Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Training Camp Begins

[Blue and Green]

Kind of surprised so many obvious cuts are still up, but I wonder if they are waiting for all the teams to waive their waiver eligible players to try and sneak people through.

Many of the obvious remaining cuts are waiver-exempt so it might just be a matter of keeping them around for a little more evaluation in practice, with perhaps a few even getting into Monday's game.

Abbotsford's training camp starts on Wednesday so probably the bulk of cuts will come after Monday's game with only the true bubble guys being kept around through Friday's game.

 

[LemonSauceD]

I wonder if Boston would be willing to do a Juulsen for Wotherspoon trade. Boston’s left side is pretty set but they could use a depth RHD considering Peeke is injury prone/healthy scratch material.

Wotherspoon would be a nice physical stay at home 6/7 D and can be insurance if and when Forbort inevitably becomes unplayable.

 

[sting101]

I wonder if Boston would be willing to do a Juulsen for Wotherspoon trade. Boston’s left side is pretty set but they could use a depth RHD considering Peeke is injury prone/healthy scratch material.

Wotherspoon would be a nice physical stay at home 6/7 D and can be insurance if and when Forbort inevitably becomes unplayable.

Kale Clague or Jake Christianson would be decent adds as well if they hit waivers

 

[WTG]

Surprised Pettersson made this cut. Maybe they want him to play a few more games before Abbotsford's training camp (October 2 to 5).

He seemed like he couldn't match the speed of the game at this level yet.

 

[ephmrl]

Surprised Pettersson made this cut. Maybe they want him to play a few more games before Abbotsford's training camp (October 2 to 5).

He seemed like he couldn't match the speed of the game at this level yet.

Likely just giving him more time to work with Foote and Gonchar before Abbotsford's camp opens.

 

[tyhee]

... By basically every metric, Myers outperformed Soucy defensively ...

FWIW, right now I'm happier with our depth chart's 3rd RHD (Desharnais) by quite a bit over our depth chart's 3rd LHD (Forbort) and with our highest ranked defensive prospect also being a right hand shooter, I see more of a need on the left side, which aligns with your conclusion.

I'd be interested in seeing those metrics your refer too, though. I went looking at hockey-reference.com, which probably isn't the best site for advanced stats but it is quick and easy to use. I found the following stats at 5 on 5.

Myers: Corsi Against/60 59.5 Fenwick Against/60 42.5
Soucy: Corsi Against/60 57.9 Fenwick Against/60 40.6

In total expected goals against Soucy was at 19.3, Myers at 50.2. I didn't see a way to restrict this metric to 5 on 5 play.

Now, there are obvious problems with the stats. Myers' much higher expected goals against is largely because he is a much higher event player or played with much higher event players. His expected goals for was also much, much higher than Soucy's. Also, none of those figures adjust for deployment. Myers at 5 on 5 started in the defensive zone a little higher percentage of the time than Soucy did last season, so one would expect Myers' defensive stats to be a little worse.

None of this shows who is better, but in view of the fact these don't show Myers ahead the way the metrics you refer to apparently did, I'd be interested in seeing those stats, so could you refer me to them? Thanks in advance.

 

[Peen]

naturalstattrick @tyhee

 

[tyhee]

naturalstattrick @tyhee

Thanks Peen, but contrary to what I understood @Quinton Byfield to say it appears to me Soucy is ahead in almost every defensive metric on naturalstattrick, too. Since @Quinton Byfield referred to metrics showing Myers outperformed Soucy DEFENSIVELY I'm looking for defensive metrics showing Myers ahead. On naturalstattrick at 5 on 5 on ice we get:

CA/60 FA/60 SA/60 GA/60 XGA/60 SCA/60 HDCA/60
Myers 57.64 40.68 26.93 2.21 2.39 24.96 9.78
Soucy 56.22 39.10 25.02 1.82 2.16 22.69 8.51

Deployment was very similar, Myers very slightly higher starting % in the defensive zone than Soucy.

As you'll see, none of these have Myers ahead, much less showing that "By basically every metric, Myers outperformed Soucy defensively."

If one switches to individual stats, they are almost all offensive, which clearly Myers would be ahead in but which don't do anything to show Myers outperforming Soucy defensively. Aside from individual offensive stats, the individual stats show Soucy taking fewer penalties, drawing more penalties, making fewer giveways, getting more takeaways and making more hits. Myers is ahead in shots blocked/60.

So going by naturalstattrick, at least as far as I could see, Myers is most definitely not shown in basically every metric outperforming Soucy defensively.

 

[JT Milker]

Soucy is miles better than Myers defensively. Myers has an underrated transition/offensive component to his game though that Soucy doesn’t.

 

[Vector]

Soucy is miles better than Myers defensively. Myers has an underrated transition/offensive component to his game though that Soucy doesn’t.

Soucy seems to be the secret sauce that makes a pairing work. We’ve had years of watching Myers struggle but he works very well with Soucy because Soucy is such a smart steady defensive player. It’s what allows Soucy to play up in the line-up.

 

[SopelFanThe3rd]

Soucy is underrated and a lot better than I thought he was when we signed him

 

[Vector]

Soucy is underrated and a lot better than I thought he was when we signed him

He was one of those signings where his entire career he'd been a bottom-pairing guy with excellent underlying numbers. So the big question was could he actually play up in the line-up or were those numbers excellent because he was facing easier competition in limited minutes.

 

[Peen]

Soucy is underrated and a lot better than I thought he was when we signed him

he was not as good in the second half of the season, but it seemed like he was playing through stuff. And he still did a better job in that second round against the best player in the world, while Zadorov got eaten alive by Kane in the last few games,

still perplexes me that there was a small contingent of the fan base saying that we should look at trading soucy to make space to give Zadorov that stupid contract.

 

[David71]

he was not as good in the second half of the season, but it seemed like he was playing through stuff. And he still did a better job in that second round against the best player in the world, while Zadorov got eaten alive by Kane in the last few games,

still perplexes me that there was a small contingent of the fan base saying that we should look at trading soucy to make space to give Zadorov that stupid contract.

would you still sign big z to that contract though? or whatever he was asking for. say move soucy elsewhere.. but he has an ntc. i think.

 

[David71]

Former Canuck Ethan Bear shares heartbreaking news should van bring back ethan bear. worked well with hughes

 

[Peen]

would you still sign big z to that contract though? or whatever he was asking for. say move soucy elsewhere.. but he has an ntc. i think.

No absolutely not.

It would have had to have been something in the 4s at 4 years. I still think he’s a #4.5