Friedman: Hextall looking to bring in a right handed defenseman

[SnS]

Exactly

I don’t see any fit that makes sense regarding Trouba who would be very expensive to get and any return on him would need to make us better now. Makes no sense for us to ever take magic beans.

Which is why I’m fine letting the Trouba to philly stuff die, quickly. Because obviously people are already angry and throwing stuff out there that makes no sense.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

If, however, another team was to make an offer for our #1 defenseman, the price would be astronomically high. As you can see, a couple of posters seem to struggle with the concept of good players being expensive. The one who I would really want in a Trouba trade is Ghost, who is miles ahead of Provorov, but that would not be realistic.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Which is why I’m fine letting the Trouba to philly stuff die, quickly. Because obviously people are already angry and throwing stuff out there that makes no sense.

Same. I don't particularly want Trouba, so it's not worth the discussion.

 

[Hunter368]

Which is why I’m fine letting the Trouba to philly stuff die, quickly. Because obviously people are already angry and throwing stuff out there that makes no sense.

Agreed

I’m always open to trade players as long as it makes sense. So far I haven’t seen anything that makes sense from a Jets POV.

You guys should target a lesser Rhd, much more affordable. Who would he be replacing from this past year?

 

[Maukkis]

Lol. That’s insane.

Ivan is our number 1, not ghost.

Philadelphia Flyers: Ivan Provorov in Transition - Last Word on Hockey
Line Stats - Natural Stat Trick
Provorov PHI 1718
Gostisbehere PHI 1718

The statistics suggest otherwise; Ghost's transition game is excellent and superior to Provorov's (which is also very good), and when separated from each other, Ghost's game suffers less than Provorov's. Their point production at ES is practically equal, which might be overshadowed by Ghost's PP points. Still, I would not hold that against him. As for shot metrics, Ghost is comfortably better as a positive Corsi player, and his teammates are generally better off playing with him rather than without. Provorov doesn't exactly elevate his teammates' metrics. What is noticeable is that both defensemen drop off without each other. I assume that is due to the other Flyers' defensemen being what they are... Another factor that needs to be taken into account is usage; Ghost faces more favourable matchups and zone starts than Provorov. How big a factor that is, I am not sure about that.

Both are top pairing defensemen, but I value Ghost more. Given the fact that Provorov is 21, that could change soon.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Nevermind this silly Trouba talk, i wanna see Carlson in Philly really bad

 

[SnS]

Agreed

I’m always open to trade players as long as it makes sense. So far I haven’t seen anything that makes sense from a Jets POV.

You guys should target a lesser Rhd, much more affordable. Who would he be replacing from this past year?

Ideally, we are replacing Hagg / Farmer / Gudas. But more than likely, it’s for a 7th D.

Ghost / Provo
Sanheim / xxx
Some combo of Hagg / Farmer / Gudas

We also have myers in the AHL who some feel will be ready.

 

[SnS]

Philadelphia Flyers: Ivan Provorov in Transition - Last Word on Hockey
Line Stats - Natural Stat Trick
Provorov PHI 1718
Gostisbehere PHI 1718

The statistics suggest otherwise; Ghost's transition game is excellent and superior to Provorov's (which is also very good), and when separated from each other, Ghost's game suffers less than Provorov's. Their point production at ES is practically equal, which might be overshadowed by Ghost's PP points. Still, I would not hold that against him. As for shot metrics, Ghost is comfortably better as a positive Corsi player, and his teammates are generally better off playing with him rather than without. Provorov doesn't exactly elevate his teammates' metrics. What is noticeable is that both defensemen drop off without each other. I assume that is due to the other Flyers' defensemen being what they are... Another factor that needs to be taken into account is usage; Ghost faces more favourable matchups and zone starts than Provorov. How big a factor that is, I am not sure about that.

Both are top pairing defensemen, but I value Ghost more. Given the fact that Provorov is 21, that could change soon.

