Hockey Cards - Part III

[CutOnDime97]

New to the hobby. Brand new. Slowly trying to learn about everything and I am starting to wonder if "Breaking Culture" has truly affected not only the price of boxes, but also hurting collectors? I am trying to be smart and remind myself that I do not want to join this hobby to "make money" but at the same time, I don't want to feel like I am throwing my money COMPLETELY away and it would nice to feel somewhat assured that there is decent value in some boxes.

Many have said hockey cards haven't quite suffered as much as other sports and Pokemon, but before I go out and buy a couple hobby boxes of Series One, I paused and started to wonder if a long-time collector has noticed a major shift in the hobby, and if it is worth it nowadays to be one of those nostalgic consumers who walks into a shop, buys a box or two and rips wax on their own.

Obviously it is almost never economical to open a box yourself, but is it at the point where it is borderline throwing away hundreds of dollars with little potential in terms of value? I do not mind just building a personal collection, purely for fun, but it is still something in the back of my mind. What would you recommend for a new collector in the hobby who wants a balance of fun and value? Do you recommend it at all?

Honestly, I wouldn't recommend opening boxes or breaking at all. The products have gotten more watered down and prices gave gone up. It's really not enjoyable. I've opened maybe 2 boxes in the past year or so and felt extremely ripped off both times.

I'd recommend setting up saved searches on the eBay and COMC apps and building a collection buying singles. I watch a few YouTube channels that rip boxes (Zeeree, GP Sports Cards, Mainely Hockey Cards) to get the jist of new products and get my fix that way.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Does COMC determine what to sell the card for, or is that just on the person who sent it in ?

 

[CutOnDime97]

Does COMC determine what to sell the card for, or is that just on the person who sent it in ?

You send it in (or send over from epack), COMC adds it to your account, and you price it yourself.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

You send it in (or send over from epack), COMC adds it to your account, and you price it yourself.

Ahh ok that's why there's some stupid ask for cards from them on ebay.

Thanks.

 

[CutOnDime97]

Ahh ok that's why there's some stupid ask for cards from them on ebay.

Thanks.

They cross list the listing on their platform to eBay. So you're a lot better off logging into COMC and buying the card vs buying on eBay for more money and paying shipping

 

[dr robbie]

Obviously it is almost never economical to open a box yourself, but is it at the point where it is borderline throwing away hundreds of dollars with little potential in terms of value? I do not mind just building a personal collection, purely for fun, but it is still something in the back of my mind. What would you recommend for a new collector in the hobby who wants a balance of fun and value? Do you recommend it at all?

Watch some youtube videos of people doing hockey card box breaks. They'll drop hundreds / thousands of dollars and be excited when they get a third of the value back in cards. It's completely a waste of money right out the gate unless you can supplement in another way like streaming the video. And that's not even factoring in that you need to move it fairly quickly, which takes time and effort. I'd recommend just buying want you want from a seller. It's cheaper and you actually get what you want rather than some extremely low chance of getting it. Nearly all of the cards you get are going to be worthless in a decade, so I would not say it's a good investment.

 

[Craig Ludwig]

Watch some youtube videos of people doing hockey card box breaks. They'll drop hundreds / thousands of dollars and be excited when they get a third of the value back in cards. It's completely a waste of money right out the gate unless you can supplement in another way like streaming the video. And that's not even factoring in that you need to move it fairly quickly, which takes time and effort. I'd recommend just buying want you want from a seller. It's cheaper and you actually get what you want rather than some extremely low chance of getting it. Nearly all of the cards you get are going to be worthless in a decade, so I would not say it's a good investment.

Bang on!

 

[shakes the clown]

well, I learned my lesson with PSA. Sent in 200 cards from my late father's collection and got them back this week. Expecting some 10s in there as there were a lot of great conditioned cards from the 70s and 80s. Also some older stuff that we didn't expect to grade well.

