Proposal: Habs - Avs, Habs — Bruins

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Habs Halifax

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Even at 50% AVV, this is still price that hasn't played a game all year and who knows if he will.

I think that Price is not traded until he is playing and healthy again. Nobody expects this trade to happen prior to that. If they do expect it, that's the unreasonable part.

However, a healthy Price playing again and available at 50% retention is worth more value than what you see on HF boards.
 
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Habs Halifax

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Habs fans have been claiming the team is worthless without Price for years

That's not a believe from just Habs fans. It's a believe from many outside of Montreal as well. Look at the comments we got in last year's playoffs. "The only reason why you are on a run is because of Price". Don't pretend you didn't see those comments and/or thought this yourself.

You've been a Price devalue poster for many years so we can't really trust your opinion on this. Way to bias on one end of the scale to get an honest unbias opinion.

And for the record, I don't think all Avs fans think like you do so I won't return the favor of trying to group all your fellow fans into what you think. Why? Cause that would be disingenuous and acting ignorant towards an entire fan base on purpose. o_O
 

Habs Halifax

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As a Habs fan, I apologize for all the silly offers of Price to Colorado. Usually cut the return for Price by half and it would be vaguely worth discussing.

I don't think it's insane to try and see a fit there, but it seems like fellow Habs fans don't realize the extent to which that contract is an issue, or that goalies just don't fetch that much overall.

Personally, I rather not trade Price to the Avs anyways. Rather talk to the Oilers cause they have been way more respectful for the most part and I rather see them have a cup edge over the Avs (if the Habs and Oilers can come to agreement on a trade). Not saying all Avs fans are acting the same either. And I am not a fan of this trade idea as well. What would be fair with the Avs for Price at 50% retention? I'll pass on that conversation based on the general treatment Price is getting in this thread. Not worth the time but I will review and defend Price's value when I see value trash narratives.

Price is a special star in net. Way too many fans treating him like he is meh and don't turn the needle. If the Habs make him available at 50% retention and Price is wanting to go to a contender when he is healthy again, this will draw a lot of interest no doubt in my mind. Others can disagree if they wish.
 

IWantSakicAsMyGM

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That's not a believe from just Habs fans. It's a believe from many outside of Montreal as well. Look at the comments we got in last year's playoffs. "The only reason why you are on a run is because of Price". Don't pretend you didn't see those comments and/or thought this yourself.

You've been a Price devalue poster for many years so we can't really trust your opinion on this. Way to bias on one end of the scale to get an honest unbias opinion.

And for the record, I don't think all Avs fans think like you do so I won't return the favor of trying to group all your fellow fans into what you think. o_O

Considering you once again found something to get mad about, and completely ignored the part of my post that explains the issues with trading for Price, I don't really care what you think. Until you can provide a rational response to my questions, you should take you own advice and stop talking to me.
 
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ottawa

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The same Price who still hasn't played a game this year and who knows if he ever recovers from his current issues. If it was only as simple as a surgery.

Did you see Price in the playoffs? Him returning to regular play isn't really a concern.

He said he's passed his issues, only he knows that and has no reason to lie.

You're looking for a fire where there is none.
 
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Peter Peckerwood

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Did you see Price in the playoffs? Him returning to regular play isn't really a concern.

He said he's passed his issues, only he knows that and has no reason to lie.

You're looking for a fire where there is none.

I guess we'll find out over the term, huh? Not just this year. That's the point. It is the price for Price that is the issue.
Habs fans don't seem able to differentiate that from strictly a healthy player perspective.
Does a rebuilding or reloading team want to retain on that contract for that term with those terms?

We shall see, but if the Habs want to rid themselves of the contract, to me that is essentially saying exactly the same thing other fans are saying about trading for him a taking it on. Are you Habs fans mad at your management as much as you are mad at various posters on here for wanting to trade Price/not trade for Price?
 

IWantSakicAsMyGM

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Did you see Price in the playoffs? Him returning to regular play isn't really a concern.

He said he's passed his issues, only he knows that and has no reason to lie.

You're looking for a fire where there is none.

