Hey Terry, Do Us A Favor and SELL

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This may be the dumbest thread on this board. There are no buyers for this team, years ago Terry hired investment banks to look for any potential buyers and there were none.

I also don't understand how the players not doing their jobs, falls all the way up to the owner. Just logically speaking, think of how ridiculous that is. It's like complaining to Danny Wegman because the person at the sub counter put tomatoes on your sub when you requested them not to.
If it’s a single employee at the sub counter putting tomatoes on subs when you request no Toms, fire that employee and the is problem solved.

But if every single employee within Wegmans does it… then it’s a systemic problem within every layer of the business all the way up the chain to Danny Wegman.

That’s what we’ve got with the Sabres. Every layer is rotten, starting with Terrance.
 
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TehDoak

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This may be the dumbest thread on this board. There are no buyers for this team, years ago Terry hired investment banks to look for any potential buyers and there were none.

I also don't understand how the players not doing their jobs, falls all the way up to the owner. Just logically speaking, think of how ridiculous that is. It's like complaining to Danny Wegman because the person at the sub counter put tomatoes on your sub when you requested them not to.

14 years of no playoffs, who has been here the entire time?

We've had multiple GMs and coaches, still no success. We've gotten franchise centers, star wingers, Veznia Winning goalies....and no success.

What is the common thread that ties multiple GMs, coaches, and eras of players?

Ownership.

Not sure what is different between the Bills and the Sabres, but there is a difference.
 
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Doug Prishpreed

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May 1, 2013
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This may be the dumbest thread on this board. There are no buyers for this team, years ago Terry hired investment banks to look for any potential buyers and there were none.

I also don't understand how the players not doing their jobs, falls all the way up to the owner. Just logically speaking, think of how ridiculous that is. It's like complaining to Danny Wegman because the person at the sub counter put tomatoes on your sub when you requested them not to.
Literally the dumbest post of all time, congrats
 

BloFan4Life

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14 years of no playoffs, who has been here the entire time?

We've had multiple GMs and coaches, still no success. We've gotten franchise centers, star wingers, Veznia Winning goalies....and no success.

What is the common thread that ties multiple GMs, coaches, and eras of players?

Ownership.

Not sure what is different between the Bills and the Sabres, but there is a difference.

So let me get this straight, in your post you talk about multiple GMs, coaches, and players, yet you want to blame the owner. So the owner has tried different things, but he's the issue. What do you want him to do? Seriously, tell me. He has literally put up millions of dollars to try every avenue possible, what more do you want him to do. Tried spending money in FA, tried tanking, tried multiple GM candidates that were well regarded before coming here, tried coaches with experience, tried rookie coaches. At what point do we start blaming the players? Where is our captain, that I said was a horrible choice for captain.
 

May Day 10

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He needs to hire someone with credibility and experience to run the franchise.... also to provide full autonomy and resources. The standard needs to be success and winning.

Right now, the standard is a stall tactic because Pegula and Adams think success is inevitable at some point on the future time plane, as long as they stick out their ideals.

There are a bunch of higher-ups in the organization, who, if they were rightfully scattered into the wind like a dandelion, would not find lateral employment in the NHL. Adams is right at the top of that list. But we have Jakubowski, Crowe, Forton, and Nightingale. You can probably add Lindy Ruff to that list as well as the whack pack of assistant coaches they cling onto... including Seth Appert, who is our next no-search head coach for some reason.
 
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Jim Bob

RIP RJ
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Somebody should probably check on Duane.

You remember Duane, the disgruntled Buffalo fan who reached his breaking point in January 2020. Frustrated after watching his beloved Sabres spin their wheels on their way to what would be their 10th straight playoff miss, Duane decided he had to do something. So he called into a local radio station, took a deep breath, and then opened up an emotional vein.

He went in on the players. He went in on management. He went in (especially) on ownership. It was a hard listen, but no real fan could turn away, because we’ve all been there at some point. As I wrote at the time, we were all Duane.

But some of us were more Duane than others, because some teams are more hopeless than others. And so a few days after Duane’s meltdown, I went through the league to try to figure out which fan base would be the next to hit rock bottom. And almost five full years later, it’s time to ask that question again.

