that he doesn't deserve 100% of the blame either.

I've avoided you on this topic because honestly, you are just being weird. You and basically everyone else agree that Andersen hasn't played good enough and we need to look elsewhere. There are a few crazy people who think Andersen is a jerk and everything is his fault, but they are few and far between, just like there are a few crazy people who still think he's good and it's all the team's fault.

But for some reason, you keep trying to drag others into defending the crazy people. Stop it. Just respond directly to those crazy people, and leave every else alone. I think you'll find there's fewer of those crazy people than you think.

 

[Gary Nylund]

nobody blamed anyone 100% for anything. this is you making things up. Fred isn't responsible for every loss or every goal against, and nobody has claimed anything close to taht.

But by every measure and observation the following are all true:

1. Team offense has been very good
2. Team defense has been very good
3. Backup goaltending has been great
4. Starting goaltender has been bad.

Nope. Not making anything up and it's insulting for you to call me a liar.

Just the other day, someone said that Fred is "single handedly" responsible for our losing streak. How would you interpret that phrase? It seems pretty clear to me.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I've avoided you on this topic because honestly, you are just being weird. You and basically everyone else agree that Andersen hasn't played good enough and we need to look elsewhere. There are a few crazy people who think Andersen is a jerk and everything is his fault, but they are few and far between, just like there are a few crazy people who still think he's good and it's all the team's fault.

But for some reason, you keep trying to drag others into defending the crazy people. Stop it. Just respond directly to those crazy people, and leave every else alone. I think you'll find there's fewer of those crazy people than you think.

What can I say, I don't like it when people unfairly trash our players which is why I've defended many of them in the past including Reimer, Bernier, Kadri, Phaneuf, Nylander, Kessel ... the list goes on and on.

I also take offence when people accuse me of making things up like Zeke just did, if there's one thing I hate on these boards is intellectual dishonesty.

 

[Notsince67]

Nope. Not making anything up and it's insulting for you to call me a liar.

Just the other day, someone said that Fred is "single handedly" responsible for our losing streak. How would you interpret that phrase? It seems pretty clear to me.

other than hutch losing a game, that pretty well sums it up

 

[Jmo89]

nobody blamed anyone 100% for anything. this is you making things up. Fred isn't responsible for every loss or every goal against, and nobody has claimed anything close to taht.

But by every measure and observation the following are all true:

1. Team offense has been very good
2. Team defense has been very good
3. Backup goaltending has been great
4. Starting goaltender has been bad.

I agree with most of this.

However, personally I'm pretty comfortable blaming Fred pretty near 100% for two of the losses.

Leafs/Jets 3/9/2021
.826, 4 goals on 23 shots.
Hellybuck was .923 with 3 goals on 39 shots

Leafs/Calgary 3/19/2021
.778, 4 goals on 18 shots

Both were 4-3 losses.

I'll compromise and say they were only 95% Fred.

 

[zeke]

Nope. Not making anything up and it's insulting for you to call me a liar.

Just the other day, someone said that Fred is "single handedly" responsible for our losing streak. How would you interpret that phrase? It seems pretty clear to me.

If he's saying that average goaltending would have meant no actual "losing streak", then he's just stating facts.

If he's blaming fred 100% for every goal against and every loss (which was your dishonest claim), then he's wrong.

 

[Gary Nylund]

If he's saying that average goaltending would have meant no actual "losing streak", then he's just stating facts.

If he's blaming fred 100% for every goal against and every loss (which was your dishonest claim), then he's wrong.

Like I said, that one poster said that Fred is "single handedly" responsible for our losing streak. Do you agree or disagree?

 

[Martin Skoula]

Like I said, that one poster said that Fred is "single handedly" responsible for our losing streak. Do you agree or disagree?

He holds 51% or more of the responsibility for it, he's the majority stakeholder of that streak.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Versteeg agrees with you:

What can get the Maple Leafs' top lines firing again? - Sportsnet.ca

I spent some time listening and I agree with him on most of what I heard but not all.

The goals he gave up on Friday weren't so bad - agree.
There are other reasons were losing lately, putting it all on Fred is stupid - agree.
Our PP has sucked lately is a big problem - agree.
Tons of stupid giveaways have led to goals which is hard to blame Fred for- agree.
Jack should start until he falters - agree.

Then not sure I heard right but I think he said something like Fred just needs to get healthy and he's the guy we'll be counting on or something like that - um yeah, I dunno about that.

