Hamilton Bulldogs & Wheeling Nailers 2013-2014 Part 3

[QuebecPride]

I think it breaks down further to any Canadian school. Most guys who leave junior want to keep playing hockey and once u play a game of junior you can't play in the NCAA while u can in the CIS. A lot of junior players attend university while they're playing to. I think Mccaron takes classes at Western

I can't see the Rimouski footing the bill for Yale or Harvard or a top U.S university after junior. Maybe they would, but most junior teams dont break even.

Bingo.

 

[Fazkovsky]

Even some first round pick college players finish their full 4 years before turning pro, it means a lot to them. What if they don't succeed in pro hockey? Look at Blake Geoffrion, his career as a professional player is odne, whats next? Does he have a degree?

 

[yoyo999]

That's why I'd give him a go next season on a 1-way $550k salary. Maybe he looks bad enough at some point (incl. in camp) to get waived. Or maybe he slots in somewhere, depending on how our summer UFA shopping goes.

He seems pretty pedestrian in the AHL... he's about 5th amongst forwards... we know St.Pierre, Dumont, Blunden aren't going to be NHLers.

So he's playing below the level of career AHL'ers Martin St-Pierre and Mike Blunden, yet he deserves a 550k contract ?!?! Why? Cause he was picked in the first round?
Parceque c'est un gas de chez nous qui parle francais?

Are some of these posts real? Where am I?

 

[JuicyHam]

So he's playing below the level of career AHL'ers Martin St-Pierre and Mike Blunden, yet he deserves a 550k contract ?!?! Why? Cause he was picked in the first round?
Parceque c'est un gas de chez nous qui parle francais?

Are some of these posts real? Where am I?

I think your being punk'd

 

[QuebecPride]

So he's playing below the level of career AHL'ers Martin St-Pierre and Mike Blunden, yet he deserves a 550k contract ?!?! Why? Cause he was picked in the first round?
Parceque c'est un gas de chez nous qui parle francais?

Are some of these posts real? Where am I?

Louis Leblanc has played better than St-Pierre and Blunden at the NHL level. Some players play better in the NHL than in the AHL. He suggests that since Leblanc has never looked bad nor useless at the NHL level that Habs should give him a shot next season. That's what he meant. No need to be condescending.

 

[Wats]

I don't get Leblanc, he looks much better in NHL than AHL.

 

[Whitesnake]

I don't get Leblanc, he looks much better in NHL than AHL.

Means that he's solely a complementary player. And since the teamates he has is better in the NHL, he looks better complementing better players....

 

[QuebecPride]

Means that he's solely a complementary player. And since the teamates he has is better in the NHL, he looks better complementing better players....

It's certainly a disappointment to get such a player in the 1st round, but does that mean you have to get rid of him?

 

[Whitesnake]

It's certainly a disappointment to get such a player in the 1st round, but does that mean you have to get rid of him?

At one point, it will. When there's not a lot of progression and in the end, when he can't beat the 12 guys you have, you need to move on and try to see if there's not another guy in the same situation that could come in and help your team. And then, you also need to think of the player and give him a chance to have a 2nd chance with a team that doesn't know the players that much. 'Cause a team who don't see that much progression from players and that has to live with it every single of the year, become frustrated about it and frankly, the guy stops having the favour of anybody in the team. Being traded might mean clean slate for everyone.

Let,s have some fun and watch at the 2009 draft and see what kind of swap we could make that could help us....What about Scott Glennie? Could it be the type of guy that could get his career going with another team? Tim Erixon? I remember being extremely high on the guy. A 6'2'' D....why not? Somehow....I have the feeling that we will land Simon Després. Maybe Drew Shore who I can't believe can't have another level to his game. Any chance we had something else and get Jeremy Morin? Unless while we might be losing one Russian on the back end, that we could try to land another one in.....Dmitri Orlov? Yes, I know...people were thinking of Kulikov...I have no problem with that....but it will take way more than Leblanc...How about Ben Hanowski? There is a few options that are not too far fetched. Most of them have average years in the AHL. Coming from the same draft.....might need a fresh start. For a few others....we might want to add something else to Leblanc, but it might not be too tough to get. In the end, it might not end up in a fairy tale for us....but how about we try?

One guy I wouldn't want....Jordan Caron. Didn't want him then....not interested in the project now. Which means.....it wouldn't surprised me if Bergevin makes that move.... I was also REALLY high on Charles-Olivier Roussel....no need to go in that direction too. Really dissapointing by his non-progression.

In the end, from that draft, there are a few guys who were already traded mostly for non-performance, like MPS, Kassian, Holland and some more. So yes....4 years after being draft....if there's no signs of progression, it might be time to go. But yes...something it might take more years to players, reasons why there's a few stories of guys that do well after going through a few teams.

