Its time for a discount core 4 era!

[A1LeafNation]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

Click to read more...

 

[notDatsyuk]

The time for that would have been when they signed JT. If Dubas had signed him for $8 (a much more reasonable number), then the others would have signed for more appropriate amounts, along those lines.

That opportunity is long past, and we're stuck with three badly oversize contracts (Nylander is playing at least close to value, especially in the playoffs).

 

[ORRFForever]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

There is ZERO chance they agree to less. Matthews will want a long term deal where he remains a Top 5 contract for years to come and Marner will want what Matthews gets.

ZERO CHANCE.

 

[hamzarocks]

If you have incrementing pics/info on the loser 4 then yea you could get them signed to that type of deal and have 8-9M left

Outside of that, these 4 guys will fight for every penny and dime

The only guy who didnt take us to the cleaners is 44.

7.5M is a discount when he was signing (70 pt season last year) and always plays great come playoffs

The 4 forwards have the biggest egos on the team

We've hyped them so much the believe they were untouchable and could do nothing wrong.

 

[koyvoo]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

More available money to spread around would always be better, but this year the depth players did their jobs. And very well.

The depth players/defence/goalies were let down by the big money core players, who were the only ones didn’t do what they were supposed to.

 

[Eye Test]

If you have incrementing pics/info on the loser 4 then yea you could get them signed to that type of deal and have 8-9M left

Outside of that, these 4 guys will fight for every penny and dime

The only guy who didnt take us to the cleaners is 44.

7.5M is a discount when he was signing (70 pt season last year) and always plays great come playoffs

The 4 forwards have the biggest egos on the team

We've hyped them so much the believe they were untouchable and could do nothing wrong.

Nylander was a bit rough negotiating but he’s worth that easily. Make MO the captain so I can buy his jersey. 34 is back in the closet.

 

[Trapper]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

I prefer a refund, not a discount. I’m not shopping at that store anymore.

 

[Buds17]

The problem could very well be found in those contracts, or even in that mix of players on the whole. We also can't necessarily absolve the coaching or supporting staff of players from any amount of blame either.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

The premise of this thread is correct.

Below is what a literal genius wrote in 2019 after the unprecedented dramatic overpayments. Who is it that wrote that again? Sounds like a smart fella...

You’ll all see. Just like when honest leaf fans were 100% right about Burke’s reign of terror, the same thing will happen going forward. The leafs will be good, but not great. Sundin era leafs good. Win some round here and there. Not even make the finals, let alone win the cup. And it WILL be a result of the unprecedented dramatic overpayments. Some of us just don’t live in denial. We see what’s really happening. The entire rest of the league sees it too.

 

[notbias]

The premise of this thread is correct.

Below is what a literal genius wrote in 2019 after the unprecedented dramatic overpayments. Who is it that wrote that again? Sounds like a smart fella...

Whoever wrote that was 100% wrong, their whole premise was they'd win some rounds and then be overpaid.

 

[Suntouchable13]

For the first time ever Dubas actually got it right with the depth/support players. It's very clear now that the underperforming big money players are the issue. If Dubas is not willing to shake up the core, we better be hearing news on monday morning that he is fired.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Whoever wrote that was 100% wrong, their whole premise was they'd win some rounds and then be overpaid.

Huh? That quote was written in 2019 after the unprecedented dramatic overpayments were signed. That genius said that the overpayments will result in the team being "good", not "great" going forward. Win a round here and there but never go deep. That's precisely what happened.

 

[seanlinden]

The only way you're going to get these guys on a discount, is if you're prepared to trade them. Dubas wasn't prepared to do so back when he negotiated the first time around.

First up is AM34, simply because he can't be traded after July 1.... if he isn't willing to buy into the "let's make you highly paid, but in line with your position amongst the relative superstars of the league"... then trade him.

Maybe the solution lies in something along the lines of a 2-year deal at $12m -- keeping him under McDavid, for the duration of McDavid's deal. He'd still only be 28 when it expires.

If he wants to set another high-water mark for contracts, then it's time to move him.

That should send a message to William Nylander, who's trade protection isn't overly crippling post-July 1.... which will in turn send a message to Mitch Marner on his next deal.

JT, I'd imagine would be a much simpler negotiation given that he'll be at the twilight of his career.

 

[Peace Frog]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

To me, it’s much more than the cap space the “core” players take up. It’s that they don’t have any grit, nastiness and warrior mentality.

