How much more valuable are goals compared to assists?

[Paul4587]

Depends entirely on the context. Someone like McDavid who creates out of nothing and give his linemates tap ins frequently is generally more valuable to the goals he creates than the player who taps in his pass. But then someone like Matthews who can score at will from the top of the circles adds more value than the player who made a routine pass to him before he scores.

I’ve seen some players have massive years racking up assists purely because they played with elite players and happened to touch the puck in lots of sequences which turned into goals. And I’ve also seen players have huge goal scoring years because they’re playing with an elite playmaker who can make ridiculous passes to get the puck on their tape in high danger areas.

Except playmakers with exceptional vision have a bigger impact on all kinds of goalscoring plays, including those where they are the player with the secondary assist.

Especially on the PP, often it’s the second assist that creates the play, where the player can see the play develop and know that in order for it to get to the guy whose open it needs to go to someone with a better passing lane. I see that with the likes of Crosby and McDavid all the time, the are frequently two steps ahead of things and see plays develop before others do.

 

[authentic]

Except playmakers with exceptional vision have a bigger impact on all kinds of goalscoring plays, including those where they are the player with the secondary assist.

Yes that is also true.

 

[Chaos2k7]

In 5 more games Matthews would have about 120 points and over 65 goals and he's better defensively. Yeah crazy to think that player is better.

Matthews has also scored more against better teams all season and that trend has continued so far in the playoffs.

I would love to see the player to player comparison you did that bears this out, team by team versus production acheived.

Sounds like you have quite the dissertation that many of us would love to see.

Surely, not at all based upon your season long hard on for AMs production this year. You literally pop in every thread about every player not named Matthews to give these takes.

Glad to see you have the numbers to back it up. Please educate us all who have less of a statistical background.

 

[authentic]

I would love to see the player to player comparison you did that bears this out, team by team versus production acheived.

Sounds like you have quite the dissertation that many of us would love to see.

Surely, not at all based upon your season long hard on for AMs production this year. You literally pop in every thread about every player not named Matthews to give these takes.

Glad to see you have the numbers to back it up. Please educate us all who have less of a statistical background.

hockeyreference game logs are your friend.

 

[Chaos2k7]

hockeyreference game logs are your friend.

So sweeping proclamations without any hard data actually presented by you.

Got it.

 

[Former Referee 68]

their not, no assist No Goal...yes i know there are unassisted Goals but for the most part there is always an assist

 

[authentic]

So sweeping proclamations without any hard data actually presented by you.

Got it.

What I said is 100% true. Either look it up for yourself or don't, your choice.

 

[Chaos2k7]

What I said is 100% true. Either look it up for yourself or don't, your choice.

If you have actually looked it up AND it's true, you could easily share your findings, which was the request the first time. You don't want to do that. It's for one of two reasons: A: you didn't look it up yourself and are just making a claim, or B: you did look it up and can't prove it's actually true.

This is your claim, and your provided point of reference.

I would think that someone who states something so absolutely and so continuously over and over, would relish the chance to prove your many many doubters wrong.

 

[authentic]

If you have actually looked it up AND it's true, you could easily share your findings, which was the request the first time. You don't want to do that. It's for one of two reasons: A: you didn't look it up yourself, or B: you did and it's not actually true.

Wrong.

 

[Chaos2k7]

Wrong.

You should be a trial attorny.

I can see you have nothing to back it up with, let's get back on point.

 

[authentic]

You should be a trial attorny.

I can see you have nothing to back it up with, let's get back on point.

Lol okay

 

[Confucius]

Goals are worth 10 times what an assist is worth, maybe more. Guys pass the puck around all game they become assists when someone actually puts the puck in the net.

 

[Panthaz89]

In 5 more games Matthews would have about 120 points and over 65 goals and he's better defensively. Yeah crazy to think that player is better.

Matthews has also scored more against better teams all season and that trend has continued so far in the playoffs.

The Atlantic is full of garbage goalies what better teams are we talking about 3 teams are near or at the bottom in GAs Leafs are one of those better teams leaving just Boston, TB, and Panthers while facing the Sabres, Canadians, RWings, and Ottawa. would have 120 points with what? The guy didn't have 1.5 PPG let alone 2 PPG you don't get points for games you sit out because you got a boo boo.

 

[Panthaz89]

Goals are worth 10 times what an assist is worth, maybe more. Guys pass the puck around all game they become assists when someone actually puts the puck in the net.

When a guy like McDavid draws an entire team towards him to leave his teammate for a point blank opportunity that's so silly to say. The main reason these guys pick up a ton of big assists is because they make the other team look stupid when they get a free drive to the net for a 1v1 against the goalie.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Should goals count for less if they're not unassisted?

 

[Stamkos4life]

Depends entirely on the context. Someone like McDavid who creates out of nothing and give his linemates tap ins frequently is generally more valuable to the goals he creates than the player who taps in his pass. But then someone like Matthews who can score at will from the top of the circles adds more value than the player who made a routine pass to him before he scores.