 

[QuebecPride]

At one point, it will. When there's not a lot of progression and in the end, when he can't beat the 12 guys you have, you need to move on and try to see if there's not another guy in the same situation that could come in and help your team. And then, you also need to think of the player and give him a chance to have a 2nd chance with a team that doesn't know the players that much. 'Cause a team who don't see that much progression from players and that has to live with it every single of the year, become frustrated about it and frankly, the guy stops having the favour of anybody in the team. Being traded might mean clean slate for everyone.

Let,s have some fun and watch at the 2009 draft and see what kind of swap we could make that could help us....What about Scott Glennie? Could it be the type of guy that could get his career going with another team? Tim Erixon? I remember being extremely high on the guy. A 6'2'' D....why not? Somehow....I have the feeling that we will land Simon Després. Maybe Drew Shore who I can't believe can't have another level to his game. Any chance we had something else and get Jeremy Morin? Unless while we might be losing one Russian on the back end, that we could try to land another one in.....Dmitri Orlov? Yes, I know...people were thinking of Kulikov...I have no problem with that....but it will take way more than Leblanc...How about Ben Hanowski? There is a few options that are not too far fetched. Most of them have average years in the AHL. Coming from the same draft.....might need a fresh start. For a few others....we might want to add something else to Leblanc, but it might not be too tough to get. In the end, it might not end up in a fairy tale for us....but how about we try?

One guy I wouldn't want....Jordan Caron. Didn't want him then....not interested in the project now. Which means.....it wouldn't surprised me if Bergevin makes that move.... I was also REALLY high on Charles-Olivier Roussel....no need to go in that direction too. Really dissapointing by his non-progression.

In the end, from that draft, there are a few guys who were already traded mostly for non-performance, like MPS, Kassian, Holland and some more. So yes....4 years after being draft....if there's no signs of progression, it might be time to go. But yes...something it might take more years to players, reasons why there's a few stories of guys that do well after going through a few teams.

Thanks for your input, it's always appreciated!

You think we could have Després for Leblanc straight up? Where do I sign

 

[Treb]

I think it breaks down further to any Canadian school. Most guys who leave junior want to keep playing hockey and once u play a game of junior you can't play in the NCAA while u can in the CIS. A lot of junior players attend university while they're playing to. I think Mccaron takes classes at Western

I can't see the Rimouski footing the bill for Yale or Harvard or a top U.S university after junior. Maybe they would, but most junior teams dont break even.

Also important to know that if he didn't go for a year at Harvard, there is no certainty he could have come back. Now that he did a year, Harvard doors are open to him if he wants to go back.

 

[yoyo999]

Also important to know that if he didn't go for a year at Harvard, there is no certainty he could have come back. Now that he did a year, Harvard doors are open to him if he wants to go back.

Academically, you are probably right. Especially cause it wasn't long ago that he did his first year. I think I remember reading he took classes at McGill when he played in the Q, so some credits may transfer.

But financially, he is pooched. He'll have to pay for it himself. So, in that sense no. The door may not always be open.

 

[Blind Gardien]

So he's playing below the level of career AHL'ers Martin St-Pierre and Mike Blunden, yet he deserves a 550k contract ?!?! Why? Cause he was picked in the first round?

Yes. In part. The other part is that he actually looks like an NHL-calibre player when he plays in the NHL. Put the two together, and it seems like there might still be some value to redeem with him. Why was he picked in the first round? Because he was an awesome prospect with tons of skill and a seemingly bright hockey future. He played on Team Canada, piled up awards and accolades, etc. There was something there. And then when he does get a look in the NHL, he doesn't look out of place. It's a two-way street... the Habs have an investment in him and it would be nice to get something out of that investment. It doesn't seem like the AHL is doing anything for him. For whatever reason. So see if he responds with a 1-way NHL contract and an opportunity. Last chance. It's not really a reward, it's more like the ultimate final test.

Who knows, he might even turn down the 1-way $550k deal, anyway, since his QO is much higher than that. He doesn't always seem to react the way you'd expect with the options available to him.

 

[FisherKing]

Yes. In part. The other part is that he actually looks like an NHL-calibre player when he plays in the NHL. Put the two together, and it seems like there might still be some value to redeem with him. Why was he picked in the first round? Because he was an awesome prospect with tons of skill and a seemingly bright hockey future. He played on Team Canada, piled up awards and accolades, etc. There was something there. And then when he does get a look in the NHL, he doesn't look out of place. It's a two-way street... the Habs have an investment in him and it would be nice to get something out of that investment. It doesn't seem like the AHL is doing anything for him. For whatever reason. So see if he responds with a 1-way NHL contract and an opportunity. Last chance. It's not really a reward, it's more like the ultimate final test.

