Prospect Info: Ivan Demidov (2024 5th OA): SKA St. Petersburg (KHL)

[BigDaddyLurch]

Mario Lemieux would have more points today than he did back then. Look what he did as an old man after years off when they got rid of the obstruction rules.

The only way to stop Lemieux was to hold on to him for dear life. Yeah, McDavid would be super fast in the 80s but he doesn’t have to deal with obstruction the way those players did. It’s a completely different game and far more geared towards offense now.

Lemieux would be the all time scorer in today’s game. There’d simply be no way to stop him.

Edit: Aaaand I’m realizing this is the Demodov thread…. Moving on.

...said it before and I'll say it again; Mario was the greatest player I've ever seen play and that includes Gretz's entire career...

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

I really dislike the argument that past great players wouldn't succeed in today's game. I believe that great players would be great players regardless of the era that they play in.

You say McDavid gets 200 points in Mario's day? Well I reply by saying Gretz and Mario would break records today, with the advances in equipment technology, nutrition, scientific knowledge and especially the way the game is played/called today.

Imagine Mario without having players waterskiing him, crosschecking etc. He would break a 100 goal season.

Bottom line is that any great player in any generation would succeed regardless of the era. IMHO.

Gretzky and Mario would score far less, that is an indisputable fact. The fact that you are implying that it was harder to score in the Eighties and early 90's is laughable and entirely refuted by the facts.

Gretzky, Orr and Mario were great players and would be in any generation but McDavid is absolutely on par with them imo. I watched Wayne and Mario's entire careers including before they were drafted and their stats were inflated by playing in a watered down league with terrible goalies and poor defensive systems. Perhaps you should take a look at the rest of the scoring leaders and the top goalies stats lol. You are simply arguing solely from bias and have zero evidence to support your claim.

Gretzky would struggle the most out of the three that I mentioned as he did not have the speed or physicality that the others brought. Gretzky took advantage of absurdly poor competition and was in the right place at the right time. He would still be a great player but if you think Gretzky would be anywhere remotely close to 200 points in today's NHL you are putting forth a delusional narrative.

 

[Toene]

Mario Lemieux would have more points today than he did back then. Look what he did as an old man after years off when they got rid of the obstruction rules.

The only way to stop Lemieux was to hold on to him for dear life. Yeah, McDavid would be super fast in the 80s but he doesn’t have to deal with obstruction the way those players did. It’s a completely different game and far more geared towards offense now.

Lemieux would be the all time scorer in today’s game. There’d simply be no way to stop him.

Edit: Aaaand I’m realizing this is the Demodov thread…. Moving on.

It's on topic since we're discussing the meaning of the generational label and what a generation is and represents.

I dont want to get technical and invoke the boring forum etiquette mumbo-jumbo that nobody cares about, but that discussion is officially legit because it is directly related to the fact that Demidov is the best hockey player in the history of humanity. I request full immunity.

 

[26Mats]

Gretzky and Mario would score far less, that is an indisputable fact. The fact that you are implying that it was harder to score in the Eighties and early 90's is laughable and entirely refuted by the facts.

Gretzky, Orr and Mario were great players and would be in any generation but McDavid is absolutely on par with them imo. I watched Wayne and Mario's entire careers including before they were drafted and their stats were inflated by playing in a watered down league with terrible goalies and poor defensive systems. Perhaps you should take a look at the rest of the scoring leaders and the top goalies stats lol. You are simply arguing solely from bias and have zero evidence to support your claim.

Gretzky would struggle the most out of the three that I mentioned as he did not have the speed or physicality that the others brought. Gretzky took advantage of absurdly poor competition and was in the right place at the right time. He would still be a great player but if you think Gretzky would be anywhere remotely close to 200 points in today's NHL you are putting forth a delusional narrative.

Gretzky would be bigger (more muscular) and probably faster with today's training regiments.

It's just so hard for me to know what Gretzky would be or do in today's game.

But the fact that he was so egregiously able to take advantage of the short comings of his era, when no one else could to the extent that he did, says a lot.

Would be interesting to see what prime Gretzky could do with modern training, one piece sticks, advanced technology of skates, etc... Could Ovechkin score all the goals he has with those shitty Titan wood sticks Gretzky used, even as bad as the goaltending pre-Roy butterfly was? Probably. But Ovi wouldn't have even been in the NHL because he was Russian, to your point about competition...

 

[the valiant effort]

Broken Mario paced for 145 pts in 2001 and 111 pts in 2003 but yeah he’d be in tough today against Alex Kerfoot, Ethan Bear, and Cayden Primeau

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Gretzky would be bigger (more muscular) and probably faster with today's training regiments.

It's just so hard for me to know what Gretzky would be or do in today's game.

But the fact that he was so egregiously able to take advantage of the short comings of his era, when no one else could to the extent that he did, says a lot.

Would be interesting to see what prime Gretzky could do with modern training, one piece sticks, advanced technology of skates, etc... Could Ovechkin score all the goals he has with those shitty Titan wood sticks Gretzky used, even as bad as the goaltending pre-Roy butterfly was? Probably. But Ovi wouldn't have even been in the NHL because he was Russian, to your point about competition...

Many good points although I would suggest that Gretzky would still have the same relative speed, strength disadvantage as he wouldn't gain on anyone as opposed to simply progressing on the same curve as his contemporaries. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Lemieux would be superior to Gretzky in today's game.

I generally prefer to avoid these post modern discussions as there isn't much point to them but there were such bad arguments being made here that I had to try and intervene lol.

 

[Hanji]

Ref lecturing Demidov.

 

[Kennerback]

It's on topic since we're discussing the meaning of the generational label and what a generation is and represents.

I dont want to get technical and invoke the boring forum etiquette mumbo-jumbo that nobody cares about, but that discussion is officially legit because it is directly related to the fact that Demidov is the best hockey player in the history of humanity. I request full immunity.

Bedard being the one recent player pre-draft being called generational made me use him as a yardstick to evaluate elite young players. He’s still in all the high profile commercials and marketing campaigns.

But the fact he’s about 100th in goal scoring right now is skewing my evaluations.

So I’ll fall back on the other recent reference point McDavid. and will reevaluate Celebrini and all the others in comparison.