Prospect Info: Grand Rapids Griffins Discussion

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SantosHalper

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Mar 21, 2012
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i'm not convinced you're wrong, but I thought Yzerman's end-of-season comments were interesting. basically indicated that GR's flaws were on himself and Horcoff for not stacking GR with enough depth and that the issues are not on coaching.

of course, he's unlikely to say any differently when put on the spot about it, with two games left on GR's schedule (i think that presser was Friday). i certainly wouldn't be surprised if a change was made next week, after exit interviews.

for some devil's advocate though, if Yzerman does believe what he said, the evaluation will come down how players are developing and not necessarily the record. and, to Simon's credit, Berggren had a successful adjustment to North America, both in point production and how he plays (he's more willing to go into traffic than he was when he came over). Edvinsson was just ok in preseason, but once he was recalled, he looked like a lock for next year's roster. Yzerman has gone out of his way multiple times to praise Johansson especially, McIsaac to a lesser degree. Hanas was becoming a bit of an afterthought (to me, at least) and was pretty impactful when healthy. Viro has come alive in the last month.

i didn't watch too many of their games in the first half, but have been tuning in more in the second half once the Wings season went downhill. they are stuck playing way too many guys who are just not AHL caliber -- Worrad, Bliss, Tyutyayev, Sawchuk, Barton, Andreasson. Pearson hasn't been right all year. Weatherby is terrible. also results in some of their depth players like Shine and Spezia who are both fine on the 4th line, having to play 2nd line minutes because there are no better options. Spezia's even playing D tonight. no coach is winning with this roster, and it's been like this for the better part of the last two months.

and goaltending just blew up in everyone's face. Olkinoura had elite KHL numbers but is one of the worst goalies i've ever seen at this level. Brattstrom took a big step back from last year. Nedeljkovic steadied the ship for a bit, but wasn't stealing games. and it definitely wasn't worth throwing Cossa into this mess.

i'm not necessarily for or against a coaching change, but i'm just not seeing it as the same certainty as some others. they have to provide more depth and real goalies next season for whoever's in charge.
Yzerman is a true professional, he's not going to throw the coach under the bus. But the sample size is bigger than this season alone.

This was Simon's 5th year as head coach, his 3rd season was the covid season only 32 game regular season and no playoffs. Simon 2nd year was cut to short by covid, the team was 3rd in the division by 65 points, Wolves and Icehogs were trailing by 3 points. So not very firm position and there was still 13 regular season games left. This year and last year GR finished last in their division. Simon's 1st year was the only year he got his team to playoffs. Under Blashill and Nelson GR was a winning enviroment, not once it was a winning enviroment under Simon.
 

DTR

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Yzerman is a true professional, he's not going to throw the coach under the bus. But the sample size is bigger than this season alone.

This was Simon's 5th year as head coach, his 3rd season was the covid season only 32 game regular season and no playoffs. Simon 2nd year was cut to short by covid, the team was 3rd in the division by 65 points, Wolves and Icehogs were trailing by 3 points. So not very firm position and there was still 13 regular season games left. This year and last year GR finished last in their division. Simon's 1st year was the only year he got his team to playoffs. Under Blashill and Nelson GR was a winning enviroment, not once it was a winning enviroment under Simon.

I don’t recall ever endorsing Simon during his PC either. If Simon were returning I’d expect Yzerman would have done more to talk him up.
 

newfy

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Olkinuora is one great example how that coahing staff is one of the worst in AHL.

He is a great goalie if you can build even a basic system in front of him. Griffins guys have no clue.

Every goalie died there at this season, except Nedeljkovic, who "thrives" behind chaotic systems.

All goes on coaching.

All the young guys lately that have passed through Grand Rapids have looked really good when they've made it to Detroit. Seider, Berggren and Edvinsson all look really good and spent a decent chunk of time down there. Seider and Edvinsson both had obvious improvement over the season in Grad Rapids and Berggren looked much less soft/more suited for North America after being there.

I'm not sayingSimon is a great coach but the young guys are developing. Who cares about guys like Olkinuira?
 
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crashmore

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Mar 31, 2023
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Olkinuora is one great example how that coahing staff is one of the worst in AHL.

He is a great goalie if you can build even a basic system in front of him. Griffins guys have no clue.

Every goalie died there at this season, except Nedeljkovic, who "thrives" behind chaotic systems.

