Ireland doesn't have a rink in the country (excluding Belfast, which is Northern Ireland). South Africa has 5 and has been an IIHF member since 1937. It's hard to move up the ranking when there is literally nowhere in the country to play.
IIHF World Rankings
- Thread starter Golden Jet
- Start date
Ireland doesn't have a rink in the country (excluding Belfast, which is Northern Ireland). South Africa has 5 and has been an IIHF member since 1937. It's hard to move up the ranking when there is literally nowhere in the country to play.
I wasn't trying to argue that WC rosters of any country have been as good as their olympic rosters. Just pointing out the inaccuracy of claiming that Canada often has swiss league players when they haven't had one in 8 years.
That is truly mystifying.http://www.iihf.com/en/home-of-hockey/championships/world-ranking/mens-world-ranking/2014-ranking-feb.html
According to the updated rankings, we're still only the 3rd best hockey country. Laughable.
Oh I know, I was just echoing the Pro-Canada sentiment and applying it to different countries.
Basically if the third best team in the world wins gold at the Olympics more times than not, let us be third!
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
And like I said, you weren't wrong, just splitting hairs because the careers of some of the names the other poster was obviously thinking about (Kwiatkowski, Murphy, Scalzo, Harrison) took them to the Swiss league slightly before/after those WCs. Surely the turnover between WC and Olympic rosters is evident to everyone.
The 4 players that carried over for Canada rode the pine for the most part (Duchene, Hamuis, Subban) or were replaced due to injury (Stamkos). Only 3 Americans carried over (Faulk, Oshie, Stastny). Then there's the gap:
9 Swedes carried over (Enroth, Gustafsson, Edler, Kronwall, Tallinder, Ericsson, Eriksson, Landeskog, Sedin). 9 Finns carried over (Hietanen, Kukkonen, Lepisto, Vaananen, Aaltonen, Granlund, Kontiola, Korpikoski, Salminen). And I think 12 Russians carried over (Varly, Belov, Medvedev, Nikulin, Tyutin, Anisimov, Kovalchuk, Ovechkin, Popov, Radulov, Svitov, Tereshenko), which is why they were considered dangerous on home ice. You can judge how much impact those groups had relative to each other in the Olympics for yourself.
The WCs teams are typically barely able to be considered B or C teams when it comes to Canada/US, and if chemistry is as important as we're supposed to believe, you can see who was expected to have any kind of "not just on paper" advantage this year, too.
Again, lots of people play in Switzerland at some point in their careers. Duchene played there too so might as well count him. Metropolit also played in the NHL after 2006 so he could count as an NHL player by the same token. It's inaccurate to make it seem like the WC rosters of Canada have been composed of non-NHL players in any great part because they haven't been. That's all I was saying. The rest you seem to be reading into what I said. Haven't claimed anything about turnover between WC and Olympics.
Really? 13 players on Canada's WCH team 2013 were born 1988 and earlier. 10 players were born 1989 and later.
It is what it is, why get mad about it. They can't base their rankings on the hypothetical "if Canada sent their best players to every tournament".
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
Really? 13 players on Canada's WCH team 2013 were born 1988 and earlier. 10 players were born 1989 and later.
Yeah, now look at who they were, and start with the 3 goalies (none of whom play for the Olympic team, obviously). It's like the guy said: young hopefuls, and B-team level (if they're lucky) veterans sprinkled in.
hitmen19
Registered User
- Jan 21, 2013
- 823
- 1
I don't know why anybody cares what the ranking is to be honest. Has anybody that is complaining even looked in the last ten years once at iihf website to see what the rankings were. I for one never needed to look to see where Canada stood, and would not have even known or cared that they had Canada at 3.
im sure Sweden would gladly switch positions if the outcome was switched today
im sure Sweden would gladly switch positions if the outcome was switched today
He said FEW veterans which is completely wrong. More than half part of the team were veterans.
Among your so called young hopefuls that were born later than 1989 we have Stamkos, Subban and Duchene. How are they young HOPEFULS?????????
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
He said FEW veterans which is completely wrong. More than half part of the team were veterans.
Among your so called young hopefuls that were born later than 1989 we have Stamkos, Subban and Duchene. How are they young HOPEFULS?????????
If you're <25 and on an RFA contract in the NHL, you're young. And if it's your first time representing Canada internationally against professionals, you're a "hopeful".
I think Hockey Canada does what everybody else does. They send who they can get. If Crosby is willing and able to go some year they say great let's buy him a ticket. If not they go for the next guy and then the next guy. The only difference is that European players are much less likely to decline an invite.
The tournament is what it is. It's not the biggest title in international hockey but it's not the practice tournament for amateurs scrubs and juniors either like some Canadians want to make believe. If you're competing in it you try to do as well as possible. If you don't care about it, then don't send a team. Or at least if you send a token team just to mail it in then it's the height of absurdity to whine about rankings based on the results of said tournament.
