Post-Game Talk: Holl and Keefe hand Tampa the victory

[ToneDog]

The problem is not as simple as Keefe -- though his post-game press conference revealed a clear loser mentality-- and it is not Holl per se, though he was awful. The hidden problem no one talks about is the lack of distributed scoring, especially coming down to a weak third line, so that pressure on the Big 4 is multiplied. We know why the third line is weak -- no money. But Dubas's moves at the deadline were a hodge-podge of desperate moves, that made no sense in the end because defense was not the number one issue. Believe it or not, we need forwards who have hands and can score on the bottom 6. I am so sick of Kerfoot (did he put "I make bone-headed plays" on his application to Harvard?), Kampf, Laugh-erty, ZAR, etc. Just filler for the most part. Don't tell me they play "hard", because they don't.

And why is is better to sit Bunting, who scored 23 goals, while everyone falls in love with Knies, while he has not scored a single goal yet, after 6, 7 games in the NHL? Please explain....

Can't change a winning lineup. It is not one now, so enter Bunts and probably Lily.

 

[Torontonian]

If it wasn’t for our history, we’d be all going ho-hum it’s just one loss to a good team. Can’t expect to win 4 straight against them. If it ends up 4-2 instead of 4-1, who cares? But because of our history, we panic. I am thinking, let’s see what happens on Saturday. They can’t possibly keep losing elimination games indefinitely, lol. Can they?

Team still firmly in the drivers seat, I didn’t hate our game 5 either, but they need score on their opportunity’s in elimination games, the game would have been different going up 2-1 or being able to tie the game.

Adjusting for game 6 will be big, it’s clear we need to put Lilly or Gustafson in to help break out of our zone, a lot of Tampa pressure comes off of not being able to break out, and the lack of forechecking stems from not being able to move the puck fluently. Bunting being in for ZAR will also add depth through the entire lineup and help with the forecheck

 

[Metroid]

I genuinely feel bad for everyone associated with the Leafs. Dubas works hard and I respect the heck out of him for that. There have been a few barriers and few self-inflicted wounds that have prevented him from building a Cup contender, but he and the staff have tried to bandaid together a team that could win one round this year. A series win would give them some breathing room to retool.

Having said that, next week and throughout the summer, sports radio would be off the charts entertaining if they lose on Monday. Even though losing a week later to Boston would put them in the same spot, the perception would be completely different.

The media is hoping the leafs lose, they're all chomping at the headlines etc.

Servellia or what is already posting about Tampa and game 7 etc. Media benefits from leafs losing,. Feel like there's more hate out there for the leafs than love, unfortunately it is us against the world and we seem to keep losing..... I hate how powerful MLSE/leafs have become...I envy small market teams and their media.....need to go back to our roots....

 

[fahad203]

Bunting needs to get back in
Our depth is really showing

It will be really awkward if Lilly and Bunting goes back in and they have good games. Lets say they both have great games and leafs still lose

Man the media is going to be all over Keefe to why he hasn't played them earlier

 

[SprDaVE]

I've been a big supporter of Holl even when most people hate him but yeah... Him and Giordano are struggling hard and I don't know how you can justify this level of play. I don't think it's all on him and he has had some very good moments but I think it's time to insert Liljegren. They need better mobility and ability, not just a shot blocker.

The stats say it all about Holl and even Giordano. They've been on the ice for goals against way too much and it's not good enough.

Keefe does a lot of good things but the one thing he has to do is make a tough decision and change it up. I seriously doubt he will though other than to insert Bunting back in.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

OK boys here's my birds eye take from row 1 upper deck .. overall Tampa was better team and out skated and out grit grinded us all night long .. they both expect and deserve to have won that game and da hungrier team usually wins and they did

From my seats there were a few players who really can't hang in there at da pace of playoff hockey

i hate to say it but both Gio and Holl need to come out .. playoff hockey is won by D and G .. 2 or 3 goals from forwards is enough .. of course da more da merrier but that is pipe dream thinking .. heh you could score with some hot 20 something but reality is not likely .. we need to play lockdown hockey to win in playoffs .. to me i would insert Benn and Timmer in lineup as we need a 3rd pair who don't let Tampa's 3rd and 4th lines take our net .. bottom line Gio and Holl can't get job done .. this is da most important change to give us a better chance .. as it stands we are toast .. Lilly got his chance to play in 2 games at playoff pace and quite frankly he was atrocious .. although he is better than Holl so it would improve team even that 1 switch .. Keefer this is where coaching is really really f*ckin tough .. folks will b*tch at you but without trying to fix this MAJOR issue this series won't change

and da next one is even harder, in fact much harder, JT can't keep up .. it has been 5 games now of him not keeping up to play and whoever is on his line they are getting MASSIVELY tilted shift after shift .. he needs to move to 3rd line LW and f*ckin now Keefer .. this is imperative .. move up ROR with Bunting and Mitchy asap .. then we got our 2 top lines even or slightly better than theirs .. Keefer we can't keep getting TILTED on line 2 .. it has to stop