I’ve seen some players have massive years racking up assists purely because they played with elite players and happened to touch the puck in lots of sequences which turned into goals. And I’ve also seen players have huge goal scoring years because they’re playing with an elite playmaker who can make ridiculous passes to get the puck on their tape in high danger areas.



Especially on the PP, often it’s the second assist that creates the play, where the player can see the play develop and know that in order for it to get to the guy whose open it needs to go to someone with a better passing lane. I see that with the likes of Crosby and McDavid all the time, the are frequently two steps ahead of things and see plays develop before others do.

Exactly this. To try and say that goals are worth 1.5x an assist or what ever reeks of an agenda to boost certain players.

 

[Stephen]

Depends entirely on the context. Someone like McDavid who creates out of nothing and give his linemates tap ins frequently is generally more valuable to the goals he creates than the player who taps in his pass. But then someone like Matthews who can score at will from the top of the circles adds more value than the player who made a routine pass to him before he scores.

I’ve seen some players have massive years racking up assists purely because they played with elite players and happened to touch the puck in lots of sequences which turned into goals. And I’ve also seen players have huge goal scoring years because they’re playing with an elite playmaker who can make ridiculous passes to get the puck on their tape in high danger areas.



Especially on the PP, often it’s the second assist that creates the play, where the player can see the play develop and know that in order for it to get to the guy whose open it needs to go to someone with a better passing lane. I see that with the likes of Crosby and McDavid all the time, the are frequently two steps ahead of things and see plays develop before others do.

I think because of all the nuance, it just comes out as a wash in the end. As fans we intuitively know some stats lines aren't quite as impactful as others, not all goals and assists are equal from a value or style or skill perspective, but in aggregate 1 goal is worth 1 assist, aka 1 point.

 

[AgeIess]

According to the NHL they are worth 1 point each so same value.

 

[McVespa99]

I think most on here would agree that scoring goals is more difficult than putting up assist (and thus more valuable) but how much more valuable would a goal be compared to an assist?

I think I seen somewhere that on average for every goal there is 1.7 assist but I'm not sure how accurate that was?

So your saying Marner is not needed? Interesting. How many goals happen without an assist?

 

[yada]

Personally i feel xGF is more more important then tangible stats like goals, assists, and points

 

[Dion TheFluff]

So your saying Marner is not needed? Interesting. How many goals happen without an assist?

never did say that. Also if you scroll through the thread a bit you would have seen the that somebody had crunched the numbers a couple years ago and that the general consensus seemed to be that primary assists were valued essentially the same as goals while secondary assists were valued less at about 0.66 (approximately).

 

[authentic]

The Atlantic is full of garbage goalies what better teams are we talking about 3 teams are near or at the bottom in GAs Leafs are one of those better teams leaving just Boston, TB, and Panthers while facing the Sabres, Canadians, RWings, and Ottawa. would have 120 points with what? The guy didn't have 1.5 PPG let alone 2 PPG you don't get points for games you sit out because you got a boo boo.

The better teams I’m talking about are all the playoff teams in the East which he has much better production against.

 

[Confucius]

When a guy like McDavid draws an entire team towards him to leave his teammate for a point blank opportunity that's so silly to say. The main reason these guys pick up a ton of big assists is because they make the other team look stupid when they get a free drive to the net for a 1v1 against the goalie.

Easy to get an assist when you make passes to players that are uncovered because an entire team is heading your way. lol as I said an assist is just a pass unless someone scores. Then for some reason that pass is elevated to assist status.

People other than Leaf fans state exactly that. Bunting only gets 63 points because he is on a line with Mathews is the general opinion.

 

[Stamkos4life]

Before matthews, I doubt many leaf fans would be trying to convince everyone that goals are worth way more than assists.

It's almost like they have some sort of bias.

 

[Niten Ichi Ryu]

That's been the mantra of hockey since it's inception. Players know it very well, 'The play that sets up the goal is just as, if not more important than the goal scorer'. Some more than others, there are layers to that question/answer.

One player enters the zone, deking by 4 or 5 defenders, wheels around the offensive zone with speed causing their formation and structure to be a step behind, then passes off the player that's standing in the slot or in front of the net for the quick tap in. That scenario, obviously the play before the tap in was the principal of the goal

On the other hand, scenarios where the goal scorer is taking on the goalie 1 on 1, beats him clean; or tip-ins, where the player is battling in front of the net, causing vision issues on the opposing goaltender, and tips it in from a point shot. Those scenario's, the goal scorer was the principal of the goal

It's funny and convenient Toronto media has been saying this phrase since mid-season, "There's a premium on goal scoring. It's harder to score goals", to justify the MVP status of Matthews.
But it's his defensive game, backchecking, takeaways, faceoffs, together with leading the league in scoring, as the true reason why he's the leading candidate. It's annoying Toronto media/fans feel the need to throw shade at McDavid and downplay assists over goals