I agree, especially the bolded part. From what I've seen of Leblanc in his call-ups, he has proved he can PLAY in the NHL. The bigger question which seems to remain unanswered by Leblanc at this time is whether he can PRODUCE in the NHL which of course is the expectation for a 1st round pick.

 

[Blind Gardien]

I agree, especially the bolded part. From what I've seen of Leblanc in his call-ups, he has proved he can PLAY in the NHL. The bigger question which seems to remain unanswered by Leblanc at this time is whether he can PRODUCE in the NHL which of course is the expectation for a 1st round pick.

Well, it's the expectation for a player with his dimensions and background, anyway. It's not necessarily the case for every 1st rounder.

Funny thing is, he doesn't really look like he has a lot of "energy" or defensive acumen either, even at the AHL level, say. I acknowledge it's hard to figure out exactly where he fits in a lineup. He seems to work the boards well and make plays in the offensive zone in the NHL, and be generically competent in other aspects of the game. But it hasn't translated into production. His size and lack of strength are strikes against him as a cycling winger in the NHL. And against him as a checking line player. Another reason I'd consider him on the 1-way deal for next season is that if he's on the team, it may give him opportunities in a variety of roles, including with some of the more offensive players when injuries stack up.

 

[bsl]

Don't you think you might be overreacting a tad little bit? You use one example to judge a whole institution.

Also, people chose universities based on the classes, the teachers, but also the reputation of the University. They want to know how their paper will be seen by companies/employers once they get their degree. This is even more true in the United States.

I should have said that I was talking about the professional and undergraduate programs. I imagine the graduate programs are still very good. I wrote the post late, and I stand by my opinion of Harvard in undergraduate and professional programs. Mediocre, and slave to foreign fees.

 

[bsl]

Too bad McGill did not teach you critical thinking and the limitations of a small sample size.

http://www.topuniversities.com/univ...region=+country=+faculty=+stars=false+search=

If you choose the aggregate score, it comes in at #2. If you choose rankings by "number of citations by faculty" Harvard is #4, albeit tied at 100% with the top 8.

If you opt for this one, Harvard comes in at #1.
http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2013.html
Home>> ARWU2013>> Methodology
RankingMethodologyStatistics
Selection of Universities
Ranking Criteria and Weights
Definition of Indicators
Data Sources
Selection of Universities
ARWU considers every university that has any Nobel Laureates, Fields Medalists, Highly Cited Researchers, or papers published in Nature or Science. In addition, universities with significant amount of papers indexed by Science Citation Index-Expanded (SCIE) and Social Science Citation Index (SSCI) are also included. In total, more than 1000 universities are actually ranked and the best 500 are published on the web.

Ranking Criteria and Weights
Universities are ranked by several indicators of academic or research performance, including alumni and staff winning Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals, highly cited researchers, papers published in Nature and Science, papers indexed in major citation indices, and the per capita academic performance of an institution. For each indicator, the highest scoring institution is assigned a score of 100, and other institutions are calculated as a percentage of the top score. The distribution of data for each indicator is examined for any significant distorting effect; standard statistical techniques are used to adjust the indicator if necessary. Scores for each indicator are weighted as shown below to arrive at a final overall score for an institution. The highest scoring institution is assigned a score of 100, and other institutions are calculated as a percentage of the top score. An institution's rank reflects the number of institutions that sit above it.

Indicators and Weights for ARWU
Criteria Indicator Code Weight
Quality of Education Alumni of an institution winning Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals Alumni 10%
Quality of Faculty Staff of an institution winning Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals Award 20%
Highly cited researchers in 21 broad subject categories HiCi 20%
Research Output Papers published in Nature and Science* N&S 20%
Papers indexed in Science Citation Index-expanded and Social Science Citation Index PUB 20%
Per Capita Performance Per capita academic performance of an institution PCP 10%
Total 100%

Evidently, they neglected to poll your boss .

Your post supports my argument. It is absurd.

 

[yoyo999]

Yes. In part. The other part is that he actually looks like an NHL-calibre player when he plays in the NHL. Put the two together, and it seems like there might still be some value to redeem with him. Why was he picked in the first round? Because he was an awesome prospect with tons of skill and a seemingly bright hockey future. He played on Team Canada, piled up awards and accolades, etc. There was something there. And then when he does get a look in the NHL, he doesn't look out of place. It's a two-way street... the Habs have an investment in him and it would be nice to get something out of that investment. It doesn't seem like the AHL is doing anything for him. For whatever reason. So see if he responds with a 1-way NHL contract and an opportunity. Last chance. It's not really a reward, it's more like the ultimate final test.

