Is Nikita Kucherov a Generational Talent? (Based on his NHL Career)

[jigglysquishy]

Yzerman was also not even close to being considered generational.

 

[DFC]

Yzerman was also not even close to being considered generational.

Right. I'm not making the case that Kucherov is either. I'm just saying he belongs a lot higher on the list than where that guy put him.

Yes, saying he's generational overrates Kucherov. But most people underrate him still.

 

[benfranklin]

Mcdavid and Crosby were called generational talents way before there Draft, no one has ever said Celebrini has the talent to be generational, Bedard is in my opinion very overhyped, and I'm not sure how you say Ovie wasn't generational from the beginning the guy was an absolute force his rookie season he scored 50 goals, how is that needing time to live upto the hype? Mcdavid very well probably would have hit 90+ points his rookie year if not for injuries. And no Makar is not generational, its not something you become over time, it happens from the moment you enter the league, where the players presence on a team alters the course of an entire franchise, like Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr and Crosby. And also Celebrini has never been mentioned in the same breath as the type of prospect as Bedard even whom I don't consider to be generational, yet alone Crosby or Mcdavid, once again you're revising history to support a false narative.


No that will not make him generational

Lol very ironic but the NHL radio guys today were talking about Makar and used the word "Generational" over and over.

Your definition is all over the place. By that you have to be a #1 pick to be considered "generational" and by day 1 you either have it or you dont.

A. Be called "generational" before the draft
B. Be a force in your rookie season.
C. Be a ppg+ your rookie season

You are completely wrong about Celebrini. He may not have been hyped as long as Bedard was due to playing NCAA over juniors, but dude is considered the complete player by every scout and on par with Bedard near his draft.

So Makar could win 10 Norris's, 10 Cups, and hes not generational because he wasnt hyped like McDavid or Crosby?

Rookie season - nearly a PPG and Calder, 7th in scoring missing 13 games
Sophmore season - PPG, 2nd in Norris voting, 5th in scoring missing 12 games
Third season - Norris, Cup, Conn Smythe, 2nd in scoring missing 5 games
4th season - PPG +, 3rd in Norris voting, 9th in scoring missing 22 games
5th season - PPG +, 3rd in Norris voting, 2nd in scoring missing 5 games
6th season - PPG +, currently tied for the league lead in scoring as a defenseman

He has a chance to pass Bourque for all time points as a dman. the only thing stopping him is retiring before it or injuries. Ill give you Orr and Lidstrom, but he is comfortably on pace to be #3 with an argument to take down one or both of them with enough team and individual hardware. You are drastically underestimating how great he is.

In a world where the third best defenseman we've ever seen isnt "generational", youre on drugs.

 

[authentic]

I'm not saying Yzerman wasn't great. But Kucherov should be viewed above him. He's just insanely dangerous.

Yzerman had 155 points playing for a bum team. Also had a few other seasons above 120, and then became one of the games elite two-way players in the second half of his career. Best case scenario Kucherov may have the slightest bit of an offensive advantage but I don’t believe he is a better overall player quite frankly.

Right. I'm not making the case that Kucherov is either. I'm just saying he belongs a lot higher on the list than where that guy put him.

Yes, saying he's generational overrates Kucherov. But most people underrate him still.

Saying he belongs above Yzerman is a testament to how overrated he is really, but who knows if he puts together a few more seasons like last year I could see the argument for it then.

 

[daver]

To be considered generational, you also have to be a great "2-way player" and the "Most Valuable" to your team.

There, that should add some clarity.

 

[DFC]

Yzerman had 155 points playing for a bum team. Also had a few other seasons above 120, and then became one of the games elite two-way players in the second half of his career. Best case scenario Kucherov may have the slightest bit of an offensive advantage but I don’t believe he is a better overall player quite frankly.



Saying he belongs above Yzerman is a testament to how overrated he is really, but who knows if he puts together a few more seasons like last year I could see the argument for it then.

I don't think so. Kucherov has already scored 100 points 4 times, has the TWO highest assist totals by a winger in history, and won two Art Ross trophies. He and McDavid are the two best playoff performers of the generation, and Kucherov has two cups.

Again, Yzerman is my all time favorite player. It's not easy for me to argue anybody over Yzerman. But watching Kucherov now, it's just pretty clear that this is the best forward I've ever followed on a game by game basis.

 

[22FUTON9]

Kuch from the beginning of the 21-22 season (right after he missed the regular season) he’s 4th in points and 2nd in PPG (tied with Mack)
Obviously incredible but definitely wouldn’t call him generational.

 

[sensfan4lifee]

Lol very ironic but the NHL radio guys today were talking about Makar and used the word "Generational" over and over.

Your definition is all over the place. By that you have to be a #1 pick to be considered "generational" and by day 1 you either have it or you dont.

A. Be called "generational" before the draft
B. Be a force in your rookie season.
C. Be a ppg+ your rookie season

You are completely wrong about Celebrini. He may not have been hyped as long as Bedard was due to playing NCAA over juniors, but dude is considered the complete player by every scout and on par with Bedard near his draft.

So Makar could win 10 Norris's, 10 Cups, and hes not generational because he wasnt hyped like McDavid or Crosby?

Rookie season - nearly a PPG and Calder, 7th in scoring missing 13 games
Sophmore season - PPG, 2nd in Norris voting, 5th in scoring missing 12 games
Third season - Norris, Cup, Conn Smythe, 2nd in scoring missing 5 games
4th season - PPG +, 3rd in Norris voting, 9th in scoring missing 22 games
5th season - PPG +, 3rd in Norris voting, 2nd in scoring missing 5 games
6th season - PPG +, currently tied for the league lead in scoring as a defenseman

He has a chance to pass Bourque for all time points as a dman. the only thing stopping him is retiring before it or injuries. Ill give you Orr and Lidstrom, but he is comfortably on pace to be #3 with an argument to take down one or both of them with enough team and individual hardware. You are drastically underestimating how great he is.

