Hockey Countries compared to Soccer Countries
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How about Canada = France + Italy combined. That could be more accurate in terms of Canada's standing, depth and history.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Stevex said:
Edgar Davids was born in Paramaribo and moved to Amsterdam
with his parents when he was a year and a half. Seedorf was born in Amsterdam.
Must be thinking of Kluivert or someone else.. I just googled Seedorf and all his profiles say he was born in Surinam like Davids. Not all the Dutch players were born in Holland. Most countries have a player or two like that anyways. Hargreaves, Deco etc..
Thats true, Ibrahimovic(Sweden), John Carew(Norway), Catanha(Spain), Olisadebe(Poland),Mpenza-brothers(Belgium) etc....Stevex said:
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Stevex said:
Almost all his profiles say he was born in Amsterdam, so I'm curious which profiles you've seen. Besides, what's the difference if he was born in Paramaribo or Amsterdam ? John van het Schip was born in Canada, should we consider him Canadian.
You can't compare players like Deco and Olisadebe with Davids or Seedorf. Deco is 100% brasilian but has acquired Portuguese citizenship. The same can be said of Olisadebe with Poland.
While quite a few Dutch players also have parents from Surinam, all of them either were born or grew up in Holland. (keep in mind btw that at the time their parents moved here Surinam was still a part of the Netherlands) They are as Dutch as any other person in our country. The same can be said about quite a few French players, to give an example.
On the other hand there is a bunch of players who grew up and often reached adulthood in one country, only to change nationality to play for another country. Examples would be Josip Weber, Olaf Marshall, Emanuel Olisadebo, Deco, to name a few.
On the other hand there is a bunch of players who grew up and often reached adulthood in one country, only to change nationality to play for another country. Examples would be Josip Weber, Olaf Marshall, Emanuel Olisadebo, Deco, to name a few.
Frolov 6'3 said:
Just type in: "Clarence Seedorf" born
No difference IMO.. just ironic in a post of yours telling someone they didnt know what they were talking about.
DLF - Seedorf apparently was born after Surinam gained independence in 1975.
Stevex said:
The KNVB site has him born in Amsterdam, AC Milan states Paramaribo, so it appears impossible to establish this using internet as a source.
Not that all these rather technicalities-like discussions are relevant in any way. There is still the difference between a person having grown up in a certain country and a person changing nationaility after reaching adulthood, generally because he plays in a certain country.
As for MArshall, I think I messed his name up with another guy who was born and raised in South Africa, became top scorer in the Bunderliga and then changed nationality to play for the Mannschaft.
There are a lot of emigrants all over the world. it happens for all the reasons (war, money, etc). I was a exchange student near LA (98-99) and I opted to attend Hollywood High (bad choice!) over there I thnik that 70% of the students were imigrants (latinos, russians, armenians, southeast asians) but they lived like americans, payed taxes like every other american, learned american culture. So guys like this could choose to represent USA (because he lives there), Armenia (because he was born there) and lets suppose that this fellow parents were from Ukraine, he could also play for Ukraine. This is based on International Laws. If a british couple has a child in Brazil, the kid is Britsh AND Brazilian if they go to Argentina and live 18 years over there he can be an argentinean too.
About the Netherlands case, Suriname has great bounds, it's one of the 3 countries (the others being Guiana and French Guiana) that we learn at school that they are part of south america only phisically, those three countries are very dependable on the countries that they were colonies.
To finish it, Kariya, Gretzky, Iginla, etc are all son of imigrants. Rob Regehr was born at the same city that I was born and live now. And all those guys are stars playing for team Canada.
P.S. I know that there are a few cases that doesn't make sense (Deco maybe one, although he has a Portuguese heritage) but most of the cases exposed here are commom.
About the Netherlands case, Suriname has great bounds, it's one of the 3 countries (the others being Guiana and French Guiana) that we learn at school that they are part of south america only phisically, those three countries are very dependable on the countries that they were colonies.
To finish it, Kariya, Gretzky, Iginla, etc are all son of imigrants. Rob Regehr was born at the same city that I was born and live now. And all those guys are stars playing for team Canada.
P.S. I know that there are a few cases that doesn't make sense (Deco maybe one, although he has a Portuguese heritage) but most of the cases exposed here are commom.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Stevex said:
Yes and he didn't.
Born in Surinam, The Netherlands or Timboektoe..what does it matter. The point is, what DLF already stated, there's a difference with changing nationality or to grow up in a specific country. People compare Olisadebe and Deco with our Suri boys, that's totally ridiculous. So there wasn't any irony in my post or whatsoever, he acted like they were foreigners.
beckis said:hmm well the only way i see the US make a great impact is if either they work with the leagues in europe or ... hmm they do as it is in the other sports hockey/basketball/baseball and create a league that has the best players ......
i think they should try and work something out like the UEFA championships they need to play the best team/players or they wont get any much better ......
its been tryed before .... ala the 70:s and they got pele and a few others .... hmmm they went over to get some "easy" money ..... in the end of their careers ...
anyway ... hoping for some improvement for you guys
Couple of things:
As for starting some kind of UEFA like competition that the US club teams are involved in, I think they need to start by playing teams in Mexico, Latin America and work their way south to the South American leagues. I think that a more reasonable goal for a US club team would be to compete in something like the Copa Libertadores, rather than the UEFA cup. Eventually (maybe 15-20 years?) I could imagine an MLS team in a UEFA cup, given that everything goes as planned for the MLS.
As for getting foreign players that are past their prime to play in the league...you're right in that it's been done before, and that it's still going on. I'd actually like to see less of this, thus clearing up room for younger American players to get into the league.
I will admit that the MLS plans are extremely long term. By no means do I expect an MLS team to even compete anywhere near the top club teams in the world in the near future. To a certain extent, the MLS is pretty unwatchable compared to leagues like the Premiership. What I'm really trying to get at is that a strong, competitive MLS is a big key to the improvement and eventual solidification of the US national team as a world power.
Despite a lingering mainstream bias against soccer in the US, there are quite a few people that would love to see the US compete on a world scale. The last world cup was very gratifying for US soccer fans, and we want that to continue.
the US can make a league work ...... the only thing that is needed ... is money .....
the only reason hockey players play in the nhl is the money ... and the money got the best players ......
if you can get enough "young" good players over ... and get good games ..... more money .... more "good" players ...... and so on .....
the only reason hockey players play in the nhl is the money ... and the money got the best players ......
if you can get enough "young" good players over ... and get good games ..... more money .... more "good" players ...... and so on .....
rye&ginger
Registered User
rye&ginger said:
In the issues they have caused/encountered during their career maybe, but any comparison ends right there...
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Predatore said:
I had to clear up an argument, I can't devide this thread in two parts and bring the other part to the "Other sports" board.
Epsilon
#basta
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