Who knows, he might even turn down the 1-way $550k deal, anyway, since his QO is much higher than that. He doesn't always seem to react the way you'd expect with the options available to him.

So then shouldn't Tim Tebow be int he NFL?

He won 2 national titles, a heisman trophy, dominated at every level, picked in the first round, even won a playoff game. He didn't look out of place......Why isn't he in the NFL?

Because in order for him to be successful teams would have to create a role for him that would highlight his strengths. Implying, he requires to be put in that once in a lifetime ideal situation where everything, mostly out of his control, comes together.

So effectively, Tim Tebow can't create his own success because his talent alone simply can't do that, regardless of where he is put. He's not worth the trouble and really doesn't have a place. Just because you give him the top receivers, will not make him automatically better or improve his throwing.

Louis Leblanc is the same. Playing him with better players will not make him better. Teams will not go out of their way to create a role for him and he needs to show he can be put in any situation and not have to rely on everything else coming together.
In the NHL, he's looked exactly the same as he has in the AHL. Mediocre, ineffective, bland, slow. He may have a bit more jump cause of the excitement of the NHL, but he's the same player.

 

[FisherKing]

Well, it's the expectation for a player with his dimensions and background, anyway. It's not necessarily the case for every 1st rounder.

Funny thing is, he doesn't really look like he has a lot of "energy" or defensive acumen either, even at the AHL level, say. I acknowledge it's hard to figure out exactly where he fits in a lineup. He seems to work the boards well and make plays in the offensive zone in the NHL, and be generically competent in other aspects of the game. But it hasn't translated into production. His size and lack of strength are strikes against him as a cycling winger in the NHL. And against him as a checking line player. Another reason I'd consider him on the 1-way deal for next season is that if he's on the team, it may give him opportunities in a variety of roles, including with some of the more offensive players when injuries stack up.

Very true. I have to say that, while there are weaknesses and limitations in his game (such as those you have pointed out) I just can't help but think this guy has an NHL career in him, IF HE WANTS IT!!! And THAT is a pretty big "if", or so it seems. While clearly not projecting as a "high end" prospect at this time, he at least projects to me as a "decent" prospect, but maybe I slipped on my "rose coloured glasses" by mistake. Anyway, given all the variables, your suggestion of a small one-way deal might be a possibility. Certainly something worth considering. IMHO he's still has value as a prospect and perhaps a bit more trade value than some here seem to think. In some ways he's a real , for me at least. Then again no one ever confused my intellect with Einstein's.

 

[FisherKing]

...in order for him to be successful teams would have to create a role for him that would highlight his strengths. Implying, he requires to be put in that once in a lifetime ideal situation where everything, mostly out of his control, comes together.

Why did I think of Desharnais when I read this? Hmmm...strange...

 

[Goldthorpe]

Why did I think of Desharnais when I read this? Hmmm...strange...

LOL I thought of the exvy same thing. IMHO this represent more the Desharnais situation than Leblanc's.

I'm also not sure of where Leblanc fits in the lineup, probably on a third line but it's hard to know. But I don't think the habs are going to shape their team for him any time soon.

 

[yoyo999]

Why did I think of Desharnais when I read this? Hmmm...strange...

You're right, the Desharnais situation is similar.

However, David Desharnais was a 100pt player in the ECHL and was league rookie of the year and MVP in the same season.
He then put up AHL seasons of 58pts, 78pts and 45pts in 35 games.

David Desharnais got HIMSELF going and showed he was clearly to good for those leagues and was ready for the next step. Something Louis has not done.

David Desharnais has gotten by on his talent and stepped it up when he needed to.

That's why he is in the NHL and LL is not.

 

[bcv]

Your post supports my argument. It is absurd.

No, it absolutely doesn't.

 

[FisherKing]

You're right, the Desharnais situation is similar.

However, David Desharnais was a 100pt player in the ECHL and was league rookie of the year and MVP in the same season.
He then put up AHL seasons of 58pts, 78pts and 45pts in 35 games.

So then shouldn't Tim Tebow be int he NFL? He won 2 national titles, a heisman trophy, dominated at every level, picked in the first round, even won a playoff game. He didn't look out of place......Why isn't he in the NFL?

Again, remarkable similarities doncha think?

 

[Guilliam]

Give Leblanc a shot as the 13th forward next year.

He hasn't shown enough to be a regular at this point but he'd be a good reserve forward because you could fit him on any given line for a reduced amount of time.

Meanwhile he also gets a lot of training time and the team is buying time in order to see if he has a future with them and they avoid losing him on waivers for nothing.