I am not oblivious to the amount of Canadians that are missing each year. Just from a journalistic standpoint, Canada isn't the only team effected. But still no disagreement with you. I am just as disappointed as you at how we could have a player with already a full year of NHL experience every year and in this year's case, a possible future Norris-winning defenseman on top of it.
Inexperience led to team USA's demise
- Thread starter ATBLeafsTyler
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I am not oblivious to the amount of Canadians that are missing each year. Just from a journalistic standpoint, Canada isn't the only team effected. But still no disagreement with you. I am just as disappointed as you at how we could have a player with already a full year of NHL experience every year and in this year's case, a possible future Norris-winning defenseman on top of it.
AD1066
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- Sep 30, 2011
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You seem take anything to do with USA Hockey really personally, just let it go dude.
WarriorofTime
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Wrong but nice try. Last year's Champs didn't have maata or barkov. I could go through all the other countries that have had teenage nhl players not avaliable over the years but you don't care and just want to make fun of some American hockey teenagers.
joe89
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- Apr 30, 2009
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It's easy to point to age when you don't execute your game plan. Experience is never a bad thing, but it's not always tipping the scales either. To me, the american in-game coaching faltered in this tournament. It was too rigid and short tournaments rarely allows passivity and hoping things will just work out.
Both USA and Sweden can return 12 players next year, so USA's not in a unique situation.
Fasching was named a top3 player on the US team by the coaches for the second year in a row so that seems a little unfair, even if your overall point probably still stands.
Both USA and Sweden can return 12 players next year, so USA's not in a unique situation.
Fasching was named a top3 player on the US team by the coaches for the second year in a row so that seems a little unfair, even if your overall point probably still stands.
Rabid Ranger
2 is better than one
KevyD has a hard on for USA Hockey. Nothing new. I maintain that this team had a lot of talent but didn't come together in pivotal moments. Not the first team to have that happen to in this tournament through the years.
New User Name
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We (Canadians) should know about excuses. We don't take a backseat to anyone in making them.
I never saw the US team being endlessly bragged about.
I'm going out on a limb here and say that if the US and Russia played a 10 game series; the US would win at least 7 of the games.
They IMO outplayed the Russians, just didn't win. We (Canada) have been down that road a few times.
Never heard or saw in print any one saying this years US team was a dream team.
I recognize that the US has an advantage at the under 17 and under 18 and yes, even at the under 20. My understanding is that money flows from the NHL to USAhockey and in numbers we'll never know about.
I have been vocal about all that BUT come on kevy, it seems you have an unnatural hate for them. Kind of sad really.
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BobDobolina
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Me neither. But I think we all know KevyD has a special place in his heart for USA hockey. We love you too, Kevy.
Rob
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TheFinalWord
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- Apr 25, 2005
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Miles Wood
I am just curious what is the deal with Miles Wood, he was drafted by the Devils two years ago and since then remained playing at the high school prep level for two seasons. There was talk of him going to Boston College this year but did not. Looks like he will make his. NCAA debut at 20 years old next fall. There has to be a story here? Anyone know or care to speculate?
I am just curious what is the deal with Miles Wood, he was drafted by the Devils two years ago and since then remained playing at the high school prep level for two seasons. There was talk of him going to Boston College this year but did not. Looks like he will make his. NCAA debut at 20 years old next fall. There has to be a story here? Anyone know or care to speculate?
Demko doesn't impress me at all.
He looks a lot smaller than advertised.
Eichel didn't stand out as some future NHL star IMO.
I blame US Hockey.
They failed to put together the right combination of players.
All they did was assemble a collection of College stars and high draft picks.
No grit or grunts.
They could have learned a lot from Herb Brooks.
Way too many chiefs.
He looks a lot smaller than advertised.
Eichel didn't stand out as some future NHL star IMO.
I blame US Hockey.
They failed to put together the right combination of players.
All they did was assemble a collection of College stars and high draft picks.
No grit or grunts.
They could have learned a lot from Herb Brooks.
Way too many chiefs.
IMO the US team was very young, suffered from a lack of chemistry, a coaching staff that couldn't make adjustments as the tournament went on (a pretty horrid PP), an over-reliance on Eichel and obviously a lack of discipline against the Russians.
For a player in his draft year Eichel showed off some serious skill. I don't know how you could watch him and not feel he is going to be a star in the NHL. He struggled at times to point up the points and tried to do too much at times but a lot of times he looked to be the best player on the ice despite being one of the youngest players in the tournament. If you don't think Eichel looks like a star based on his performance in his draft year I'm not sure what you thought after watching MacKinnon, Drouin or other under-agers.