Okay, I’m not arguing with a stat tracker. I’ve watched every game, Ghost gets benched late in games because he’s not defensive enough and gets pP heavy time.

Provo gets those tough minutes with the likes of neutered Gudas, Farmer Andy, and Haggarrrrr. And Provo does what he can to drag those clowns to anything positive.

Provo hardly plays pP time and when he does it’s with the second unit.

 

[SnS]

Nevermind this silly Trouba talk, i wanna see Carlson in Philly really bad

At the price he’s going to be getting, no thanks.

 

[Rebels57]

Petry 2nd for Lethera 1st

You're not getting a 1st for Petry.

You can have Lehtera for free though!

 

[Rebels57]

Matt Read pls

Read is a UFA. Have at him!

 

[x DeCruze]

Philadelphia Flyers: Ivan Provorov in Transition - Last Word on Hockey
Line Stats - Natural Stat Trick
Provorov PHI 1718
Gostisbehere PHI 1718

The statistics suggest otherwise; Ghost's transition game is excellent and superior to Provorov's (which is also very good), and when separated from each other, Ghost's game suffers less than Provorov's. Their point production at ES is practically equal, which might be overshadowed by Ghost's PP points. Still, I would not hold that against him. As for shot metrics, Ghost is comfortably better as a positive Corsi player, and his teammates are generally better off playing with him rather than without. Provorov doesn't exactly elevate his teammates' metrics. What is noticeable is that both defensemen drop off without each other. I assume that is due to the other Flyers' defensemen being what they are... Another factor that needs to be taken into account is usage; Ghost faces more favourable matchups and zone starts than Provorov. How big a factor that is, I am not sure about that.

Both are top pairing defensemen, but I value Ghost more. Given the fact that Provorov is 21, that could change soon.

Then you should easily see in that link you posted that Amac is atrocious and that's who Provorov is paired with when he's not with Ghost. Amac, who lets any opposition forward enter the zone at will.

 

[MardyBum]

Watch the games and see, also look up the stats, when has trouba been a top dman, playing on a 2nd pp that gets no time and still gets the most goals for a dman? Go ahead we will wait

Stats?

Trouba had a better 5v5 :
Corsi,
Rel corsi
GF%
xGF%
RelxGF%
P/60


Moreover, Trouba is top 10 in the NHL in 5v5 P/60 over the last 2 years for dmen with min 2000 minutes played.

Burns
Karlsson
Hamilton
Hedman
Klingberg
Josi
Trouba

Provorov is obviously younger and has a lot of room to grow, but to act like Provorov is "much better" right now is asinine.

 

[Rebels57]

Okay, I’m not arguing with a stat tracker. I’ve watched every game, Ghost gets benched late in games because he’s not defensive enough and gets pP heavy time.

Provo gets those tough minutes with the likes of neutered Gudas, Farmer Andy, and Haggarrrrr. And Provo does what he can to drag those clowns to anything positive.

Provo hardly plays pP time and when he does it’s with the second unit.

Youre wasting your time. We know how good Provorov already is at 21. Who cares if others dont?

 

[Maukkis]

Then you should easily see in that link you posted that Amac is atrocious and that's who Provorov is paired with when he's not with Ghost. Amac, who lets any opposition forward enter the zone at will.

Okay, I’m not arguing with a stat tracker. I’ve watched every game, Ghost gets benched late in games because he’s not defensive enough and gets pP heavy time.

Provo gets those tough minutes with the likes of neutered Gudas, Farmer Andy, and Haggarrrrr. And Provo does what he can to drag those clowns to anything positive.

Provo hardly plays pP time and when he does it’s with the second unit.

That is your loss, then.

I kind of figured out that when partnered with anyone else than Ghost, Provorov would not have much help (and vice versa). But...

...they are each other's most common D partner by a country mile. And based on what I've seen, Manning is not that much better of a partner than MacDonald is.