Those elements need to be there in our best players, if we want success in the playoffs. It’s been that way forever and don’t think that will ever change.

Any team that won the Cup, had a core that would push back and/or come through in clutch situations.

They might not have been Wendel Clark’s or Gary Roberts type of tough and gritty, but they fought through it and came out the other side.

This group doesn’t have a core that is ready and/or willing to do that.

 

[sunstersun]

Let's not swing overly dramatic in one way. It doesn't matter if the contracts are big, it matters whether they are worth it or not. Kadri at 4.5 is an example of a super worth it contract compared to Tavares at 11.

I'd give Mcdavid and Drai a blank cheque.

Out of our core 4, only 1 contract is worth it, everyone else is overpaid.

I'm fine with going for a cheaper core, but it can't be like trading kadri for a cheaper kerfoot.

 

[Racer88]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

I like the number you gave but it still doesn’t fix that they disappear and are easily intimidated in the playoffs

 

[Stephen]

The time for that would have been when they signed JT. If Dubas had signed him for $8 (a much more reasonable number), then the others would have signed for more appropriate amounts, along those lines.

That opportunity is long past, and we're stuck with three badly oversize contracts (Nylander is playing at least close to value, especially in the playoffs).

The John Tavares era cannot end fast enough. It's just too bad that it's outliving the Nylander and Matthews contracts by a year.

 

[stealth1]

Those 4 contracts were the main reason we didn't have proper depth and failed year after year.

The rest of the roster pretty much over achieved compared to their cost/cap hits.

Tavares at 8m
Matthews at 10m
Marner at 8m
Nylander at 6m

What should have been 8.4 m in extra cap is another franchise level player that could have been added to the roster. An extra goal here or there could have led to multiple series wins.

I don't want to hear about being adequately paid. Teams that win had their players take discounts. All those guys got their money, time to do what the rest of the team did and take less to win.

It's either get paid OR win, and it can't be both!

Disagree. That extra 8.4m in cap space changes nothing. Them taking a discount doesn't make them any better come playoff time. I wish fans would see that this core is not going to win anything. It needs to be blown up. Regular season stats mean nothing.

 

[hamzarocks]

The premise of this thread is correct.

Below is what a literal genius wrote in 2019 after the unprecedented dramatic overpayments. Who is it that wrote that again? Sounds like a smart fella...

bro the leafs failed to even be this good lool

They won ONE round in 5 years

 

[m1ker]

We can have unlimited money for depth and we’ll still lose if all 4 are in the top 6.

 

[Aashir]

Tavares at 8 isn’t a discount

Tavares at 4 is a discount

He is so far behind the other three as a player

He’s a high end 3C if he plays pp2

 

[NVious]

Could you imagine those greedy losers taking a discount? JT probably even wants a raise.

 

[cannucky]

Huh? That quote was written in 2019 after the unprecedented dramatic overpayments were signed. That genius said that the overpayments will result in the team being "good", not "great" going forward. Win a round here and there but never go deep. That's precisely what happened.

If we're turning on the "Way Back Machine" then maybe go back to the discussion of JT before he was signed for 11 million but after it was known that's how much he was demanding . There was another knowledgeable fan that explained exactly how signing this player we really didn't need would adversely effect our internal structure and lead to a team of a few over payed unproven youth mixed with a bunch of league minimum has been's .It's like he was looking into a crystal ball eh !

 

[sunstersun]

The only thing I want in the next two years are solid prospects, good contracts and draft picks.

Until we get rid of Tavares 11mil, no contention for the cup is possible. We should be trying to get as many long term EV positive assets as possible like Knies and Woll.

 

[cannucky]

The time for that would have been when they signed JT. If Dubas had signed him for $8 (a much more reasonable number), then the others would have signed for more appropriate amounts, along those lines.

That opportunity is long past, and we're stuck with three badly oversize contracts (Nylander is playing at least close to value, especially in the playoffs).

There was no option of signing him for 8 he had offers from other teams we had to at least match , Nylander held out quite literally until the last hour and if Dubas had handed him a notice terminating his team payed insurance policy and told him next years offer will be 500k less , enjoy your year in Sweden then there would be no 11 million dollar players on this team , in fact there would only be two 7.5 -8 million dollar guys and one 5 million dollar guy . Twenty million for 3 young studs is way better than 40 million for 3 and JT who we really didn't need after a great season .