We've won this tourney smthg like 15 times. So it would seem that losing is a long way from a forgone conclusion...Still if,IF things don’t go according to Hoyle...I’ll go way, way out on a limb & say goal tending, that and player selection, as per usual. Our braintrust has done a better job of the latter this year. But some will question defensive specialist Gauthier’s inclusion, even though he’s a returnee, and even though he’s done everything expected of him. Outside of the top 2 pairings, probably be some second guessing about the D as well.
Course we could always take a page from some of our American cousins ( to be fair, Swedes in 2009 were way worse ) and blame the refs
What led to there demise was starting Demko who stinks instead of Halverson who is a superior goaltending talent.
1Gold Standard
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from what I gather, USAHockey has 1 vocal critic and detractor (Kevy) and 1 or 2 naysayers... in fairness, Hockey Canada has 50 x that number coming from all over the globe and from all different directions. Hell, even I'm a critic of Hockey Canada, just not the players, only the idiots in charge. It comes with the territory...better get use to it.
Tut Tut...questioning player selection, both beforehand & in hindsight, is a longstanding Canuck tradition. Likewise critiquing individual performances, levels of maturity, yadda yadda, is fair game. Historically, you hockey writer’s/ media – with memories like elephants – comprise some of TC’s harshest critics ( remember Piestany? ). So better get used to a taste of ur own medicine, cause this too comes with the territory, oh sanctimonious one
1Gold Standard
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Tut Tut...questioning player selection, both beforehand & in hindsight, is a longstanding Canuck tradition. Likewise critiquing individual performances, levels of maturity, yadda yadda, is fair game. Historically, you hockey writer’s/ media – with memories like elephants – comprise some of TC’s harshest critics ( remember Piestany? ). So better get used to a taste of ur own medicine, cause this too comes with the territory, oh sanctimonious one
I don't know what the hell you are talking about...
The same idiots are in charge this year as last.. they didn't get all of a sudden smart in my book just because we are 1 of 4 still standing and in a good position to end the drought. Still a lot of hockey to be played before that happens.
critiquing individual performances, levels of maturity, yadda yadda, is fair game????? that's not me.
you hockey writer’s/ media? Are you suggesting I'm part of the media horde? That's hilarious. I only wish the media would be more critical of HC.
And I don't criticize players. My harshest criticism of players is, "I don't think (insert name) is a NT player, not now or ever." "so and so is a poor skater etc etc." "It was a dumb move to not have an open competition for a #1 starting goaltender at selection camp. It was a dumb move to name only 2 goaltenders to the roster when you can name 3...
What was my position on Piestany...oh Mr. Enlightened One, please tell us all...and you better get right
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Drat, tried for 15 min, to answer u. Damn page kept hanging up, might be my AV/ pop-up blocker ...made myself late too
***
Mr Writer
Overall, I thought they did a better job of player selection this year. Gauthier aside, every forward they picked can snipe, quick team. etc They’ve gotten further away from the notion that we just gotta have those role player/ those defensive specialists, that cookie cutter mentality. Two scoring lines, one checking, one energy line...that sort of thing. Seems even HC can learn from its mistakes. .
Hmmm. Some might construe that as player criticism, however indirect, however constructive, You say tomayto , I say tomahto
First off, I’m feel no undue pressure to be right, politically correct, yadda yadda...& its not my fault , that I so often am
Second...Seems U misconstrued me, Mr Writer . I was using the u collectively. As in, generally speaking, u hockey writers never forget, and historically ( as in the Piestany punchup, when our boyz took a lot of flak from media ) u hockey writers/media have been some of TC’s harshest critics. Get it ?
You took it personally Mr. Writer...Well what can I tell u? ...for those in the spot light, everybody and his brother's a critic...Like u said, Comes with the territory
Again to each...To me, its par for the course.
Last year Nurse and Domi were deemed not ready. This year, in conversations with media ( paraphrasing ) they marveled at how much Domi had matured as a player, in the past year, and asked him to comment on this. But how much of this so called maturity was really Domi/ Nurse? And how much of it was simply false impressions last year, on the part of HC/media?
Never said u were mainstream kemosabey...BUT....u call urself Mr. Writer + u write about hockey...do the math
***
Mr Writer
Overall, I thought they did a better job of player selection this year. Gauthier aside, every forward they picked can snipe, quick team. etc They’ve gotten further away from the notion that we just gotta have those role player/ those defensive specialists, that cookie cutter mentality. Two scoring lines, one checking, one energy line...that sort of thing. Seems even HC can learn from its mistakes. .
Hmmm. Some might construe that as player criticism, however indirect, however constructive, You say tomayto , I say tomahto
First off, I’m feel no undue pressure to be right, politically correct, yadda yadda...& its not my fault , that I so often am
Second...Seems U misconstrued me, Mr Writer . I was using the u collectively. As in, generally speaking, u hockey writers never forget, and historically ( as in the Piestany punchup, when our boyz took a lot of flak from media ) u hockey writers/media have been some of TC’s harshest critics. Get it ?
