Speculation: IF the Leafs don’t look legit

[hfman]

In a scenario where the Leafs do not look like a true contender on the ice and place third in the Atlantic, do you keep Tavares and Marner as own rentals or trade them away?

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[EK392000]

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I’m not asking if they should be traded in general. We all know how fans feel about that.

I’m asking whether fans would want to keep them as own rentals even if this Leafs team doesn’t look like serious contenders. The alternative is we ask them to waive their NMCs (which happens from time to time) and we trade them for a deadline-type return (first round pick+).

As an own rental, we ice a better team and get a kick at the can, even if it’s not a great kick. We sell them and we don’t go deep in the playoffs (probably won’t anyway) and we get a couple firsts.

 

[Confucius]

Obviously or you wouldn't have posted what you did.

Well by all means tell me how many they sell?

 

[Nineteen67]

It's pretty clear to me that their so called "talent" is not very good. To lose playoff games on base running errors, being picked off at 2nd, etc. is just an example. You never saw garbage like that when TOR won their two World Series Championships. Even an average player like Candy Maldonado knew how to hit a sacrifice fly.

But that throw….

 

[Nineteen67]

I’m not asking if they should be traded in general. We all know how fans feel about that.

I’m asking whether fans would want to keep them as own rentals even if this Leafs team doesn’t look like serious contenders. The alternative is we ask them to waive their NMCs (which happens from time to time) and we trade them for a deadline-type return (first round pick+).

As an own rental, we ice a better team and get a kick at the can, even if it’s not a great kick. We sell them and we don’t go deep in the playoffs (probably won’t anyway) and we get a couple firsts.

It’s a valid question.

The core has failed almost every single test that’s been put in front of them (vasi going freddy got them one passing grade) so if it looks like they’re unprepared again, its something they should consider.

 

[ACC1224]

Well by all means tell me how many they sell?

More than 20

 

[REALTALK81]

Being nominated for an award and losing is kinda like making the playoffs and flaming out first round……yes

I would rather be nominated and flame out in the first than to not have either experience. Just my two cents.

If

You said you would offer him a contract and Tavares a reduced contract, hence my saying so run it back again and again and again til they retire because thats what your effectively saying.

If Tavares comes in at a lower cost, it gives more room to bring someone else in to fill the team out. If the cap raises, it offers even more room. None of the core 4 are bad players. Tavares just doesn't perform as well as the others and could use those savings for another solid player.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

In the big picture I blame all 3. Marner just happens to be the odd man out if they move one. Trust me, I think both the latest Matthews and Nylander contracts suck and an are undeserved because they have won squat in the playoffs to deserve them.

BuT We'RE JusT BLamINg maRnEr!

Why do people refuse to accept the existence of NMCs?
I am exhausted with this shit quite honestly.

Excuses are for losers.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

I'm not sure it is clear that there hasn't been any deals out there.... I just don't think they are pursuing it very hard, if at all.. Berube wants a chance to coach this group.

Arrogance has got many a coach fired.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

More than 20

Are you behind the cash register?

 

[Sypher04]

I'm not sure it is clear that there hasn't been any deals out there.... I just don't think they are pursuing it very hard, if at all.. Berube wants a chance to coach this group.

Makes sense too. If I’m Berube I’d want Marner on my club as well until whatever point he proves to me he won’t or can’t do what I ask of him. If that doesn’t happen, my club is better for it.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

You didn't find Matthews scoring 69 goals the least bit entertaining?

Nope. It means eff all.

 

[Sypher04]

Nope. It means eff all.

Go outside then. Touch grass.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

The "I will believe it when I see it" mantra should be put on t-shirts. It encapsulates exactly what fans believe of this team, entirely the fault of their own (Dubas worst decisions were those RFA contracts).

Hayes has cemented himself as a true fan and analyst by having the courage to call it out. It lends credit to an industry which increasingly fans think is just a love-fest for the team.

The only way this Leaf team wins is if the metrics they care about are decline sharply. This means noone (meaning far fewer of course) is buying Leaf mugs, caps or jerseys. No one reacts to their twitter posts. No one clicks on the links to their stories, fewer tune in to their games etc. There will be a point where a kid will say "why did you buy me this Leafs cap?"

They will continue to make ticket revenue because of the corporations. However, if interest declines, the corporations might be able to negotiate better terms for their ads. Ditto for their T.V deals which is more difficult to see a loss in revenue because of the high demand and low supply of games but the Rogers overpayment confirmed that networks need to proceed with caution, you can overpay for the rights.

Ultimately though, the Leafs own hubris, started by Ballard really; has ensured a lack of true leadership in management. In military terms, we lack our George Patton who demands success over marketing.

BINGO!

 

[Aashir Mallik]

Makes sense too. If I’m Berube I’d want Marner on my club as well until whatever point he proves to me he won’t or can’t do what I ask of him. If that doesn’t happen, my club is better for it.