MMANumminen
Registered User
It's easier than ever to rank the countries atm
1. Canada
2. Sweden
3. Finland
4. USA
5. Russija
6. Czechk Rep.
7. Switzerland
8. Slovakia
9. Latvia
10. Norway
1. Canada
2. Sweden
3. Finland
4. USA
5. Russija
6. Czechk Rep.
7. Switzerland
8. Slovakia
9. Latvia
10. Norway
If you're <25 and on an RFA contract in the NHL, you're young. And if it's your first time representing Canada internationally against professionals, you're a "hopeful".
Damn then the swedish gold medal team had many hopefuls both veterans and young. 15 players were from clubs in Europe and they wouldn't have big chance to make the olympic team.
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
Kind of, but realize that pretty much no one from an NHL playoff team ever plays in them, and less than a handful of players typically carry over onto the Olympic squads when it comes to Canada/USA.
Feel free to compare Canadian and American rosters between WC and the Olympics if you like, but as far as we're concerned our WC rosters rarely resemble as much as a "B" team. There's also a reason why there's such drama over here about Olympic team selection, but most of the best "established vets" prefer rest to representing Canada/US internationally at the WCs in between (and relatively few of those you see on our WC rosters even get invited to Olympic selection camp, either).
Spinkis
Registered User
- Dec 26, 2011
- 1,232
- 1
This.
IIHF can't base their rankings on wether or not Canada believes a tournament is meaningful. If you want to be ranked higher, play better at the WC. And every other of the top teams have players in the playoff, Sweden hasn't been helped by the red wings 20 years in the playoff.
Nobody is under any illusion that the WC has been equivalent to the Olympics in quality of players participating since 1998. It's just that there are quite a few steps between that and being "meaningless" or "a joke" or "nobody cares" or whatever other hyperbole Canadians seem to use frequently.
Olympics really should be weighed at a factor of 2x. But even then, after I punched in some quick math, Sweden is still supposedly the #1 country while Canada moves ahead of Finland and the US ahead of Russia, Latvia ahead of Norway and Slovenia getting a huge bump:
1. Sweden
2. Canada
3. Finland
4. Russia
5. United States
6. Czech Republic
7. Switzerland
8. Slovakia
9. Latvia
10. Norway
11. Germany
12. Slovenia
13. Austria
14. Belarus
15. France
16. Denmark
Rankings are necessary for seeding so they have some value. It's the same with FIFA - no one really takes them as a serious way to gauge how strong the teams are, but they are used in practice.
But as mentioned in this thread, it does show Canada does not have the ability to send B/C/D teams and dominate a tournament as some fans claim. Canada's hypothetical B and C teams at the WCs haven't even medaled in the last four years.
1. Sweden
2. Canada
3. Finland
4. Russia
5. United States
6. Czech Republic
7. Switzerland
8. Slovakia
9. Latvia
10. Norway
11. Germany
12. Slovenia
13. Austria
14. Belarus
15. France
16. Denmark
Rankings are necessary for seeding so they have some value. It's the same with FIFA - no one really takes them as a serious way to gauge how strong the teams are, but they are used in practice.
But as mentioned in this thread, it does show Canada does not have the ability to send B/C/D teams and dominate a tournament as some fans claim. Canada's hypothetical B and C teams at the WCs haven't even medaled in the last four years.
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
Well, feel free to make as much or as little as you want of the World Championships, as long as you realize that 6 different teams have finished higher than Finland over the most recent two, and Canada isn't even one of them.
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
First of all, Canada only has two losses total from the round robin portion of the last two WCs combined, and lost to a team from the gold medal game in round 1 of the elimination stage both times. Secondly, it would be easy enough to put down at least 2 Canadian teams from all possible players that would look better overall (on paper at the very least) without selecting a single person from either WC roster.
Yup, pretty dissapointing results for us in the past 2 years, especially considering they were both partly home tournaments. Anyway this Olympic bronze takes a lot of that dissapointment away. Even us Finns know to appreciate it more than WC medals.
Anyway I hope to see a lot of young guys like Teräväinen in this years WC because I doubt a lot of the Olympic players have enough energy or interest to participate. Might see some of those juniors and minor leaguers in Canada's roster this time around too because of that. Personally I don't think they should hold the WC in Olympic years (which was the practice before 1992), but at least it should be an interesting tournament.
Yup, it's just mind-boggling how people in Canada/North America aren't capable of understanding the concept of a 'world ranking'.
Can you imagine, say, the Spanish national team in football sending their C team to the World Cup and whining about how they've dropped in the rankings after the tournament?
It's like they're living in a bubble.
Yeah, Canada sends it's b or c level teams to the World Champs, everyone knows that. But I've heard that Canada's b team would've won the Olympics too, so why don't they win the WC's every time? 
Just joking around, don't get mad at me. 
On topic: It's certainly odd to see the best hockey country in the world third in the rankings, but who cares about the rankings that much anyways? I don't at least.
Just joking around, don't get mad at me. On topic: It's certainly odd to see the best hockey country in the world third in the rankings, but who cares about the rankings that much anyways? I don't at least.
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