Confirmed with Link: Hawks aquire Bowen Byram and Jordan Greenway for 4th overall, 45th overall, and Crevier

[Melrose Munch]

Yes, because Makar will most certainly want to sign here.

And why not? This is the third largest city in America.

 

[u2wojo]

We traded for an actual NHL player and gave up a draft slot that MIGHT have developed into a player as good as Byram is in 4-5 years (with about as equal of a chance of being slightly better or not as good) as our choice at 4OA likely came down to Reid or Carels...both of which are playing in college 2 if not 3 more seasons before they start taking their lumps and going through NHL growing pains. This is a pretty weak draft and #4OA is more like 7 or 8 in a typical draft (you'll get a shot at a good not necessarily great can't miss prospect).

The cost otherwise was a quarter and a couple of dimes when you are looking for a dollar. Crevier is a 3rd pairing guy on an actual competive team despite being among the tallest midgets here. #45OA is the range of pick we include to move up a few slots in the first round. Greenway if all he does is adds a little toughness and pushes Bura out of the lineup (or better yet, out of town) is a win...because I don't care about Wirtz money for one season when we will be no where near the cap. I actually could see Greenway in a contract year being useful...maybe. We consolidated a bunch of assets none of which matter in the long run other than #4 which will take years to actually pay dividends for a much better present day asset and decent chance Byram is the best player long term too. Was the cost "too much"? Maybe in historic terms (as far as value of #4OA in a typical draft year verses a below average one) and maybe in an enviornment not seeing massive cap increase where there are no UFA's of significance that make it to market anymore. The trade market is out of whack....look at Nemec and Kyrou's returns.

 

[statswatcher]

We didn't pay a 1D price though. Not even close.

And yes, you keep saying that I said "he WILL be a 1D", when I didn't.

yes we did, and the contract is going to be a similar overpay as well.

i don't really care what you meant to say by saying nothing at all. the fact of the matter is that if he isn't a 1D, the trade is a failure. full stop. no amount of cope you can offer gets around that.

 

[Hawkaholic]

yes we did, and the contract is going to be a similar overpay as well.

i don't really care what you meant to say by saying nothing at all. the fact of the matter is that if he isn't a 1D, the trade is a failure. full stop. no amount of cope you can offer gets around that.

No, we didn't. A #1 D would cost way more than a top 5 pick, a depth Dman, and a 2nd rounder.

And clearly you do care what I said, since you keep responding.

 

[Chelios]

So you're trading #45 and Crevier to forgo the development timeline and remove a certain level of uncertainty on the pick. Fair enough

This is basically where I am. Didn't like the deal initially, but feel better about it today. I also fully admit I do not follow these draft eligible prospects enough to have an opinion on them, but the way 1sts are flying around the last couple days suggests that teams do not think this is a great draft.

 

[Larmer83]

Here's the best copium I've got that isn't just "it'll be fine": they didn't dip into the league-best (by the reckoning of many) prospect pool at all to make the trade, and #4 would have been used on a D who would be a few years away from being an impact player. So you're trading #45 and Crevier to forgo the development timeline and remove a certain level of uncertainty on the pick. Fair enough

The flipside is that Byram hasn't shown he's the guy they need him to be for this trade to pay off, so you're still hoping for a certain level of improvement that is far from certain to happen, he has a worrisome concussion history, and he needs to be paid and suddenly has a ton of leverage to demand a crazy contract. And value-wise it feels like the Blackhawks paid the cost you'd expect for a guy without those question marks

It just feels like a bad gamble, not a move to put a team over the top but to claw back some respectability. I don't think it cripples the rebuild or dooms the future of the team, pending whatever extension he gets, but I don't think it's a good trade as we stand now. Would love to be wrong

That's it a nutshell for me. Nothing against the player but it was an overpay.

 

[mjd1001]

Here is how you can look at this positively:

Bryam is young and talented offensively (not good in the D-zone but not a trainwreck either).