Is his regular play the 22 games he played in the playoffs where a lot of things went as well as possible, or the 4 consecutive regular seasons where he's been inconsistent and only ranks 39th in SV% among goalies with at least 50 games played (tied with Devan Dubnyk and Adin Hill)?
 

pth2

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... What would be fair with the Avs for Price at 50% retention? I'll pass on that conversation based on the general treatment Price is getting in this thread. Not worth the time but I will review and defend Price's value when I see value trash narratives.
...
If Price is moved, I'm not expecting any household names in return. Ignoring whoever is added to make the cap work, I'd be expecting a middle 6 forward or middle pairing D along with unimpressive futures (say a pick in the 20 to 40 range).

The kind of return I'd be hoping for would be stalled kids who need to go to a lesser team to get ice time - equivalent to Danault or Gorges when we got them. But these are the kind of guys that HF people won't offer, they'll want to move vets to make room for the kids.
 

Habs Halifax

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If Price is moved, I'm not expecting any household names in return. Ignoring whoever is added to make the cap work, I'd be expecting a middle 6 forward or middle pairing D along with unimpressive futures (say a pick in the 20 to 40 range).

The kind of return I'd be hoping for would be stalled kids who need to go to a lesser team to get ice time - equivalent to Danault or Gorges when we got them. But these are the kind of guys that HF people won't offer, they'll want to move vets to make room for the kids.

Same here. I'm expecting 1/2 year cap dumps to help the other teams cap and all my valuable pieces in return are picks and prospects who have not turned pro yet. Asking for youth who are either on the NHL roster or close to it in the AHL is not a good strategy cause our leverage is good but not that good (Price at 50% retention). Those teams who are thinking about how Price can give them an edge are thinking about how their team projects in the next 4 years. And NHL ready prospects is how you stay under the cap or help fill holes.
 

Habs Halifax

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Then keep him

The conversation is deeper than the asking price in this thread. The context being provided is about how some others think Price does not turn the needle for a contender while others are saying his playoff stats and career resume are proven. Lets not pretend this is only something Habs fans have seen with Price.

You can deny the trade idea. That's fair. But ignoring his resume and the latest playoff stats is disingenuous. Cause if his playoff stats were bad (like Patch), that context would be spitted right back at us over and over again as reasons to devalue him. Reality
 

AslanRH

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Avs should just go for a proven winner like Quick.
His numbers aren't great recently, but he has been on a semi to fully rebuilding team for a while. His last playoff numbers show he could make the road to the cup an easy one for the Avs
 

McJedi

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Did you see Price in the playoffs? Him returning to regular play isn't really a concern.

He said he's passed his issues, only he knows that and has no reason to lie.

You're looking for a fire where there is none.
An addict is telling everyone he’s past his addiction issues. Well…. That isn’t even worth the paper it’s not even printed on. Addicts are never deceitful or liars either.

if the Habs were so truly bad in front of Price, it stands to reason the Habs shouldn’t expect to get much for any of those supposedly awful players like Gallagher, Toffoli, Romanov, Caufield, Chairot and the rest playing in front of him. So while expecting a huge return for Price retained is put out there, time to lower the expectations on the dregs in front of him….
Per Habs fans words in this thread.
 

McJedi

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Avs should just go for a proven winner like Quick.
His numbers aren't great recently, but he has been on a semi to fully rebuilding team for a while. His last playoff numbers show he could make the road to the cup an easy one for the Avs
Avs should roll with Kuemper and Frankie. They are presently the #3 seed in the west and trending up. zero reason to make any significant roster moves. Winning the presidents trophy is a fools errand. Just get into the playoffs as healthy as possible and playing well.
 

AslanRH

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Avs should roll with Kuemper and Frankie. They are presently the #3 seed in the west and trending up. zero reason to make any significant roster moves. Winning the presidents trophy is a fools errand. Just get into the playoffs as healthy as possible and playing well.

Should have used the sarcasm font I guess...
 

Boondock

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The conversation is deeper than the asking price in this thread. The context being provided is about how some others think Price does not turn the needle for a contender while others are saying his playoff stats and career resume are proven. Lets not pretend this is only something Habs fans have seen with Price.

