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Is there a top seven now in international hockey?

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Without the Olympics how could you even ever begin to claim to be sure?

Otherwise how do we rank Team Europe :sarcasm:

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Canada

Sweden

USA
RUSSIA

Finland

Czech
Switzerland

I still find the gap between 5 and 6 too large though that I feel it is unfair to not make it top 8 if you aint making it top 5.
 
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Switzerland has surpassed Slovakia at mens hockey no question about it but interesting is that we beat them in junior categories pretty regularly. Then they have a big advantage of having good league which obviously can produce good players
 
Urbanskog said:
I have considered Switzerland to have surpassed Slovakia for a minimum of a few years ago already.
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I don’t know about that, men’s best on best would be pretty close although admittedly our best players are aging rapidly. Still we have the better u18, u17 and u16 teams, and I’d argue we have historically the better u20 team, although the Swiss team this year has advanced further than us. The Swiss have produced more “top” talents in the past few years, that most is obvious.
 
We have our top 5 in no order:

Finland
Sweden
US
Canada
Russia




then the next 2 in no order:

Czech Republic
Switzerland



then
Slovakia

then in no order
Germany
Kazakhstan
 
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As a Finn how can you make us a tier 3 team? We always do better or the same as USA/Sweden/Russia, and taking in consideration the last drafts.
 
As far as younger players, my current ranking would be something like:

1. USA
2. Russia
3. Canada
4. Finland
5. Sweden

It'll translate to the NHL soon enough.
 
crowi said:
USA is overrated as usual.
Always the same thing too, putting the cart before the horse.
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If we're talking about MODERN success and not living in the past, the USA has had more WJHC success in the past decade than any other country regardless of whether or not they win gold. That's not an accident. It's a country taking over the top spot.

Russia dominated the sport for a while. Then it was Canada. Now it's USA's turn. Not saying it will last forever, but for now the US is producing better hockey talent than any other country.
 
PrototypeX85 said:
If we're talking about MODERN success and not living in the past, the USA has had more WJHC success in the past decade than any other country regardless of whether or not they win gold. That's not an accident. It's a country taking over the top spot.

Russia dominated the sport for a while. Then it was Canada. Now it's USA's turn. Not saying it will last forever, but for now the US is producing better hockey talent than any other country.
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It also depends on the ice, Europeans tends to do better with bigger ice as they are used to play on it when in juniors and same goes with NA with smaller ice.
 
For me only Top 5(Regarding performance in NHL,World Juniors,Drafts,best to best)

1. Canada
2. USA
3. Sweden
4. Finland/Russia
 
There's the top 5 and it feels pointless to try to impose any fixed order there. Results vary every year anyway depending on the roster, the coach, hockey gods.

Then there's the next 3 with Czechs, Slovaks, Swiss. Same way, no telling who's strong any given year. (Like, this time Switzerland fell apart in the semifinal but impressed before that.)

Then the next tier and I for one am always glad to see some of them in these tourneys. Nice to get to watch their progress too.
 
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Pilky01 said:
If it weren’t for Dominick Hasek in 1998 the Czech Rep would be rated on the same level as Slovakia.
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No they wouldn't. Look at the Slovak players in the NHL vs the Czechs. There are 30+ Czechs playing in the league vs 7 Slovaks.

Look at Slovakia's core of a 40 year old Chara, Tatar and Panik. Czechs have Pastrnak, Voracek, Krejci, Vrana as well as a bunch of 1st round players coming through.

Also, the Czechs have won a Gold and two Bronze in the World Championships over the past 8 years and have won a Bronze medal and finished 4th once in the Olympics in the past 4.

Sure, they haven't seen success recently in the WJC despite producing multiple first round picks per year, but they sound like a top 6 nation if you ask me.
 
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I'd say it depends on the level you're talking about.

At the junior level there's a clear top 5 (CAN, SWE, RUS, USA, FIN), the order changing year to year, followed by an equally clear 3 dark horses (CZE, SUI, SVK), with the Czechs ahead of Slovakia and Switzerland, each of whom can medal in a good year but probably not win gold.

At the olympic (best on best) level there's the overwhelming favourite (CAN), followed by three primary contenders (SWE, USA, RUS), followed by the perennial dark horse (FIN) who will fight for a medal every time, but probably not gold. Then comes the occasional dark horse (CZE) who will fight for a medal every now and again. Finally there's the long shots (SUI, SVK), with Switzerland in my opinion having passed Slovakia, who are unlikely to fight for a medal but can occasionally challenge the top teams. Then there's the rest who can occasionally make the QFs over one of the other teams but pretty much never make it further (the exception being BLR in 2002).

At the WHC level the dynamics change a bit. The north american teams (especially USA) fall here due to the NHL playoffs still going on. If they happen to have good players missing the playoffs they are up there at the top, if not they are more like 4th or 5ft. Overall I'd say the rankings for the WHC are something like this (depending on who's available from the NHL:
RUS 1-3
CAN 1-4
SWE 1-5
FIN 2-5
USA 2-6
CZE 3-6
SUI 7-8
SVK 7-8
 
Also something interesting i noticed about swiss NHL players' development, only 3 of the 13 players to play in the NHL this season were developed entirely in Switzerland prior to entering the NHL or AHL (Josi, Siegenthaler and Malgin). The rest spent some time in the CHL or SHL prior to entering the NHL, so I wonder if there's a gap in the swiss development system for players too good for swiss juniors or NLB but not good enough for the NLA.
 
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PrototypeX85 said:
If we're talking about MODERN success and not living in the past, the USA has had more WJHC success in the past decade than any other country regardless of whether or not they win gold. That's not an accident. It's a country taking over the top spot.

Russia dominated the sport for a while. Then it was Canada. Now it's USA's turn. Not saying it will last forever, but for now the US is producing better hockey talent than any other country.
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Lol.

No. Let's see it happen at the senior level. Your junior program is best because half of your junior team plays together for 3 years on the USNDT which is a massive advantage over everyone else.
 
WolvesAndWings said:
Lol.

No. Let's see it happen at the senior level. Your junior program is best because half of your junior team plays together for 3 years on the USNDT which is a massive advantage over everyone else.
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Have to agree with you.

I love the USNTDP. I wish every country could financially afford it. The NHL gives millions to USA hockey for the program and nadda to anyone else.

Canada does get money for draft picks but it's no where near what US hockey gets.

Imagine if there was no USNTDP and the players were drafted into the USHL
Not a chance in hell would the US be as successful as they have been in junior tournaments.
 
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