Got them back and only one 10 in the whole 200 card lot. Grades all over the place. Sent in several of the same cards and the grades make no sense. some look identical and yet one card gets a 9 and the other gets a 6.

I'm convinced that they are more concerned with population control vs giving an honest grade. I'll never send another card to them or any grading company. Nothing but a scam.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

well, I learned my lesson with PSA. Sent in 200 cards from my late father's collection and got them back this week. Expecting some 10s in there as there were a lot of great conditioned cards from the 70s and 80s. Also some older stuff that we didn't expect to grade well.

Got them back and only one 10 in the whole 200 card lot. Grades all over the place. Sent in several of the same cards and the grades make no sense. some look identical and yet one card gets a 9 and the other gets a 6.

I'm convinced that they are more concerned with population control vs giving an honest grade. I'll never send another card to them or any grading company. Nothing but a scam.

That sucks to get back that many cards consistently lower than you expected. Your only option would be to resub the ones you think were snubbed, and hope the grader's wife didn't give him crap that morning and he is in a good mood.

Grading is gambling, the same way as opening a box is because there is no real objective criteria or consistency with the grading companies. The same card can be sent in multiple times and receive a different grade.

It annoys me that the hobby puts so much value in the grading services. The only reason people send cards in, is because of the perceived increase in value that is possible. The perceived increase in value is only possible, because people in the hobby fetishize gambling, and PSA+BGS offers another layer to that after opening boxes.

There are also always allegations of things like preferential treatment for big spenders, etc.

Even if someone could prove to have an objective and fair AI grading service where the criteria is upfront and easily understood, to the point that pre-grading becomes more of a skilled trade rather than grading being something you gamble on, I don't think the hobby would accept it. PSA has overtaken BGS for modern stuff in hockey over the last few years partly because non-hockey collectors have entered the market and PSA was the top company for them, but also because people would rather have more 10s delivered on modern stuff, than have a system where 10s are difficult to acquire. So if an objective system didn't produce 10s as often as PSA, people would not accept it.

(I am aware that there are some newer services that claim to have objective AI grading.)

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Watch some youtube videos of people doing hockey card box breaks. They'll drop hundreds / thousands of dollars and be excited when they get a third of the value back in cards. It's completely a waste of money right out the gate unless you can supplement in another way like streaming the video. And that's not even factoring in that you need to move it fairly quickly, which takes time and effort. I'd recommend just buying want you want from a seller. It's cheaper and you actually get what you want rather than some extremely low chance of getting it. Nearly all of the cards you get are going to be worthless in a decade, so I would not say it's a good investment.

If I told you my hobby was scratch tickets, you would either laugh at me or be concerned for me.

That is what I hear when people say they drop four or five figures breaking boxes. It's the exact same thing. It wouldn't surprise me if scratch tickets had better returns than most hobby boxes. Especially considering the fact that you get the money up front for scratch tickets, but if I pull a $20 card, I have to put in the leg work to sell it to "make my money back".

With that said, if a stranger on the internet enjoys gambling it isn't my place to impose my ethics on them and say they should not gamble. If the question is, I enjoy gambling, I know I will lose 50-80 percent of what I spend, but I think it's worth it because I enjoy getting a big pull every once in a while, which boxes will be the most fun? Sure, tell them to go out and buy a case of The Cup.

But the question is usually "I'm interested in collecting hockey cards, which boxes should I buy to build a collection?". When it's the former like that, it's important to let them know the actual reality of breaking boxes, and that you can usually buy what you will receive in an average box for 75 percent less through buying the singles. That is a better way to build a collection.

Keep in mind, I might buy a pack every few months for fun. Or even grab a hobby box. I put $10 into the Sens 50/50 once or twice a year. So I am not an anti-gambling absolutist.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Gold 1/1 Hutson is on eBay.

Currently at 16k with 9 days left.

While he will very clearly be a superstar, selling now is probably a safer bet since his value is tied to the team he plays on. Look at Kotkaniemi's prices before and after the offer sheet.

What do you guys think about UD doing all these YG parallels?