You can deny the trade idea. That's fair. But ignoring his resume and the latest playoff stats is disingenuous. Cause if his playoff stats were bad (like Patch), that context would be spitted right back at us over and over again as reasons to devalue him. Reality
This isn't true. The entirety of this thread is that the asking price is too high and the other critiques are examples of why the asking price shouldn't be that high. I have seen multiple posters (Mtl fans) asking for 2 x 1sts and 1st round prospects or a 1st, A prospect and B prospect (I would argue that a B prospect is typically a late 1st type prospect - Pelletier for example). These asks are the equivalent of 3 x first round picks or more. So a team needs to be willing to take on Price at whatever his cost is, right now its $10.5 for 4.5 years. Will Mtl retain? no one knows so this is going to greatly impact Price's value. I don't see a team being willing to eat $5.25 million over that time period in dead cap. Second option would be to have a 3rd team eat some salary - how many 3rd party transactions have a team eating multiple years? To this point I don't think there are any teams eating multiple years as the 3rd party cap team. This is probably a pretty good indicator that teams aren't falling over themselves to use 1 of their retention spots for 4.5 years in order to get a 3rd round pick. Now with the retention issue not really resolved, Price has a NMC - would he waive it? People are speculating that Price doesn't want to stay in Mtl for a re-build, but no one knows exactly what that looks like, or if he will limit the destinations he is willing to go to, so once again this adds a dimension that complicates the process. So those 2-3 issues are the most important items that will impact Price's cost of acquisition but then there are other items - recovery from off season surgery - how long will he take to get back to 100% playing capacity, is there any longer term affects? Price has been dealing with personal issues, where is he with these? Is his recovery a life long pursuit? Will this concern for his wellness impact his availability in season 1, 2, 3, 4...... - these are real questions when dealing with mental health or addiction issues. Price is 34 years old, his contract will take him until he is in his late 30's - will Price still be a starter in 2,3,4 years. His regular season stats have been average, yes he played great during the playoff run last year but he has had some issues since then and is he over them completely and still able to play at that level? Will age reduce his effectiveness, will injuries be more of a concern as he ages?

So teams that are going to look into acquiring Price need to ask themselves a lot of questions as they pertain to Price's ability to play at an elite level moving forward. This isn't a slight on Price, but a reality of professional sports. Does the risk and cost in assets to acquire correlate? I could see there being no interest in Price at full cap hit, and I could see the Habs not wanting to retain very much for the length of the contract. So some of these asks for multiple high end cost controlled assets seems to not take into account the impact on the acquiring team. Luongo, with term was traded for a goalie that was seen as being a draft miss and was in the AHL (Markstrom, yes he turned into a good goalie, but he was waived even after the trade - Canucks could have lost Marky for nothing) and a 3rd line winger (Shawn Matthias). I don't see the big, multi-asset type deal for Price. This is all just my opinion so I could be very wrong, but this is the way I see it.
 

McJedi

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Should have used the sarcasm font I guess...
Nah. That’s for those bozo Habs fans that keep trying to cram the awful Price contract down our throats. Those guys have a bad and long rebuild coming with very little that is actually tradeable off their roster.
 

ottawa

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I guess we'll find out over the term, huh? Not just this year. That's the point. It is the price for Price that is the issue.
Habs fans don't seem able to differentiate that from strictly a healthy player perspective.
Does a rebuilding or reloading team want to retain on that contract for that term with those terms?

We shall see, but if the Habs want to rid themselves of the contract, to me that is essentially saying exactly the same thing other fans are saying about trading for him a taking it on. Are you Habs fans mad at your management as much as you are mad at various posters on here for wanting to trade Price/not trade for Price?

You didn't bring up the price at all, read your post again.

You just wasted my time and I didn't even read past the bolded...I'm assuming the rest is also a waste of time.
 

GirardSpinorama

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The conversation is deeper than the asking price in this thread. The context being provided is about how some others think Price does not turn the needle for a contender while others are saying his playoff stats and career resume are proven. Lets not pretend this is only something Habs fans have seen with Price.

You can deny the trade idea. That's fair. But ignoring his resume and the latest playoff stats is disingenuous. Cause if his playoff stats were bad (like Patch), that context would be spitted right back at us over and over again as reasons to devalue him. Reality

If the playoff stats/resume mattered that much, the Habs' wouldn't have exposed him and the kraken would have been happy to take him. Why risk losing that big of an asset for free. We have two teams who obviously don't view price having the value that Hab fans are asking.
 

ottawa

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Is his regular play the 22 games he played in the playoffs where a lot of things went as well as possible, or the 4 consecutive regular seasons where he's been inconsistent and only ranks 39th in SV% among goalies with at least 50 games played (tied with Devan Dubnyk and Adin Hill)?