You took it personally Mr. Writer...Well what can I tell u? ...for those in the spot light, everybody and his brother's a critic...Like u said, Comes with the territory
Again to each...To me, its par for the course.
Last year Nurse and Domi were deemed not ready. This year, in conversations with media ( paraphrasing ) they marveled at how much Domi had matured as a player, in the past year, and asked him to comment on this. But how much of this so called maturity was really Domi/ Nurse? And how much of it was simply false impressions last year, on the part of HC/media?
.
Never said u were mainstream kemosabey...BUT....u call urself Mr. Writer + u write about hockey...do the math
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1Gold Standard
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Drat, tried for 15 min, to answer u. Damn page kept hanging up, might be my AV/ pop-up blocker ...made myself late too
***
Mr Writer
Overall, I thought they did a better job of player selection this year. Gauthier aside, every forward they picked can snipe, quick team. etc They’ve gotten further away from the notion that we just gotta have those role player/ those defensive specialists, that cookie cutter mentality. Two scoring lines, one checking, one energy line...that sort of thing. Seems even HC can learn from its mistakes. .
Hmmm. Some might construe that as player criticism, however indirect, however constructive, You say tomayto , I say tomahto
First off, I’m feel no undue pressure to be right, politically correct, yadda yadda...& its not my fault , that I so often am
Second...Seems U misconstrued me, Mr Writer . I was using the u collectively. As in, generally speaking, u hockey writers never forget, and historically ( as in the Piestany punchup, when our boyz took a lot of flak from media ) u hockey writers/media have been some of TC’s harshest critics. Get it ?
You took it personally Mr. Writer...Well what can I tell u? ...for those in the spot light, everybody and his brother's a critic...Like u said, Comes with the territory
I would agree with the bolded part BUT it remains to be seen if the idiots at HC had a come to Jesus moment and now see the light as to how a NT should be put together...As I've said for more than 2 years now, this group of 1995 players is as skilled and as deep as we have had since the 1985 group. Lets see what Salmond and Co come up with next year with the 1996 group (a group that I would rate as only slightly better than average) if they truly have had an epiphany or will they revert back to their dumb dumb position.
stating the obvious re: players is not criticism. Corry Perry is a lousy skater is a statement of fact. Yes, a year before the Olympics I would not have selected him on the team, did not want him on the team. Getzlaf and Perry are not 2 of my favorite players, but they were in good form and productive leading up to Olympic selection and I would have selected them to the team. I don't let my NHL bias influence National Team roster decisions.
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JackSlater
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- Apr 27, 2010
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I don't think that inexperience lead to USA's loss. For all the hype about the forwards (from TSN and many posters on here) the depth was not great, and neither was the top end talent. Guys like Wood, Motte or Louis looked pretty useless. It was hyped like this team was filled with top 10 picks at forward, and it just wasn't true. The roster doesn't seem that talented to me. They could skate, but creativity was highly lacking. Trying to beat players outside with speed repeatedly isn't the best strategy.
Probably the bigger issue was the coach. He never seemed to change things, even when it was obviously needed. It isn't even an experience issue given his history with USA Hockey. I am still stunned that he put out two forwards to kill a 5 - 3 against Russia.
It's important to keep in mind that USA still outplayed Russia in that game, so in spite of a few issues they were still a dangerous team. Sometimes things just don't break the right way.
Probably the bigger issue was the coach. He never seemed to change things, even when it was obviously needed. It isn't even an experience issue given his history with USA Hockey. I am still stunned that he put out two forwards to kill a 5 - 3 against Russia.
It's important to keep in mind that USA still outplayed Russia in that game, so in spite of a few issues they were still a dangerous team. Sometimes things just don't break the right way.
1Gold Standard
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you are right..as always, Jack. I'm disappointed only because it blows holes in my skill trumps age argument. I was hoping that the U.S. would prove that young but skilled team wins out over a team of marginally skilled 19 year olds ... in the end perhaps the U.S. team wasn't the uber skilled team TSN + others (me) believed them to be.
Maybe so, but it's not always cut and dried. For example, when we talk about all time great skaters, the name Fedorov often gets mentioned, whereas the name Gretzky does not. BUT Gretzky had probably the shortest turning radius in NHL history. And I saw him , with the puck, literally skate circles around a young Fedorov, in a Canada Cup game, turning him this way and that, till Fedorov fell flat on his butt, and headed shame faced to the bench, with a look of total exasperation, as it to say, I don't wanna do this anymore, I can't shadow this guy...
Anyway, when media, HC, scouts etc talk about mental makeup, emotional maturity, hockey smarts, whether a player is error prone, prone to taking undisciplined penalties, prone to letting in that soft goal, at the most inopportune times, yadda yadda, many of those impressions may be more subjective than factual, that is to say, more a matter of group think. Don't u think?
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