lastly line 4 .. kampf is nowhere near good enough .. not only did he lose battle of 4th lines HUGE .. he has zero grit grinding capability .. take him out when you insert Bunting .. last night he was da direct cause of da 3rd goal .. folks you may not have seen it on TV but I did perfectly .. he took out Sammy all by himself .. you just can't f*ck up that bad .. colossal error

now I am not gonna jump on Sammy as his mental health issues are enormous challenge for him .. but someone needs to close out Tampa .. bottom line goal 2, even though Holl can't pivot one way without falling down, is house league level and was as bad as Soup's Gally goal or one of many of Freddy's stickers .. they just can't find their way in playoff hockey (or even regular season too) .. they are killers .. this may be hardest call of all for all Sammy has done for da boys .. I am not sure I would make it either Keefer .. it will be your toughest call .. da other ones above are pretty obvious hockey calls .. I know Woll over 7 or 8 years and I have not seen 1 stinker from him on championship elite AAAA hockey ever .. I would try it .. if it doesn't work you can always go back to Sammy for game 7

Anywho my 2 cents .. GLG .. we all want them to figure out a way to advance .. lets GO .. GLG

 

[Nineteen67]

That is better than playing out the season and walking for nothing on July 1, 2024.

Depends on where he wants to go. If it’s Boston, why not wait it out another year.

our Winning is really Vasi shi**ing the bed.

View attachment 698286

Woll has a better Goals saved above expected than Sammy.

Vasi being the worst performer in the entire playoffs is the reason the Leafs are up. If he played average, the series would be over.

 

[Matty Sundin]

We're doomed if the average fan here has more smarts about lineups and strategy than the coach being paid to do the job.

I usually roll my eyes at posts like this but this one time I don’t. It’s such an obvious decision to make.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Vasi being the worst performer in the entire playoffs is the reason the Leafs are up. If he played average, the series would be over.

But let's not play Woll

The only cards Keefe has to improve our odds of winning are:

(1) play Woll

(2) play Lily, not Holl

 

[LeafalCrusader]

Although I'm not the biggest Lilly fan he could be a breath of fresh air. Brodie, Holl, and Gio seem at times to be tired/beaten.

Got too many defensemen on the wrong side of 30 who can't make a pass or carry the puck out.

Depends on where he wants to go. If it’s Boston, why not wait it out another year.

Vasi being the worst performer in the entire playoffs is the reason the Leafs are up. If he played average, the series would be over.

Still amazing were up with Sammy being 2nd worst and Giordano-Holl being the worst defense pair in the playoffs lol.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I can't see the GM and coach taking Holl out of the lineup.we protected him for some completely unknown reason.

 

[Nineteen67]

The media is hoping the leafs lose, they're all chomping at the headlines etc.

Servellia or what is already posting about Tampa and game 7 etc. Media benefits from leafs losing,. Feel like there's more hate out there for the leafs than love, unfortunately it is us against the world and we seem to keep losing..... I hate how powerful MLSE/leafs have become...I envy small market teams and their media.....need to go back to our roots....

I don’t know him.

I’m thinking the entertainment comes from the Toronto sports radio and podcasts.
TSNmorning show, OverDrive and Kyper will have some white hot takes.
The cronies analysis will be top notch, as always.
McCown will be more level headed.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Sammy playing poorer than Vasi

The book on Sammy was he wasn't a playoff performer.

Of starting goalies, Sammy is worse than Vasi for GAA vs expected.

WOLL NEEDS A CHANCE.

Isn't the book on Sammy he's "not good on the road" either.

 

[Clark4Ever]

Holl and Lafferty out next game, Liljegren and Bunting in please.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Sammy playing poorer than Vasi

View attachment 698293

The book on Sammy was he wasn't a playoff performer.

Of starting goalies, Sammy is worse than Vasi for GAA vs expected.

WOLL NEEDS A CHANCE.

Isn't the book on Sammy he's "not good on the road" either.

Needless to say, Sammy has not been an issue thus far. No sense driving a narrative that's inaccurate

He has the worse GAA vs. expected of all starters.
Worse than Vasi.

0.886 is bad. I know it is a team game, but if Vasi plays well for 2 games we are done.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

View attachment 698119

Samsonov and Holl cost us the game.

It's fun to shit on the Leafs, but they were objectively the better team that game. Not that it matters anymore... but people are acting like they went out there and got dominated. Holl got dominated, no doubt.

The Deserve to Win O'Meter needs to be calibrated. It's way out of whack. Sure wasn't calibrated for the game I watched last night.

 

[rocketman588]

Watching Matthews mom in the stands last night, I got this bad feeling in my stomach. We may actually be watching the last 2 Leafs games in Matthews career. He probably thinks he's one of the top guys in the league, he's not going to risk losing in the first round his whole career in a Leaf sweater. If I were him I'd request a trade too.

If he doesn't want to lose in the first round he should start giving more of a f*** from the start of the game.