Price just needs to get you to the playoffs even if he sucks on the way there...he's arguably the best playoff goalie in the league (top 3 at worst).

It'd be a bad trade if he goes to a bottom feeder.

If the playoff stats/resume mattered that much, the Habs' wouldn't have exposed him and the kraken would be happy to take him.


The habs exposed him and said he'll need surgery, Seattle was leaning towards him but his "surgery" put a question mark on him. Literally everyone understands this except you. I'm literally talking to a wall right now.

Report: Carey Price Injury Complicates Expansion Draft
Carey Price's uncertain injury status complicates Kraken's decision
 
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ottawa

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Then keep him

Ok, and stay out of this thread of it triggers you so much?

Habs fans have nothing to prove about his value (nor can we) until he gets traded. If Gorton trades him, I'm sure he's not doing it for pennies on the dollar...we're not short on cap space and can easily ride out his contract.
 

ottawa

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An addict is telling everyone he’s past his addiction issues. Well…. That isn’t even worth the paper it’s not even printed on. Addicts are never deceitful or liars either.

if the Habs were so truly bad in front of Price, it stands to reason the Habs shouldn’t expect to get much for any of those supposedly awful players like Gallagher, Toffoli, Romanov, Caufield, Chairot and the rest playing in front of him. So while expecting a huge return for Price retained is put out there, time to lower the expectations on the dregs in front of him….
Per Habs fans words in this thread.

I agree with you...if that was Price playing as an addict, imagine how great he'll play after he's exited the substance abuse program. If he gets traded, the team getting him is going to the finals.

Also, habs fans didn't value Chiarot at a 1st, an NHL executive did. They set the standard, you're getting triggered over nothing here. If he valued Chiatot at a 1st, just imagine what Price would fetch if a team wants him.
 

McJedi

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I agree with you...if that was Price playing as an addict, imagine how great he'll play after he's exited the substance abuse program. If he gets traded, the team getting him is going to the finals.

Also, habs fans didn't value Chiarot at a 1st, an NHL executive did. They set the standard, you're getting triggered over nothing here. If he valued Chiatot at a 1st, just imagine what Price would fetch if a team wants him.
Chariot at 50% retention will get the Habs a 1st from some playoff team.

an addict is an addict and they relapse all the time. And Price is a rather bad regular season goalie and had been for several years now. Long season and his addiction may stem from having to get thru the 82 game grind. Dude’s value is so deeply negative, no team is going to take this risk and certainly not give up assets of value for him.

Really triggers the Habs fans to hear these truths. Going to be a long rebuild with all those long term contracts on their books.
 
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IWantSakicAsMyGM

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Price just needs to get you to the playoffs even if he sucks on the way there...he's arguably the best playoff goalie in the league (top 3 at worst).

It'd be a bad trade if he goes to a bottom feeder.




The habs exposed him and said he'll need surgery, Seattle was leaning towards him but his "surgery" put a question mark on him. Literally everyone understands this except you. I'm literally talking to a wall right now.

Report: Carey Price Injury Complicates Expansion Draft
Carey Price's uncertain injury status complicates Kraken's decision

I hope you have a really convincing argument for Price to even be top 3, because Holtby, Quick, Vasi and Matt Murray all have better career playoff SV% numbers and have each won at least 1 Cup, with Quick and Vasi adding a Smythe each. I'm also pretty sure that the Avs could get Holtby or Quick for significantly less than Price, so he's not even arguably the best playoff goalie that might be available, despite being the most expensive option.
 

IWantSakicAsMyGM

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I agree with you...if that was Price playing as an addict, imagine how great he'll play after he's exited the substance abuse program. If he gets traded, the team getting him is going to the finals.

Also, habs fans didn't value Chiarot at a 1st, an NHL executive did. They set the standard, you're getting triggered over nothing here. If he valued Chiatot at a 1st, just imagine what Price would fetch if a team wants him.

So, if we imagine that Price plays well, and then imagine there is a team interested in him, we can just imagine how much he'd be worth in that case? Yeah, imagine that...
 
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