-He has the potential to not only score 20 goals from the blueline (he had 8 goals in a 20 day stretch last season for Buffalo when Dahlin was out for a bit for Buffalo)

-Even as a '2nd pair' guy for Buffalo he had games logging 24 or near 25 minutes of ice time. (even some with 26-27 minutes)

-He is excellent at defensive zone breakouts. The thing that might help the Hawks forwards the most is having a D-man who can successfully, and QUICKLY get the puck out of the zone and onto the forwards sticks in a fast transition game.

That last point is key. How many other things could you do that would improve the entire offense as much? And who else was available that would do it as good as Bryam might?

On paper it may look like an 'overpay'. It looks good for Buffalo because they don't need what he offers (they already have Dahlin).

But if a good skating, good passing, good stick handling D-man that will help your forwards in the transition game is one of the biggest improvements you can make to your team, a guy who will take up 23-26 minuts of ice time (nearly half the game), Why WOULDN'T you make that deal??

Buffalo may have "won" the deal on paper. And it may be good for them, but guess what? Byram on the Hawks may lead to a much greater increase in the games they win this season (and in future seasons) compared to the position they were in before making the trade.

 

[Hawkaholic]

That's it a nutshell for me. Nothing against the player but it was an overpay.

Yeah, but no one is willingly coming here if we don't improve the team, and no one is waiving a NMC to come here. So they have to overpay to get talent here. If people want talent, this is the cost until we are desirable.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

KD has been after Knies since 2022...there is a 0% chance he didn't offer pick 4 for him...or Robertson

 

[Pez68]

I like Byram. My concern is the contract. When does it get done? Does he sign right away? Does he wait until the season is over and hit FA? The problem with trading for a guy who isn't extended yet is the player and his agent have ALL the leverage. Byram is likely going to be overpaid. Assuming they have a handshake deal and he's signing here right away. And so it begins.....

 

[Dead Meat]

Don’t get the outrage for a winger for Bedard.

You haven't been watching for the past three seasons?

 

[statswatcher]

No, we didn't. A #1 D would cost way more than a top 5 pick, a depth Dman, and a 2nd rounder.

And clearly you do care what I said, since you keep responding.

you don't pay that price for a good #3 that tops out as a #2. you pay that for a guy who will be the guy. you only pay more for a guy like hughes or makar, and there's no question whether byram is that kind of guy.

unlike you, i care to make a point when i say things.

 

[TLEH]

I like Byram. My concern is the contract. When does it get done? Does he sign right away? Does he wait until the season is over and hit FA? The problem with trading for a guy who isn't extended yet is the player and his agent have ALL the leverage. Byram is likely going to be overpaid. Assuming they have a handshake deal and he's signing here right away. And so it begins.....

Overpay for him, have to overpay him.

 

[Hawkaholic]

you don't pay that price for a good #3 that tops out as a #2. you pay that for a guy who will be the guy. you only pay more for a guy like hughes or makar, and there's no question whether byram is that kind of guy.

unlike you, i care to make a point when i say things.

Why not? And how do you know what he tops out as? A guy who you know will be the guy is costing a LOT more than what we paid.

You haven't made a single point yet.

 

[bwanajamba]

He has shown he can play the 2nd most minutes on a legit playoff team and excel at it.

A top 5 pick (the first one traded in 17 years), a mid 2nd, and a roster player (plus accepting a cap dump) for a #2 doesn't feel like great value if that's all he is. More than willing to see how it plays out before declaring anything definitive but I do see why people are unhappy.

 

[statswatcher]

Why not?

top four defensemen can be had for less than a top five pick. so can lesser top pair guys. they can also be had at less than the contract byram is going to be able to demand.

And how do you know what he tops out as?

i don't. i know he has never been a 1D, and if he doesn't top out as a 1D, the trade is a failure. the only mitigating circumstance is if he signs a good deal, which we have very little reason to believe will happen.

 

[BHawk21]

Shocker but the more you look at it the more you cant see the vision.

Its time to start winning. We dont have the 2nd star that you need to win just yet but you might just have to get a lot better to lure one in.

Free Agency will determine a lot of what I think about this trade.

If you can add Trouba/Carlson/Andersson or even Gudas/Kulak/Oleksiak

Then we have a good D core with a chance for a great D core.


