Is it time to change the name of the trophies awarded?

[Transplanted Caper]

I'm not that bothered by re-naming trophies. Re-naming the Conn Smythe seems like the safest bet, given how explicit his racism and anti-Semitism was and how it permeated his views in terms of team building and who he'd hire. Some of the greatest players of all time have some pretty suspect political views, but probably not as central to who they were as players/league icons, so the league would get a bit of a pass on it.

 

[scorpiorising]

Why not just update them every X amount of years. Make it a fan/player vote and make a spectacle out of it, or who won it most times in that X amount of years.

 

[FlyerNutter]

So vogue

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Jeff Marek brought this up on todays episode of the Jeff Marek show and I agree with him. I think it’s time to rename some the awards. We have no awards named after Wayne, Bobby Orr, Gordie Howe, Etc. Nearly all the awards are named after executives.

-Conn Smyth was a racist.

-Art Ross, despite being an innovator, had 1 point in the 3 nhl games played.

-James Norris was an owner of several organizations but it’s not like he ever played.

-The Hart trophy was donated by the Hart family, Cecil Hart was the coach of the Montreal Canadians.

-Ted Lindsay’s name being on a trophy is well deserved and I’d want that one to stay.

-Georges Vezina only played 88 NHL games.

-The Bill Masterton trophy is named after the only player to die in the NHL from on-ice related injury.

-Frank Calder was the first President of the NHL.

-Frank Selke was a successful GM.

-William Jennings was the president of the Rangers

-Maurice Rocket Richard is obviously an award who’s name shouldn’t change.

——————————————————————————
I’d like to see:
Conn Smyth: Jean Beliveau Award
Art Ross: Wayne Gretzky Award
Hart: Gordie Howe Award
Frank Selke: Patrice Bergeron Award
Calder: Teemu Selanne Award
Vezina: Vladislav Tretiak Award
Jennings: Dominick Hasek Award
Norris: Orr-Lidstrom Award

I just woke.

How long has this thread been woke?

Who here is woke?

 

[Bizz]

This thread is bad and you should feel bad.

 

[Rich Nixon]

I think the Conn Smyth is the only one that actually deserves it. The others are a little quirky, but they're part of the game's history and benign. Mr. Smythe is indeed part of the league's history, but he's a part that the league should perhaps confront more directly rather than honor.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

Jeff Marek brought this up on todays episode of the Jeff Marek show and I agree with him. I think it’s time to rename some the awards. We have no awards named after Wayne, Bobby Orr, Gordie Howe, Etc. Nearly all the awards are named after executives.

-Conn Smyth was a racist.

-Art Ross, despite being an innovator, had 1 point in the 3 nhl games played.

-James Norris was an owner of several organizations but it’s not like he ever played.

-The Hart trophy was donated by the Hart family, Cecil Hart was the coach of the Montreal Canadians.

-Ted Lindsay’s name being on a trophy is well deserved and I’d want that one to stay.

-Georges Vezina only played 88 NHL games.

-The Bill Masterton trophy is named after the only player to die in the NHL from on-ice related injury.

-Frank Calder was the first President of the NHL.

-Frank Selke was a successful GM.

-William Jennings was the president of the Rangers

-Maurice Rocket Richard is obviously an award who’s name shouldn’t change.

——————————————————————————
I’d like to see:
Conn Smyth: Jean Beliveau Award
Art Ross: Wayne Gretzky Award
Hart: Gordie Howe Award
Frank Selke: Patrice Bergeron Award
Calder: Teemu Selanne Award
Vezina: Vladislav Tretiak Award
Jennings: Dominick Hasek Award
Norris: Orr-Lidstrom Award

After all this you want the vezina to be someone who never played in the league. What?!?!

 

[Megustaelhockey]

I would love for my team to win the Crypto.com Car Rental Cup brought to you by Dave & Busters.

 

[Mack a doodle doo]

The NBA I Sooo corny for renaming their trophies this year, nobody was forgetting about Jordan, Baird or Magic. Just another publicity stunt to capitalize on the new trend of shitting on history/tradition

 

[ps241]

I'm open minded on this and will respond to them individually.




Conn Smythe was an asshole on a lot of levels, but this is a weak premise for changing the name of the trophy. Presumably this complaint comes from his famous quote about wishing Herb Carnegie were white so he could be signed to a contract -- at a time when nobody else would sign Carnegie either. Smythe simply pointed to the root of the problem in such a way as to be quoted about it later. There are plenty of things to hate about this guy, but he was not some slave owner or Klan member. And he was a figure actually worthy of remembrance from a hockey standpoint. Keeping this one is perfectly fine.