We can start with some good news. Of the nine teams in that 2020 post, three have been reasonably good in the years since — the Rangers, Wild and Devils haven’t won any Cups, but they’ve all had more ups than downs over the last five years. Sometimes, there really is a reason for hope.

Other teams haven’t been as lucky. So today, we’re going to use the same scoring system as last time to figure out which team’s fans should be closest to a Duane-like nadir. To qualify for consideration, a team has to be in danger of missing the playoffs for at least a third straight season. You wouldn’t think a league with as much parity as the NHL would have all that many teams on their way to a three-peat, but it’s a longer list than you’d think, with 12 teams in all. It’s a group that doesn’t even include a few fan bases who probably feel pretty miserable right now, including the Bruins, Rangers, Islanders and Predators, since they all made the playoffs last year. All I can say is wait your turn, everyone.

This is always a tricky exercise, since (as you’ll no doubt see in the comments), some fans insist on eternal optimism while others take pride in being as miserable as possible. The reality is that all of these fan bases have it bad. But who’s got it the worst? Let’s start counting down …

1. Buffalo Sabres​

Recent history: 10/10. Their last playoff series was in 2011. Since then, they’ve had zero appearances, which matches the number of championships in franchise history. Ah well, at least the franchise player they spent years tanking for became a villain, got traded to an expansion team and immediately won a Cup.

Lack of faith in ownership/management: 9/10. The clock seems to be ticking on Kevyn Adams. As for ownership, the only good thing you can say about Terry Pegula these days is at least the Bills are good.

Future hopelessness: 4/10. Corey had their pipeline just outside the top 10, but the core is young enough that you can find plenty of hope if you squint.

Bonus points: +1. For the fact that they’re hanging right around the playoff bubble so far this season, which would be a good thing for most teams but for the Sabres just makes it feel like Lucy setting up the football for the 14th year in a row.

Tipping point total: 24/30. We’ll end the way we began: Somebody should probably check on Duane.

After last night, we really do need a welfare check on Duane.
 
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BloFan4Life

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He needs to hire someone with credibility and experience to run the franchise.... also to provide full autonomy and resources. The standard needs to be success and winning.

Right now, the standard is a stall tactic because Pegula and Adams think success is inevitable at some point on the future time plane, as long as they stick out their ideals.

There are a bunch of higher-ups in the organization, who, if they were rightfully scattered into the wind like a dandelion, would not find lateral employment in the NHL. Adams is right at the top of that list. But we have Jakubowski, Crowe, Forton, and Nightingale. You can probably add Lindy Ruff to that list as well as the whack pack of assistant coaches they cling onto... including Seth Appert, who is our next no-search head coach for some reason.

The president of hockey operations is the dumbest argument. What teams have a president of hockey operations? All you need is a GM in the NHL. How many GMs have Pegula given a chance to? Murray, and Botterill were both considered highly qualified GM candidates. Adams is the former player route that many teams have gone to recently (Drury, Briere, Guerin, Yzerman, Grier).
 

May Day 10

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The president of hockey operations is the dumbest argument. What teams have a president of hockey operations? All you need is a GM in the NHL. How many GMs have Pegula given a chance to? Murray, and Botterill were both considered highly qualified GM candidates. Adams is the former player route that many teams have gone to recently (Drury, Briere, Guerin, Yzerman, Grier).

How many teams have a track record of failure that transcends 4 ownership groups and nearly a quarter century?

There is a mess and it needs to be cleaned up and updated to 2024 NHL standards. It is a heavy lift, most aspects of the operation need to be analyzed and fixed.

They haven't conducted an actual coaching search since they hired Krueger. They seemingly forced Ruff to take on this whack pack of assistant coaches they have assembled. How many teams do things like that?
 
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Jim Bob

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How many teams have a track record of failure that transcends 4 ownership groups and nearly a quarter century?

There is a mess and it needs to be cleaned up and updated to 2024 NHL standards. It is a heavy lift, most aspects of the operation need to be analyzed and fixed.
Unfortunately, Adams has overseen a lot of changes that educated fans wanted to see. And it hasn't been good enough.