I do wonder if this puts us closer on Tuch as well.


Kantserov-Bedard-Tuch
Bertuzzi-Frondell-Lardis
Moore-Nazar-Teravainen
Greenway-Greene-Donato
Mangiapane

Byram-Trouba
Vlasic-Levshunov
Kaiser-Rinzel

Knight
Commesso

Thats a real chance at playoffs.

 

[Hawkaholic]

top four defensemen can be had for less than a top five pick. so can lesser top pair guys. they can also be had at less than the contract byram is going to be able to demand.

i don't. if he doesn't top out as a 1D, the trade is a failure. the only mitigating circumstance is if he signs a good deal, which we have very little reason to believe will happen.

He was a top 2 Dman for a legit playoff team. lol

Show me a 25 year old top 2 dman that was traded for less. I couldn't care less about his contract at this point, because it isn't signed.

He can be a #2 Dman and it would be fine. He doesn't need to be Keith.

 

[mjd1001]

KD has been after Knies since 2022...there is a 0% chance he didn't offer pick 4 for him...or Robertson

I really don't get the league wide fascination with Knies. He is a product of playing with Austin Matthews.

Its been a few years now, but take him away from Matthews and he is an average, maybe a below average forward. And I don't mean putting him on a 4th line. He has spent a good number of minutes with guys like Nylander and Tavares. Yet anytime he is not with Matthews, his scoring is down and his defensive zone liabilities show up.

You can see it with your own eyes when you watch him, and his analytics (expected goals for vs allowed, scoring chances, shots, and others) are well below average.

 

[Hawkaholic]

A top 5 pick (the first one traded in 17 years), a mid 2nd, and a roster player (plus accepting a cap dump) for a #2 doesn't feel like great value if that's all he is. More than willing to see how it plays out before declaring anything definitive but I do see why people are unhappy.

People are delusional if you think you are getting a Norris caliber Dman at age 25 without a NMC for what we just gave up, completely delusionsal.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

I really don't get the league wide fascination with Knies. He is a product of playing with Austin Matthews.

Its been a few years now, but take him away from Matthews and he is an average, maybe a below average forward. And I don't mean putting him on a 4th line. He has spent a good number of minutes with guys like Nylander and Tavares. Yet anytime he is not with Matthews, his scoring is down and his defensive zone liabilities show up.

You can see it with your own eyes when you watch him, and his analytics (expected goals for vs allowed, scoring chances, shots, and others) are well below average.

for Davidson guessing the power forward element...they've been taking swings at rounding out their forward group with more size - see 2025 with Frondell, Nestrasil and West...but yeah there have been more than a few posters here that have pushed back against Knies because he doesn't have elite production despite playing with Matthews and Nylander

 

[Pez68]

top four defensemen can be had for less than a top five pick. so can lesser top pair guys. they can also be had at less than the contract byram is going to be able to demand.

i don't. i know he has never been a 1D, and if he doesn't top out as a 1D, the trade is a failure. the only mitigating circumstance is if he signs a good deal, which we have very little reason to believe will happen.

The trade is a failure if he's not a 1D? Lol. The trade is only a failure if he doesn't sign, or if he cannot be a top pairing defenseman. Both of those things are unlikely. He's certainly going to be overpaid, because they have all the leverage here.

This is the going rate for a young, top pairing defenseman. What are the odds that the #4 pick this season ever turns into a defenseman as good as Byram? 20%? 50%?

 

[MTU34]

They didn't really.

I have no idea where you came up with that trade package.

They didn't really.

I have no idea where you came up with that trade package.

It’s the rough equivalence of what Montreal paid for Dobson……

 

[Panzerspitze]

Can't they still move Byram at the TDL in the upcoming season if he fails to agree to an extension before then? Heck, Carolina flipped Rantanen for Stankoven & co. after acquiring him in-season.

 

[Hattrick Kane]

Didn’t the Hawks already get warned for tampering because of the Mikheyev thing? I wonder if they’re being extra careful with a Byram extension since it can’t be signed until July 1st.

I know it seems silly, but the NHL is a silly place.