Art Ross was more than "an innovator", he was one of the most influential figures in hockey history. He was also one of the best hockey players in the world before the NHL existed, and went on to coach in the NHL for 20 years. It's laughable to suggest that his NHL scoring record should be the thing we think about when we think of Art Ross. Of all the people on this list, he is probably top-3 in terms of deserving it.



This one has some merit. Norris has a trophy named after him because his money bankrolled the early NHL and his family went on to run the league from the inside out like a syndicate. He is not a figure who needs a trophy named after him. Changing it would be no major loss.



The Hart was actually named after Cecil's father, who donated it. David Hart is not even close to being a trophy-worthy name in the history of the league. Even Cecil is just a footnote. People would lose their minds because of the break with tradition, but it would be justifiable to move on from this one.



Agreed, and it should specifically be on the one awarded by the NHLPA.



No, he played in over 200 games over 9 seasons. He was the first great goalie in the league and had a tragic story. There's no reason to change this.



Which is fair enough, no reason to change this one.



That's pretty much the entire case for him. He was iconic as the first President. There have been more deserving figures, but there's nothing saying Calder doesn't deserve it.



Indeed, and he's an important figure, but Selke is a weak one. He knew the right people and GM'ed the right organization. Good guy, important to a certain point, but not someone who needs a trophy named after him.



This one is absurd and the low-hanging fruit if we're going to change something. Naming the trophy after him was basically a retirement gift from his golfing buddies. There is zero reason to name a trophy after an otherwise unremarkable team president.



Agreed.


Based on the above, I would suggest the following:

James Norris -> Bobby Orr (and do it before he dies, damn it)
Hart Memorial -> Wayne Gretzky
Frank Selke -> Gordie Howe
William Jennings -> Simply decommission it and leave it blank for future use.

Very well thought out, respectful, detailed post that advances the topic and brings up some meaningful points. Thank you.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

You want to rename stuff, but then say the Vezina should be named after Tretiak who played 0 NHL games, while Hasek gets the Jennings which is a team award, not a goalie award? Also you can't rename an award for a guy still playing in the league. Also, pretty sure that Bob Gainey was considered one of the best defensive forwards, so I doubt Bergeron would get it.

Don't disagree with a number of others, but these two are weird.

After all this you want the vezina to be someone who never played in the league. What?!?!

Everybody is up and arms about that lol.

To me, Tretiak is one of the greatest goalies of all time. Some of the greatest goalies either went to Tretiak’s goalie school or idolized his game. It was a bit of long shot suggestion because I’m a fan of his career and what could’ve been if not for the iron curtain. He’s a guy who put up a .947 sv% against the best players in the world it’s not like he didn’t play against NHLers.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

I just woke.

How long has this thread been woke?

Who here is woke?

I think this is a bit of a narrow mindset. I know people are sensitive to anything they perceive to be “woke” because they find it annoying. But, my post really isn’t about demonizing people for their past other than Constantine Smythe who’s words and actions are in direct conflict with what the NHL is trying to be today.

The true point of the post was to say “The awards should be named after the great players rather than executives who never played”. That’s not woke. That’s pro-player and pro-worker.

 

[Weztex]

To suggest that the Norris isn't primarily based on offense is disingenuous at best. Since 2000 it has gone to the first or second highest scorer 17 times. The only exceptions are 3rd, 5th, 5th, 9th and 12th. Pretty heavily skewed.....

Seriously if Vegas would give odds whereby I could pick what position (rather than a name) in scoring would yield the Norris winner I'd be filthy rich. Just pick 1 and 2.

The claim was that the Norris was the Art Ross for defensemen and it's just factually not close to be true. The fact that the 2nd scorer sometimes wins it changes nothing about it. Being 2nd doesn't automatically means that you're close to the first either. Since 1999-00, 6 of them were more that 10 points behind the leader. And when your exception makes up 25% of the winners, it's not an exception anymore.

Given the trophy's definition (''presented annually to the defenseman who demonstrates the greatest all-around ability in his position'') it's expected that a good chuck of the winners figured among the league's best when it comes to offensive production. That's like complaining that the Vezina is skewed because the winners are generally among the top goalies in GAA.

I'd understand the criticism if guys like Green, Visnovsky, Yandle and Carlson had won it, but no. Instead it went to future first ballot hall of famers like Chara, Lidstrom, Hedman or Josi. I have a hard time being outraged.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

I think this is a bit of a narrow mindset. I know people are sensitive to anything they perceive to be “woke” because they find it annoying. But, my post really isn’t about demonizing people for their past other than Constantine Smythe who’s words and actions are in direct conflict with what the NHL is trying to be today.

The true point of the post was to say “The awards should be named after the great players rather than executives who never played”. That’s not woke. That’s pro-player and pro-worker.

Well I agree. My first post wasn't so cool. I do care about social justice and other human beings. I do care for equal rights too.

_____

Now I'm going to shift gears completely.

