The comparison to Hansen was made in context of how good they performed in a role they were used in and paid to be. I specifically mentioned that Motte at best played like a 3rd liner but spent most of the time on the 4th line. In that context he was and is a superior 4th line player to Aman.
Ah yes. I see how you were using Hansen as a comparison now. As far as I saw personally Motte was never anywhere close to a 3rd liner except maybe on our crappy team. I don't see him as
far superior to Aman at all. He's had a wee bit more personal success but Aman is also only entering his third year. As
@kanucks25 mentioned Motte looks busier but his overall effectiveness isn't much different than Aman imo. Both kept the puck out of our net and added very little offence. I think both could be improved upon. Sherwood is better than both.
Maybe it's unfair but for me a 4th liner's success is partially tied to team success unless you're one of the few 4th liners that are universally sought after. They are the least skilled players on the team for the most part.
So any 4th player who outperforms on a bad team achieves nothing and is pretty much a dime a dozen? That doesn't extend to other players playing higher up in the lineup?
I would put forth that fourth liners are often products of their team, much like coaching. So yeah, I would say they are a dime a dozen and often success is based on situation, or it's a spot for developing players. Look at a guy like Klim Kostin, or even Lomberg from the Panthers last year. They can play a pivotal role as a fourth liner on a Cup team but are they surefire better options than others? I'm not so sure. It's not like a second line winger on a crappy team who still scores 35 goals. There is something tangible there to measure and pursue.
The Canucks finished 22nd in points in Aman's first year. How is that one of he worst teams in history? I think Motte played on far worse teams.
I don't know why you are mentioning Motte's faceoff stats here. He isn't a C. He is a winger. Meanwhile, Aman's value is that he can play C but that value decreases if he can't consistently win faceoffs. For me that's signifcant because if Aman is an elite at faceoffs then combined with his PK and defensive abilities that sets him apart.
Motte spent the majority of his time here with Malhotra-like defensive deployment playing on a worse team. What he managed to accomplish is more impressive than what Aman has done. I'm not completely writing him off. I've been saying he needs to do more. I also don't see why it's "absurd" to discuss reasonable areas for improvement. We can't just go out and find a #3 Dman or even find a long term 3C that fits our cap and move Bluegar down to 4C for a price we are willing to pay. But we can find ways to improve our 4th line. We did that last year adding Lafferty and this year we signed Sprong to a bargain contract. We've given Aman opportunities. If he isn't going to develop into a more useful player we can give that opportunity to a player like Raty.
The window for a lot of prospects to secure a spot a spot as legitimate NHL player is short. A guy like Dalpe we got when he was 24. He hasn't played as many NHL games since. Same with Gaunce or Schroeder etc. If Aman doesn't take a big step forward this season his NHL career will be mostly done.
I don't know but the 2022-2023 Canucks was probably one of, if not the worst team performance I've seen in my 46 years supporting this team. It was tragically awful in almost every conceivable way imho.
Got off on a tangent about face-offs I will concede that one to you. Yes, he does need to get better at face-offs to set himself apart from others.
I get the wanting improvement part but like you mention that's our bottom 4 D first and foremost. Not our 4th line which wasn't a problem at all. I see a a number folks saying give Raty the opportunity. That's all fine. Give him a chance, if he's better than Aman then great for us. If not then Aman is the best we have right now, and as of now has proven to be better than Raty ... although that may change if Raty does indeed get in.