There has been one constant over the past 14 seasons. And that one constant isn't changing anytime soon.
 

Howie Hodge

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Sep 16, 2017
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How many teams have a track record of failure that transcends 4 ownership groups and nearly a quarter century?

There is a mess and it needs to be cleaned up and updated to 2024 NHL standards. It is a heavy lift, most aspects of the operation need to be analyzed and fixed.

They haven't conducted an actual coaching search since they hired Krueger. They seemingly forced Ruff to take on this whack pack of assistant coaches they have assembled. How many teams do things like that?
1733321305781.png


If your employees aren't doing their jobs properly, then as a responsible owner you adjust accordingly. It doesn't happen by osmosis; though one might argue it did with The Bills. More like dumb luck. If Terry had any idea Beane and McDermott would be this successful, he'd do the same with his Hockey Club.

As Chain mentions in the beginning of this thread; it is gross negligence. I have been a fan since literally day one. I am at my witts end. Terry Pegula has done the impossible, he is killing my love of this team.

I can't ever support another team, so like many here, I'm totally effed.

I also wish he would sell the team. If someone buys and relocates, at least my love of the team can die. This is currentl situation is like death from 100,000 paper cuts...
 

Fjordy

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The president of hockey operations is the dumbest argument. What teams have a president of hockey operations? All you need is a GM in the NHL. How many GMs have Pegula given a chance to? Murray, and Botterill were both considered highly qualified GM candidates. Adams is the former player route that many teams have gone to recently (Drury, Briere, Guerin, Yzerman, Grier).
Some or maybe many teams have advisors. Who should hire a new GM? Terry again? Who should conduct the interviews? POHO or an advisor here would make sense too, so Terry doesn't hire an idiot as GM again. Or you just hire an experienced GM. I don't know who it is, Jarmo, Bergevin, Bob Murray, Doug Wilson.
 

TehDoak

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So let me get this straight, in your post you talk about multiple GMs, coaches, and players, yet you want to blame the owner. So the owner has tried different things, but he's the issue. What do you want him to do? Seriously, tell me. He has literally put up millions of dollars to try every avenue possible, what more do you want him to do. Tried spending money in FA, tried tanking, tried multiple GM candidates that were well regarded before coming here, tried coaches with experience, tried rookie coaches. At what point do we start blaming the players? Where is our captain, that I said was a horrible choice for captain.

I've said this multiple times, but he needs to hire an experienced team president and let him run the team rather than hiring a 1st time GM and essentially try to be co-GM. Every single GM has talked about how they talk to Terry on a daily basis. He only hires first time GMs because an experienced GM will want autonomy. Adams was the extreme case because not only was he a first time GM, it was his first time in a NHL front office in any capacity, or any hockey front office. They hired Adams because they trusted he wouldn't tell them no.

The problem IS ownership. A complete inability to hire someone with the proper experience and let them do their job.
 

Fjordy

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I've said this multiple times, but he needs to hire an experienced team president and let him run the team rather than hiring a 1st time GM and essentially try to be co-GM. Every single GM has talked about how they talk to Terry on a daily basis. He only hires first time GMs because an experienced GM will want autonomy. Adams was the extreme case because not only was he a first time GM, it was his first time in a NHL front office in any capacity, or any hockey front office. They hired Adams because they trusted he wouldn't tell them no.

The problem IS ownership. A complete inability to hire someone with the proper experience and let them do their job.
Or at least an advisor if he doesn't want to hire POHO, I don't trust Terry to hire a new GM.
 
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TehDoak

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The president of hockey operations is the dumbest argument. What teams have a president of hockey operations? All you need is a GM in the NHL. How many GMs have Pegula given a chance to? Murray, and Botterill were both considered highly qualified GM candidates. Adams is the former player route that many teams have gone to recently (Drury, Briere, Guerin, Yzerman, Grier).

How has the direct GM to Ownership model worked for the Sabres in the last 14 years?