Hockey collecting has changed a lot in the last 5 years. The market used to be very different from football and basketball. Stuff like PMGs were available all over COMC for pennies on the dollar because nobody cared about them or collected them. I have a few that I bought for a few dollars each because I thought they looked cool, that I later sold during COVID for $100+. (Veteran players, not up in value based on a rookie breaking out.)

It's very obvious that stuff like these 1/1s and rookie reissues create short term excitement in breaking boxes, but I wonder if it will burn people out in the long term. YGs were a very nice established point for people to collect because they were in demand, it weren't unattainable. With that said, it's possible that I'm stuck in the past and UD is appropriately responding to the changes in their market.

It's crazy how much has changed about the average hockey collectors. Even PSA seemingly becoming the #1 grading company for modern hockey over Beckett.

 

[TheYardMachine]

Gold 1/1 Hutson is on eBay.

Currently at 16k with 9 days left.

While he will very clearly be a superstar, selling now is probably a safer bet since his value is tied to the team he plays on. Look at Kotkaniemi's prices before and after the offer sheet.

What do you guys think about UD doing all these YG parallels?

Hockey collecting has changed a lot in the last 5 years. The market used to be very different from football and basketball. Stuff like PMGs were available all over COMC for pennies on the dollar because nobody cared about them or collected them. I have a few that I bought for a few dollars each because I thought they looked cool, that I later sold during COVID for $100+. (Veteran players, not up in value based on a rookie breaking out.)

It's very obvious that stuff like these 1/1s and rookie reissues create short term excitement in breaking boxes, but I wonder if it will burn people out in the long term. YGs were a very nice established point for people to collect because they were in demand, it weren't unattainable. With that said, it's possible that I'm stuck in the past and UD is appropriately responding to the changes in their market.

It's crazy how much has changed about the average hockey collectors. Even PSA seemingly becoming the #1 grading company for modern hockey over Beckett.

PSA is definitely king right now for hockey. Almost no cards are being sent to BGS!

The grand majority of cards after 2020-21 are being sent to PSA

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

PSA is definitely king right now for hockey. Almost no cards are being sent to BGS!

The grand majority of cards after 2020-21 are being sent to PSA

The big change happened during the pandemic when there was a renewed interest in gambling/speculating on sports cards.

I suspect it's because a lot of collectors or influencers from other sports where PSA was the top choice got into hockey at the same time as a large amount of new hockey collectors.

Like I said in my post, the other thing that changed was interest in parallels. Hockey previously was very heavy on the prominence of a set. Young Guns, FWA, etc. Football and basketball geared more to aesthetics and shiny cards.

So what I wonder is if these changes are going to burn out and alienate the core fan base in the long run, with a lot of these new collectors not sticking around once they realize they aren't getting rich. Or, if this is simply UD having their finger on the pulse of the long-term direction of the hobby.

 

[blankall]

The big change happened during the pandemic when there was a renewed interest in gambling/speculating on sports cards.

I suspect it's because a lot of collectors or influencers from other sports where PSA was the top choice got into hockey at the same time as a large amount of new hockey collectors.

Like I said in my post, the other thing that changed was interest in parallels. Hockey previously was very heavy on the prominence of a set. Young Guns, FWA, etc. Football and basketball geared more to aesthetics and shiny cards.

So what I wonder is if these changes are going to burn out and alienate the core fan base in the long run, with a lot of these new collectors not sticking around once they realize they aren't getting rich. Or, if this is simply UD having their finger on the pulse of the long-term direction of the hobby.

They are definitely making more parallels. Can't say those parallels are going up in value though. A major issue with hockey is that so few players have high value cards. In basketball/football all sorts of guys go for big money. Any HoF will have big value. Unless it's Gretzky, Crosby, Lemieux, Ovy, etc... or an ultra hot prospect like Bedard, the value just isn't there in hockey.

For example, you can guy a PSA 9 Mike Bossy Rookie for $400 CAD.