In a world where the third best defenseman we've ever seen isnt "generational", youre on drugs.

Makar isn't the best defenseman we've ever seen, stop hyping a player to be something he's not the best DMAN we've ever seen won 9 Norris trophies in a row, who won 2 scoring titles, re defined the way the position is played how the f*** is Makar in a position to take down Orr? There is only one of us on drugs right now my guy and its you, Prime Orr would not lose a Norris to Hughes, he has 1 Norris in 6 seasons and your trying to say he's going to take down a guy who won 9 straight? And no I'm in no way underestimating him, I'm just realistic in my take.

And no scout I ever read said Celebrini was a generational prospect the f***?

I agree with all of that, but not by the age of 25. Im under no illusions that Makar will have a better career than Lidstrom. All im saying is at this point, he has had a better career. Makar has a norris and a cup. By the same age, Lidstrom had neither. Makar could possibly (but not realistically) have 6 Norris' by the age Lidstrom won his first. Also, if you think the guy is so great you could maybe spell his name correctly.

I mean he wont have 6 Norris trophies by that age the dude is injury prone as hell, I can't argue with you Makar fan boys

 

[TheGoldenJet]

To be considered generational, you also have to be a great "2-way player" and the "Most Valuable" to your team.

There, that should add some clarity.

What about physical play?

Also: neither Gretzky nor Lemieux meet your standards for generational then.

 

[Arto Kilponen]

This "generational talent" is even more blurry than #1 d-man.

To begin with, what's talent? Also, what's a generation? Does getting results mean that you have talent?

To me Kucherov is one of the best wingers in NHL right now. Not a clear #1. But if you say he is #1, I can understand the view.

What about physical play?

Also: neither Gretzky nor Lemieux meet your standards for generational then.

Yeah, and very few goalies were that good offensively either.

 

[1specter]

Elite but not generational.

 

[Grifter3511]

Makar isn't the best defenseman we've ever seen, stop hyping a player to be something he's not the best DMAN we've ever seen won 9 Norris trophies in a row, who won 2 scoring titles, re defined the way the position is played how the f*** is Makar in a position to take down Orr? There is only one of us on drugs right now my guy and its you, Prime Orr would not lose a Norris to Hughes, he has 1 Norris in 6 seasons and your trying to say he's going to take down a guy who won 9 straight? And no I'm in no way underestimating him, I'm just realistic in my take.

And no scout I ever read said Celebrini was a generational prospect the f***?


I mean he wont have 6 Norris trophies by that age the dude is injury prone as hell, I can't argue with you Makar fan boys.

The fact that you can't make your point without exaggerations and assumptions leads me to believe that you just can't argue at all.

 

[Miri]

I really truly believe people do not understand the definition of generational talent?!

I really truly believe people do not understand the definition of generational talent?!

we have 2 guys in the league that can lay claim to generation talent--both guys hit the league and the rest is history

Kuch has 637 pts in 575
McDavid 726 in 501
Crosby in his first 550 games? 769 pts


Also--for generation talent remove all team accolades

according to some people there are around 6 generational talents playing in the nhl right now

We are getting great talent confused with generation talents

Probably cause there is no universally agreed upon definition of the term.

 

[GOilers88]

Only winger to ever record 100 assists in a season.

Seems pretty once in a lifetime to me.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Sid Ovi McDavid

 

[HeadLiceHatty]

As close to generational as you get without being it, 1st ballot hall of famer, he'll be remembered as the guy keeping up with Mcdavid for Ross's every year idk man the guys crazy.

 

[Miri]

No player in NHL deserves the designation “generational”, unless you simply insist on the one having most points and thats it - thus only Crosby and McDavid as his replacement qualify.

But not even them can claim the acclaim in rhe same manner Messi and Ronaldo do in football - and thats a fact. When you look at the most goals and assists by a footballer since year 2000 (as it stood at the end of August this year), Messi was at 1212, Ronaldo 1151 and the third one, Robert Lewandowski, was at 800 (while playing most of the career in somwhat inferior german league). So the first 2 guys cca 50 (or 45 percent respectively) then the third guy - now that is GENERATIONAL.

Now look at the point totals of NHL players and since 2015 find McDavid at 988, with the trio of Kucherov, Drai and MacK behind him at 869,855 and 847. Whole 13 percent more points than Kucherov. I guess you can claim its generational, cause he is the best, but as far as i am concerned, he certainly did not do enough to set himself apart from the rest the way Messi and Ronaldo did.

All in all, the whole debate is highly subjective and stupid, as usual.

 

[Fantomas]

Kucherov had a bit of a lull after the Hart trophy season and I thought he maybe wouldn't be the same after the hip surgery. But the way he's come on since last season has made me rethink the kind of player he is. Right now he's angling for top-20 all-time status. Not there yet, but he might do it.

 

[BlueAzN]

He's right below what we consider generation. Generational players literally define the era. Gretzky, Orr, Mats Sundin, Sid Crusty/Ovi, Connor McDonald, etc...

 

[inthewings]

He's right below what we consider generation. Generational players literally define the era. Gretzky, Orr, Mats Sundin, Sid Crusty/Ovi, Connor McDonald, etc...

That's bait

 

[BlueAzN]

That's bait

Look, I had to put a leaf there. Don't hate