Every former player hired has several years as an assistant GM somewhere before they get hired on full time. Every one. No one goes from no experience to GM, except Adams. And when they DO hire on those players to be GMs, they surround them with resources like ex GMs to be sounding boards as special advisers. Adams had no one when he was hired, and then they hired Karmanos, who had never been a GM either. They've setup Adams to fail because the Pegulas don't want a strong voice in the front office to tell them they are wrong.
 
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ValJamesDuex

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Nov 4, 2021
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Not ONE NHL player has or will waive his NTC to come here. That's on Pegula for having a shit organization and treating players like shit. Word gets around the league very quick what do you think Jack, Sam, Casey, ROR, etc have told other players about their time here ?
 
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Jim Bob

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Not ONE NHL player has or will waive his NTC to come here. That's on Pegula for having a shit organization and treating players like shit. Word gets around the league very quick what do you think Jack, Sam, Casey, ROR, etc have told other players about there time here ?
That is not true. Adams convinced Staal to waive to come here. And that is just one example off of the top of my head. I am sure there have been others over the past 14 years.

I do not expect players to waive to come here this year, though.
 

Fjordy

Never lost a fair game... or played one
Jun 20, 2018
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That is not true. Adams convinced Staal to waive to come here. And that is just one example off of the top of my head. I am sure there have been others over the past 14 years.

I do not expect players to waive to come here this year, though.
That's because Staal was his teammate. :laugh:


But the reality is that most NHL players don't have any trade protection.
 
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BloFan4Life

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How has the direct GM to Ownership model worked for the Sabres in the last 14 years?

Every former player hired has several years as an assistant GM somewhere before they get hired on full time. Every one. No one goes from no experience to GM, except Adams. And when they DO hire on those players to be GMs, they surround them with resources like ex GMs to be sounding boards as special advisers. Adams had no one when he was hired, and then they hired Karmanos, who had never been a GM either. They've setup Adams to fail because the Pegulas don't want a strong voice in the front office to tell them they are wrong.

How did Lafontaine work?

Is Karmanos not an experienced associate GM? People wanted more analytics so they brought in Ventura.

Adams was a coach and SVP within organization before being a GM. Its not rocket science
 

ValJamesDuex

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Nov 4, 2021
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That is not true. Adams convinced Staal to waive to come here. And that is just one example off of the top of my head. I am sure there have been others over the past 14 years.

I do not expect players to waive to come here this year, though.
Stahl ?, c'mon Jim, you know what I'm saying
We were told having Lindy would change it, it didn't
There must be some bad bad juju
 

Fjordy

Never lost a fair game... or played one
Jun 20, 2018
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How did Lafontaine work?

Is Karmanos not an experienced associate GM? People wanted more analytics so they brought in Ventura.

Adams was a coach and SVP within organization before being a GM. Its not rocket science
Lafontaine had experience? No, and we need experience.

Does Karmanos decide anything here? No. Does Ventura decide anything? No.

Adams has zero experience as AGM, no matter that he was a coach or some SVP who has no influence on the work of a GM and does not know what it is.
 

Fjordy

Never lost a fair game... or played one
Jun 20, 2018
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20% I heard
and I should add veteran FA's that will not come. Yes, they got Zucker for 1 yr but at a 1M overpay ?
20% with trade protection? Maybe I just don't remember the numbers exactly. I'm sure you can find good players without trade protection if you want.
 
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May Day 10

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20% with trade protection? Maybe I just don't remember the numbers exactly. I'm sure you can find good players without trade protection if you want.

A problem is, even when they get players from the outside, they look great for a short period of time, seem to have a hunger that lacks on the current roster.... then they get Sabreized and fall back into the mass of malaise. Greenway, Zucker, Byram come to mind.

Then on the other end, so many players seem miserable here, then leave and find great success. I don't think I need to list all those.

We even had an ex-player create a clothing line based on how much he hated playing here.
 

BloFan4Life

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Jul 8, 2009
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Lafontaine had experience? No, and we need experience.

Does Karmanos decide anything here? No. Does Ventura decide anything? No.

Adams has zero experience as AGM, no matter that he was a coach or some SVP who has no influence on the work of a GM and does not know what it is.

Do you have a source for this, or just making things up?
 

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