Maybe Freddie can bounce back and still help us out this season, you never know. I wouldn't count on it at this point though.

 

[Gary Nylund]

He holds 51% or more of the responsibility for it, he's the majority stakeholder of that streak.

See now that's completely reasonable. It's hard to put an exact number on it but 51% might be fair. To say that all the blame is on him though, that's just irrational.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Too many people in life with too many excuses
Leaf fans are tired of all da excuses for Freddy
I could care less what has save percent is
Bottom line is even if he was 18-0 this year who cares he is 0-8 when we needed him to win 1 freaking game ... 1 freakin game ... he could not even win us 1 freaking game that mattered to get us to a round 2
Loser man just a loser ... and he will continue to lose if we put him on ice for playoffs
We tried to trade him in da summer and bottom line no one wanted him unless they could get him for almost nothing
Next summer he will catch on as a 2nd stringer if he is lucky making league minimum at best or he will more likely play in Denmark pro league where there is no pressure on him

 

[Confucius]

So what you are saying is 4 of 7 Freddy was good. That is the majority of the games. Thanks for letting us all know how dumb you are. 4 > 3

Also Freddy only game up 1 goal in the first 2 games vs CBJ and the Leafs only won the game where he posted a shutout. Your dumb ass should be pointing the finger at loser NO GOALS in 5 games vs CBJ Mitch Marner.

2018-2019 vs Bruins
Freddy has ONE game below .900 and the Leafs still lost the series where Freddy posted a .922 in 7 games.

View attachment 411123

Sports is a what have you done for me lately industry. Posting numbers showing he had a good series 2 years ago doesn't mean anything today. JT had 47 goals 2 years ago and quite a few fans are not happy for some reason.

 

[Lightsol]

The media wing of Andersen apologists are kicking it into high gear this morning.
"Campbell has no track record as a starter!" unlike Jordan Binnington a few years back.

This argument always makes me facepalm, because NO ONE is a starter, until they are. And sometimes you have to play the backup for a while and see if he can be a starter.

Honestly, the fact is Andersen is currently playing himself out of a job in Toronto. People seem to have forgotten this is his contract year. How willing is the team going to be to commit to him for another term if he keeps playing like he has over the last year or so?

 

[4thline]

Question of the day- if Freddy wants to be a Leaf and is willing to put his pride aside and sign in the 1.6 -2.5 range to battle with JC for starts would you have him back?

 

[Menzinger]

Question of the day- if Freddy wants to be a Leaf and is willing to put his pride aside and sign in the 1.6 -2.5 range to battle with JC for starts would you have him back?

I think he'd be hard to turn down at that price especially with the idea of him being a 1B But also depends on which ufa goalies would be willing to sign as a comparison

 

[Gary Nylund]

Sports is a what have you done for me lately industry. Posting numbers showing he had a good series 2 years ago doesn't mean anything today. JT had 47 goals 2 years ago and quite a few fans are not happy for some reason.

He was just responding to someone who brought up things from that long ago. It doesn't seem it's enough that we all agree Freddie's been bad this season, we have to back in time to blame him for all kinds of past sins as well. Apparently that's not enough either, we need to make up things that haven't happened, you know, just to make it clear how hated he is in these parts.

This argument always makes me facepalm, because NO ONE is a starter, until they are. And sometimes you have to play the backup for a while and see if he can be a starter.

Honestly, the fact is Andersen is currently playing himself out of a job in Toronto. People seem to have forgotten this is his contract year. How willing is the team going to be to commit to him for another term if he keeps playing like he has over the last year or so?

What were they arguing? If it was that Campbell can't be a starting goalie then of course that's wrong. If they're saying that it would be foolish to assume that he can do a good job as a starter, that seems accurate.

 

[Confucius]

Campbell's career numbers are better than Fred's. To me it seems like he was just caught playing behind better goalies in the past. He has now emerged and I hope Keefe gives him several games in a row, not the one bad game and you're done plan.

 

[napoleon in rags]

Question of the day- if Freddy wants to be a Leaf and is willing to put his pride aside and sign in the 1.6 -2.5 range to battle with JC for starts would you have him back?

No. Time to move on.

 

[Lightsol]

What were they arguing? If it was that Campbell can't be a starting goalie then of course that's wrong.

The argument is that Campbell can't be a starter, because he's always been a backup. I've heard that one from my father, immediately followed by the insistence that the Leafs should get Montreal to give them $10 million Carey Price. Odds that Montreal JUMPS at the chance to get rid of that albatross?