jigglysquishy
Registered User
That's not the question being asked though.
Price's last full season came at age 32. Luongo played almost 50% more games than him. Longevity absolutely plays a role in this project.
HOH Top 60 Goaltenders of All Time (2024 Edition) - Voting Results
- Thread starter Dr John Carlson
- Start date
Price's last full season came at age 32. Luongo played almost 50% more games than him. Longevity absolutely plays a role in this project.
Yozhik v tumane
Registered User
- Jan 2, 2019
- 2,022
- 2,171
Not saying you’re wrong about Price being the best of the bunch, but you might want to rephrase this. Luongo is 8 years older and Vasilevskiy 7 years younger than Price, both were/are all-star netminders and of course there were multiple points where you would have picked them above Price.
Obviously I meant, in their primes head to head, GMs/Coaches would pick Price at similar age.
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
Vasilevskiy didn't make a ballot there? Woof...
I guess the Broda case that I asked for several times must have been distributed privately haha - 8 top 3 ballots there. More than everyone except Vasy and Price, narrowly. And now, I guess we'll never get to hear it because he's been inducted.
Benedict leading the way in 1st place ballots this round after being almost at the very bottom last round is quite a turn of events for him...
I guess the Broda case that I asked for several times must have been distributed privately haha - 8 top 3 ballots there. More than everyone except Vasy and Price, narrowly. And now, I guess we'll never get to hear it because he's been inducted.
Benedict leading the way in 1st place ballots this round after being almost at the very bottom last round is quite a turn of events for him...
Dennis Bonvie
Registered User
Quite odd for the guy coming in first to have such divergent voting.
Five candidates got first & last place votes.
Voters probably didn't want to distance Benedict too far from Vezina.
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
Perhaps. But it was expressly stated what a gap there was between them in the discussion I believe. I feel like a gap in pre-forward pass goalies carries a little bit more weight than some other gaps, but I'm also often nominated as the, uh, dunce of the week...so...
It's easy to compound problems in a situation like this.
Dennis Bonvie
Registered User
It may have been stated but these are a couple of goalies no one has seen play, who played at a time when the game was completely different. Often lumped together as the best of that era.
Dr John Carlson
Registered User
Vote 5
18/19 voters
Top six get in.
Hellebuyck and Lehman go in on the first try. Smith the first 80s goalie to get in, right before we had a few more to the hopper in vote 6.
Holecek over Worters on the tiebreak, he was ahead on more ballots.
There's a big break in the aggregate list right up next, and the guys before the break are tightly packed together. So, with a larger group going through this week, we're gonna add them all in, which puts us up to 14 names. It's a lot, but we should be steady around that number for a few weeks going forward.
18/19 voters
| Goalie | 1st | 2nd | 3rd | 4th | 5th | 6th | 7th | 8th | 9th | 10th | NR | Total |
| Connor Hellebuyck | 5 | 4 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 129 | |||
| Hugh Lehman | 1 | 4 | 4 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 118 | ||
| Jiri Holecek | 5 | 1 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 111 | ||
| Roy Worters | 1 | 5 | 3 | 4 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 111 | |||
| Tiny Thompson | 1 | 1 | 3 | 5 | 2 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 108 | ||
| Billy Smith | 1 | 1 | 2 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 104 | ||
| Tony Esposito | 2 | 2 | 1 | 5 | 1 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 94 | ||
| Harry Lumley | 1 | 1 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 2 | 5 | 1 | 66 | ||
| George Hainsworth | 1 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 2 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 58 | ||
| Grant Fuhr | 1 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 1 | 7 | 43 | |||
| Hap Holmes | 4 | 2 | 2 | 2 | 8 | 28 | ||||||
| Gump Worsley | 1 | 1 | 1 | 3 | 2 | 10 | 20 |
Top six get in.
Hellebuyck and Lehman go in on the first try. Smith the first 80s goalie to get in, right before we had a few more to the hopper in vote 6.
Holecek over Worters on the tiebreak, he was ahead on more ballots.
There's a big break in the aggregate list right up next, and the guys before the break are tightly packed together. So, with a larger group going through this week, we're gonna add them all in, which puts us up to 14 names. It's a lot, but we should be steady around that number for a few weeks going forward.
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Smith is not the first 80s goalie to go in- the myth of the anti-80s discrimination needs to end. Both 1 (Hasek, 1980-2011) and 2 (Roy, 1985-2003) on our list played substantial time in the 1980s, as did number 7 (Tretiak, 1968-1984).
jigglysquishy
Registered User
I literally had to read the post 5x to understand whose going in lol. You should really put a simplified "the top 6 go in this round" for us people who haven't had our coffee yet.