That’s fine from a coaches perspective, but I don’t understand how the organization gets two of the same excuses

First it was Brad, he gets a year to examine the players and see what he/the core can do with him. They failed, Marner failed so it should’ve been the end of the examination

Now Berube gets another look at them for the same reasons as Brad

Then what next year the new president of hockey ops gets to look at Marner with his new extension to see if he fits the mood of his team?

I get wanting to see what a player can do in a different circumstance, but at some point you have to accept it’s just not working out

 

[Nineteen67]

Nope. It means eff all.

Once HS baseball got going in Feb I watched a lot fewer Leafs games.

Berube better get them going and keep them at least interesting. They have another unique Saturday night schedule this year, with almost half the games on the road and against some iffy opponents, so they don’t need people tuning out on thier biggest night of the week.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

The "I will believe it when I see it" mantra should be put on t-shirts. It encapsulates exactly what fans believe of this team, entirely the fault of their own (Dubas worst decisions were those RFA contracts).

Hayes has cemented himself as a true fan and analyst by having the courage to call it out. It lends credit to an industry which increasingly fans think is just a love-fest for the team.

The only way this Leaf team wins is if the metrics they care about decline sharply. This means noone (meaning far fewer of course) is buying Leaf mugs, caps or jerseys. No one reacts to their twitter posts. No one clicks on the links to their stories, fewer tune in to their games etc. There will be a point where a kid will say "why did you buy me this Leafs cap?"

They will continue to make ticket revenue because of the corporations. However, if interest declines, the corporations might be able to negotiate better terms for their ads. Ditto for their T.V deals which is more difficult to see a loss in revenue because of the high demand and low supply of games but the Rogers overpayment confirmed that networks need to proceed with caution, you can overpay for the rights.

Ultimately though, the Leafs own hubris, started by Ballard really; has ensured a lack of true leadership in management. In military terms, we lack our George Patton who demands success over marketing.

Hayes called this shit years ago boys

 

[notDatsyuk]

Marner isn’t even holding up a move. He hasn’t been asked. The leafs don’t want to move him and haven’t asked him to waive his clause. So all of the arguing is for not my brother.

We have not been told by any reputable source that the Leafs don’t want to move him. We have not been told by any reputable source that he has or hasn't been asked. We have not been told by any reputable source that he is or isn't holding up a move.

All we know for certain is that he hasn't been traded. Actually, all we know for certain is that no reputable source has told us that he has been traded. He may have been traded and all the principles have agreed to not announce it until after the Olympics.

 

[francis246]

We have not been told by any reputable source that the Leafs don’t want to move him. We have not been told by any reputable source that he has or hasn't been asked. We have not been told by any reputable source that he is or isn't holding up a move.

All we know for certain is that he hasn't been traded. Actually, all we know for certain is that no reputable source has told us that he has been traded. He may have been traded and all the principles have agreed to not announce it until after the Olympics.

Yes we have been. There have been multiple reports that have stated that the leafs never even approached Marner this summer to ask him if he’s willing to waive. That conversation never happened. We’ve only heard the opposite. Berube is excited to work with him. This city is big and Marner is a big name, if there was any serious trade talk it would have leaked by now. It hasn’t, all we’ve seen from reporters is the opposite, leafs look to be keeping him for this season at least. Ferris is also notorious for walking his clients to UFA, so that’s probably the most likely scenario here.

Lol. Marner ain’t getting traded after the Olympics. It’s the summer Olympics, why would that interfere with anything. None of the NHL beat reporters are on assignment at the Olympics.

 

[Squiffy]

Can't picture a Marner trade. Walked in to UFA or re-signed, don't know. My guess re-sign. Same for JT. Marner gets a fortune, JT goes team friendly.

 

[Squiffy]

In a scenario where the Leafs do not look like a true contender on the ice and place third in the Atlantic, do you keep Tavares and Marner as own rentals or trade them away?

Can't see either waiving. 3rd in Atlantic isn't triggering that response. Out of playoffs hopelessly at Allstar break might, but that seems unlikely.

 

[Gilmour1996]

Shanny + Marner/Tavares/their families/their agents are making those decisions, not Treliving.

 

[ACC1224]

The thinking that because 'they haven't announced they aren't trading him' means they are, is just as whacked as the 'he hasn't been traded yet which proves he has no value around the league'.

 

[Da Mash]

Still shocks me with these scenarios….is it fantasy sports ruining fans brains?

Seems like the mediots and fans still have no clue what the NMC means .

There hasn’t been an ounce of proof that Tre even asked any player to waive their NMC and Tre also handed them out to Mathews and Nylander.

There are better odds both Taveres and Marner resign then them waiving to appease the fans

 

[Confucius]

Are you behind the cash register?

Just seems like a lot, doesn’t it? If they are open for 4hrs during a game that’s 5 an hour just of Marner jerseys, no wonder the seats look empty sometimes, they are lined up buying Marner stuff, let alone the Nylander, Mathews, Tavares, everyone else jerseys. I wonder how the staff has time to ring in all the other paraphernalia as well.