Saying the leafs are losers and not including him is ridiculous. He's the best player besides Sammy he can the most impact on the game if he wants

 

[Nineteen67]

But let's not play Woll

The only cards Keefe has to improve our odds of winning are:

(1) play Woll

(2) play Lily, not Holl

There’s nothing to lose. They’re playing bonus games as it is, so why not give yourself a chance to play at least four more.

 

[Clark4Ever]

And Samsonov needs to rebound in game 6. He should have stopped the 2nd and 3rd goals in a game of that magnitude.

 

[MapleLeafs77]

The media is hoping the leafs lose, they're all chomping at the headlines etc.

Servellia or what is already posting about Tampa and game 7 etc. Media benefits from leafs losing,. Feel like there's more hate out there for the leafs than love, unfortunately it is us against the world and we seem to keep losing..... I hate how powerful MLSE/leafs have become...I envy small market teams and their media.....need to go back to our roots....

Not really. Sure the media will be popular for like 3 days after a loss for the Leafs but afterwards……viewership plummets for the playoffs, people cancel subscriptions for sportsnet now, tsn/sportsnet talk shows get barely any audience, and moving forward they all plummet because Leafs blow up the team and rebuild causing no playoffs moving forward and fans not caring. Not even talking about how much money the NHL will be losing if Leafs lose and not make the next round.

Literally everyone loses. NHL, media, and fans. If Leafs ever win then the NHL and media would be swimming in money and viewership and stories to talk about for years.

 

[Zero1]

Pens need to fire Sullivan.

I don’t want to watch Keefe coach anymore.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

There’s nothing to lose. They’re playing bonus games as it is, so why not give yourself a chance to play at least four more.

You can always go back to Sammy for game 7 as a fall back position

 

[All Mod Cons]

OK boys here's my birds eye take from row 1 upper deck .. overall Tampa was better team and out skated and out grit grinded us all night long .. they both expect and deserve to have won that game and da hungrier team usually wins and they did

From my seats there were a few players who really can't hang in there at da pace of playoff hockey

i hate to say it but both Gio and Holl need to come out .. playoff hockey is won by D and G .. 2 or 3 goals from forwards is enough .. of course da more da merrier but that is pipe dream thinking .. heh you could score with some hot 20 something but reality is not likely .. we need to play lockdown hockey to win in playoffs .. to me i would insert Benn and Timmer in lineup as we need a 3rd pair who don't let Tampa's 3rd and 4th lines take our net .. bottom line Gio and Holl can't get job done .. this is da most important change to give us a better chance .. as it stands we are toast .. Lilly got his chance to play in 2 games at playoff pace and quite frankly he was atrocious .. although he is better than Holl so it would improve team even that 1 switch .. Keefer this is where coaching is really really f*ckin tough .. folks will b*tch at you but without trying to fix this MAJOR issue this series won't change

and da next one is even harder, in fact much harder, JT can't keep up .. it has been 5 games now of him not keeping up to play and whoever is on his line they are getting MASSIVELY tilted shift after shift .. he needs to move to 3rd line LW and f*ckin now Keefer .. this is imperative .. move up ROR with Bunting and Mitchy asap .. then we got our 2 top lines even or slightly better than theirs .. Keefer we can't keep getting TILTED on line 2 .. it has to stop

lastly line 4 .. kampf is nowhere near good enough .. not only did he lose battle of 4th lines HUGE .. he has zero grit grinding capability .. take him out when you insert Bunting .. last night he was da direct cause of da 3rd goal .. folks you may not have seen it on TV but I did perfectly .. he took out Sammy all by himself .. you just can't f*ck up that bad .. colossal error

now I am not gonna jump on Sammy as his mental health issues are enormous challenge for him .. but someone needs to close out Tampa .. bottom line goal 2, even though Holl can't pivot one way without falling down, is house league level and was as bad as Soup's Gally goal or one of many of Freddy's stickers .. they just can't find their way in playoff hockey (or even regular season too) .. they are killers .. this may be hardest call of all for all Sammy has done for da boys .. I am not sure I would make it either Keefer .. it will be your toughest call .. da other ones above are pretty obvious hockey calls .. I know Woll over 7 or 8 years and I have not seen 1 stinker from him on championship elite AAAA hockey ever .. I would try it .. if it doesn't work you can always go back to Sammy for game 7

Anywho my 2 cents .. GLG .. we all want them to figure out a way to advance .. lets GO .. GLG

Tavares' play and contract is absolutely killing us. You insert Trochek and Ekholm (as an example) instead of Tavares and Holl and we're taking deep runs.

 

[Nineteen67]

You can always go back to Sammy for game 7 as a fall back position

If Woll is good then you don’t need to.

If Vasi, craps the bed again and let’s in a couple softies and the Leafs advance, what are the odds of the winning a game against Boston?

 

[Suntouchable13]

If Woll is good then you don’t need to.

If Vasi, craps the bed again and let’s in a couple softies and the Leafs advance, what are the odds of the winning a game against Boston?

Why can’t they win a game against Boston? Florida just took 2. They sure as hell can defeat Boston in a series. The talent is there.