 

[MardyBum]

Thats not what i was arguing, you said we dont have the assests since we dont wanna part with any PROSPECTS, never said they wouldnt want a roster player, but if the roster player is provy you think hed get than you are insane

Can you reread my post? I never said Provorov for Trouba, I said you guys seem to not want to trade your young players, so you'd be relying on prospects or picks, which won't get it done. Trading Provorov for Trouba makes no sense for the Flyers.

 

[SnS]

That is your loss, then.

I kind of figured out that when partnered with anyone else than Ghost, Provorov would not have much help (and vice versa). But...

...they are each other's most common D partner by a country mile.

It’s not my loss. You need to have a balance with the eye test and stats.

Ghost gets benched late in games, Ghost doesn’t play on the kill.

The point is, we need to add to our defense. Not subtract our best defender.

We are trotting our farmer, haggar and neutered Gudas. That has to change, not our top 2.

 

[Rebels57]

Has there been a less enjoyable topic of conversation the last 3 years than discussing Trouba with Jets fans?

This topic should just be banned at this point

 

[Rebels57]

Can you reread my post? I never said Provorov for Trouba, I said you guys seem to not want to trade your young players, so you'd be relying on prospects or picks, which won't get it done. Trading Provorov for Trouba makes no sense for the Flyers.

They do not make good trade partners right now. Jets wouldnt trade an important dman for futures while they are built to contend. The Flyers only expendable assets are futures. Case closed.

 

[Maukkis]

It’s not my loss. You need to have a balance with the eye test and stats.

Ghost gets benched late in games, Ghost doesn’t play on the kill.

The point is, we need to add to our defense. Not subtract our best defender.

We are trotting our farmer, haggar and neutered Gudas. That has to change, not our top 2.

You absolutely do. You also have to know that your eyes do lie.

As for the second point of yours, that's true and I have been saying that for a while. You're just not doing that by adding Trouba, because there is no trade fit between us two.

 

[SnS]

You absolutely do. You also have to know that your eyes do lie.

And stats do lie as well.

 

[The Madrigal]

Has there been a less enjoyable topic of conversation the last 3 years than discussing Trouba with Jets fans?

This topic should just be banned at this point

I like Trouba a lot and think he is a heck of a player, but yeah. Forget who is better right now for a second (which I still think is Provorov without a doubt) this discussion is about trade value. Provorov is a huge three years younger in terms of development with the difference being age 24 to age 21. Provorov's upside is much larger than Trouba's. In terms of who has higher trade value it's not even close enough to make it worthy of a debate.

 

[SnS]

You absolutely do. You also have to know that your eyes do lie.

As for the second point of yours, that's true and I have been saying that for a while. You're just not doing that by adding Trouba, because there is no trade fit between us two.

And I’ve been saying that for posts now.

 

[Hunter368]

Ideally, we are replacing Hagg / Farmer / Gudas. But more than likely, it’s for a 7th D.

Ghost / Provo
Sanheim / xxx
Some combo of Hagg / Farmer / Gudas

We also have myers in the AHL who some feel will be ready.

You guys should target a 2nd pairing D, multi Flyer fans wanting Trouba who is a top pairing D doesn't match your need.....no point paying more then you need to. Target Myers or someone else out there, they would come much cheaper.

 

[SnS]

You guys should target a 2nd pairing D, multi Flyer fans wanting Trouba who is a top pairing D doesn't match your need.....no point paying more then you need to. Target Myers or someone else out there, they would come much cheaper.

I personally don’t want Tyler myers unless it’s on the cheap, which I don’t see jets fans doing.

I’d rather just ride it out with what we have and keep devolving our young four... Ghost / Provo / Sanheim / P Myers. And just ride out the three awful bums, unless Gudas can somehow become something decent again. But he was definitely a changed man after the ugly slash.

As it’s already been said, I don’t think it’s anything but a depth move. I think hextall knows we are a year or so out, still from becoming real contenders.