I can't stand anything Marek and Friedman say or do. The two of them have geeked out, polluted, and made anything to do with hockey entertainment extremely boring. They both are ego-maniacal and tone deaf. They've ruined almost anything theyve touched when it comes to the NHL.

 

[3074326]

The NBA I Sooo corny for renaming their trophies this year, nobody was forgetting about Jordan, Baird or Magic. Just another publicity stunt to capitalize on the new trend of shitting on history/tradition

Shitting on tradition? lol. So dramatic and emotional.

The NBA is marketing better than we have ever seen the NHL market. There is an 8 page thread because of something the NBA did. There’s your proof.

I don’t care what happens with the trophy names. Get the racist folks out, that would be cool. Beyond that.. I don’t care.

I do love how upset NHL fans are at the NBA changing it’s trophy names. Holy smokes some of you guys are so sensitive.

What are you referring to when you mention a trend about shitting on tradition, anyways? Specifically, what’s the trend. Getting rid of statues you never looked at in the first place?

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

The claim was that the Norris was the Art Ross for defensemen and it's just factually not close to be true. The fact that the 2nd scorer sometimes wins it changes nothing about it. Being 2nd doesn't automatically means that you're close to the first either. Since 1999-00, 6 of them were more that 10 points behind the leader. And when you're exception makes up 25% of the winners, it's not an exception anymore.

Given the trophy's definition (''presented annually to the defenseman who demonstrates the greatest all-around ability in his position'') it's expected that a good chuck of the winners figured among the league's best when it comes to offensive production. That's like complaining that the Vezina is skewed because the winners are generally among the top goalies in GAA.

I'd understand the criticism if guys like Green, Visnovsky, Yandle and Carlson had won it, but no. Instead it went to future first ballot hall of famers like Chara, Lidstrom, Hedman or Josi. I have a hard time being outraged.

Do you suppose they meant that literally? Again, I would likely be a billionaire if I could simply bet 1-2 in points wins Norris. Ergo, many words for something incredibly predictable.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

No

 

[Mister Ed]

Let's add some awards :

Most shorthanded goals - The Mario Lemieux Trophy. He had 13 SHG in 88-89.
Most saves in a season - The Gump Worsley Award. He had 2376 saves in 70 games in 55-56.
Most shootout goals in a season - The Ilya Kovalchuk Award. He had 11 shootout goals in 2011-12.

 

[Weztex]

Everybody is up and arms about that lol.

To me, Tretiak is one of the greatest goalies of all time. Some of the greatest goalies either went to Tretiak’s goalie school or idolized his game. It was a bit of long shot suggestion because I’m a fan of his career and what could’ve been if not for the iron curtain. He’s a guy who put up a .947 sv% against the best players in the world it’s not like he didn’t play against NHLers.

Nobody has a problem with Tretiak. He's one the greatest goalie ever. But the Vezina is probably the most appropriate name of them all and you'd strip it for a player who doesn't tick your initial box. Also reducing Veinza's career and impact to 88 games (which is incorrect) is a pretty convincing argument as to why some of those names must not fall out of common usage.

Do you suppose they meant that literally? Again, I would likely be a billionaire if I could simply bet 1-2 in points wins Norris. Ergo, many words for something incredibly predictable.

No. But implying that something that hasn't happened in the last 5 seasons, and happens barely 33% of the time nowadays (and is bound to happen anyway) is some kind of crazy regular occurence is silly enough to be pointed out.

 

[WaitingForThatCab]

They should just sell the naming rights every 5 years like everything else. It’s already turned into a clown show league.

Colgate award
Ronald McDonald award
Monsanto award
Nike award

Think of the $$$ to be made!

Funny enough, my thought upon seeing this thread was that we're maybe five years away from 'The Lady Byng trophy presented by Colgate.' And then another five to ten years away from it just being the Colgate trophy.

 

[IamNotADancer]

Why? I think the players rather than executives deserve the awards named after them.

Might as well change the Stanley Cup's name. Why not go all the way.

I'm very progressive and not a traditionalist at all, but the inherent need to constantly change things is becoming out of hand and quite frankly silly.

 

[Diglett]

Leave the Superstar Name Here Award to the junior leagues.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

No. But implying that something that hasn't happened in the last 5 seasons, and happens barely 33% of the time nowadays (and is bound to happen anyway) is some kind of crazy regular occurence is silly enough to be pointed out.

Heck Vegas aside, I’d be willing to make annual bets with you that I can predict where the Norris winner will come from based on points position. Anything with an 80% success rate works for me.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Isnt time to change the name of the Stanley Cup? as well? Why? The same reason all those statues of John A Macdonald got torn down. Unlike the current Governor Generals. Lord Stanley actually had power.

 

[Alicat]

They need to add an award for offensive defenseman.