18/19 votes - I think that's the first round we haven't had all 19 voters? Still great voting participation overall, which is good.
Nothing too surprising with the results.
Dr John Carlson
Registered User
Ah, my bad, I figured the italics made it clear. I will fix that.
I meant that he's the first goalie where the bulk of his resume came in the 80s.
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
Colloquially, this means "first 80's NHL goalie". Arguably, sure, Roy was an 80's goalie - but not really. He's not associated with that era, he played probably like - I don't know - less than 20% of his career games in that era.
But washing all the semantics away...it's a relief that it's Smith 1st. Hopefully some space is put between him and Fuhr.
I'm also curious about the Fuhr vote at 1.
Not because I want everyone to fall in line...but who made the case? I'm the lone Lumley voter at 1 because I found him to be so far ahead of all of these goalies (except Hellebuyck was reasonably close) and I made an impassioned case for him. It clearly had no effect, but that's life in land of canon...I can't expect reputation change in a week's time haha - but I went to bat hard for Lumley.
What was Fuhr's case? Did Tony O's two 1st place votes come from PreviousListPlacement/60 stats? Like, there was some talk about being well received against limited competition as I recall. But...
Overall, given how many ways this vote could have really made some - in my opinion, of course - horrific mistakes and adds............this is a surprisingly tolerable result for that list of goalies.
Michael Farkas
Celebrate 68
Also, the Worters vote is kind of appropriate in some way...if you're more of a "goalie MVP" voter, you had him high. Otherwise, you had him lower. No in between. Kind of interesting distribution there.
I'm actually a little surprised that Hap Holmes didn't do well. I think it's fairly clear that he should not have done well, but I'm still a bit surprised. Sometimes the fog of war guys get a boost because everyone else sucks and got dogged. But, not the case...
Also, we see the trend continue...we'll call it a "trend" and not the "B" word haha
The ol' "if you weren't on a list a decade ago, you'll take your lumps and you'll take them hard"...I don't know what some folks are scared of or trying to compensate for, but this is rough...
Vasilevskiy in vote 3. He had a majority of voters placing him top 4. Two-thirds had him top 6. No 7th, 8th, 9th, or 10th place votes. Followed by 6 (!) NR.
Vote 4, Vasilevskiy now has a full eight 1st or 2nd place votes...won the whole round, but still picked up a 10th and an NR. Against freakin' Broda and Worters and Holecek...and hell, Billy Smith who was hardly even the starter haha
Even Price to a degree, just about half the panel had him top 3 (one short of having the most top-3 ballots). Also found his way to 3 NRs.
Then here we went again with Hellebuyck. Absolutely dominant in the discussion, dominant in the voting...but a couple of nuke attempts way out of left field.
Games that already happened are history. The list is growing by 50%. Of all the places on the internet, I trust that this group will not "erase" anyone from the history books...you don't have to be so resistant to change that it compromises..........[the list, logic, whatever concept belongs here]...
I'm actually a little surprised that Hap Holmes didn't do well. I think it's fairly clear that he should not have done well, but I'm still a bit surprised. Sometimes the fog of war guys get a boost because everyone else sucks and got dogged. But, not the case...
Also, we see the trend continue...we'll call it a "trend" and not the "B" word haha
The ol' "if you weren't on a list a decade ago, you'll take your lumps and you'll take them hard"...I don't know what some folks are scared of or trying to compensate for, but this is rough...
Vasilevskiy in vote 3. He had a majority of voters placing him top 4. Two-thirds had him top 6. No 7th, 8th, 9th, or 10th place votes. Followed by 6 (!) NR.
Vote 4, Vasilevskiy now has a full eight 1st or 2nd place votes...won the whole round, but still picked up a 10th and an NR. Against freakin' Broda and Worters and Holecek...and hell, Billy Smith who was hardly even the starter haha
Even Price to a degree, just about half the panel had him top 3 (one short of having the most top-3 ballots). Also found his way to 3 NRs.
Then here we went again with Hellebuyck. Absolutely dominant in the discussion, dominant in the voting...but a couple of nuke attempts way out of left field.
Games that already happened are history. The list is growing by 50%. Of all the places on the internet, I trust that this group will not "erase" anyone from the history books...you don't have to be so resistant to change that it compromises..........[the list, logic, whatever concept belongs here]...