All goes on coaching.

couldn't disagree with this more. system has nothing to do with a guy coming in 1-on-4 and scoring on a wrist shot from the boards. Olkinoura was absolutely brutal, he was letting in at least two goals a night that were just inexcusable.

if they were getting outshot 40-20 every night, i might agree, but Olkinoura is probably the worst goalie i've seen in that uniform and it was clear the team in front of him had zero confidence in him. the scrubs they ended the season with, Lethemon and Bednard, were better even with a weaker roster.

when you gotta score 5 goals to win, and most of the guys you thought would score for you are up in Detroit or injured, there's no system in the world that can make up for that.
 

GrGriffins

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Grand Rapids, MI
Yzerman is a true professional, he's not going to throw the coach under the bus. But the sample size is bigger than this season alone.

This was Simon's 5th year as head coach, his 3rd season was the covid season only 32 game regular season and no playoffs. Simon 2nd year was cut to short by covid, the team was 3rd in the division by 65 points, Wolves and Icehogs were trailing by 3 points. So not very firm position and there was still 13 regular season games left. This year and last year GR finished last in their division. Simon's 1st year was the only year he got his team to playoffs. Under Blashill and Nelson GR was a winning enviroment, not once it was a winning enviroment under Simon.
Yzerman is not going to put up with last place finishes for the Griffins and not making the playoffs. He gave Simon his big chance this season with an improved roster (at least on paper) to see if he is the coach that everyone thought he would be when he was hired here 5 seasons ago. He ends up with the franchise's worst record in history. Not all his fault, but when the end of January/beginning of February, the fans here knew that the coaching here will not get us through and into the playoffs.

Defense was the main problem here and Simon could have let McDonald go and replace him with someone else, but he did not and their defensive structure made it close to impossible for goalies that came in this season to salvage any games. Nedeljkovic was the only one that could handle it, but he could not do it for every game. The last 15 games, especially the home games, this team had no drive at all. The players seemed to tune this coaching staff off.

Special teams has been a constant major problem with this coaching staff as well. PK was always at the bottom 10 of the league, if not worse. PP was not much better. When the PP got hot, either the players that made it happen, either got called up to Detroit, or got hurt. Having 8 vets on the roster did not help at all as 2 players would be rotating out each game. Thus getting rid of Criscuolo and Kampher later in the season.

You will not see Simon as the Griffins bench next season. Not sure when the official announcement will be, but it is coming. Do not be surprised is Dan Watson (current Toledo coach) ends up as the next Griffins head coach in 2023-24.
 

Run the Jewels

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Jun 22, 2006
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Yzerman is not going to put up with last place finishes for the Griffins and not making the playoffs. He gave Simon his big chance this season with an improved roster (at least on paper) to see if he is the coach that everyone thought he would be when he was hired here 5 seasons ago. He ends up with the franchise's worst record in history. Not all his fault, but when the end of January/beginning of February, the fans here knew that the coaching here will not get us through and into the playoffs.

Defense was the main problem here and Simon could have let McDonald go and replace him with someone else, but he did not and their defensive structure made it close to impossible for goalies that came in this season to salvage any games. Nedeljkovic was the only one that could handle it, but he could not do it for every game. The last 15 games, especially the home games, this team had no drive at all. The players seemed to tune this coaching staff off.

Special teams has been a constant major problem with this coaching staff as well. PK was always at the bottom 10 of the league, if not worse. PP was not much better. When the PP got hot, either the players that made it happen, either got called up to Detroit, or got hurt. Having 8 vets on the roster did not help at all as 2 players would be rotating out each game. Thus getting rid of Criscuolo and Kampher later in the season.

You will not see Simon as the Griffins bench next season. Not sure when the official announcement will be, but it is coming. Do not be surprised is Dan Watson (current Toledo coach) ends up as the next Griffins head coach in 2023-24.
Thanks for your insight. I can see Watson being hired, IIRC he has some history with Lalonde.
 

GrGriffins

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Jan 30, 2017
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Grand Rapids, MI

Time to celebrate:​


GRIFFINS ANNOUNCE COACHING STAFF CHANGES​

April 16, 2023
GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. – Grand Rapids Griffins general manager / Detroit Red Wings assistant general manager Shawn Horcoff announced on Sunday that the Red Wings will not renew the contracts of Griffins head coach Ben Simon, assistant coaches Matt Macdonald and Todd Krygier, and goaltending development coach Brian Mahoney-Wilson.
Simon just completed his fifth season as the Griffins’ head coach and has spent the last eight campaigns on the team’s coaching staff. Mahoney-Wilson, Macdonald and Krygier have served in their positions for the last seven, five and four seasons, respectively.

They're keeping Knuble?
Knuble is a part time coach. He mainly is there for most home games and select road games. Too focused on his kid with his travel hockey team.
 

NickH8

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Jul 3, 2015
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Time to celebrate:​


GRIFFINS ANNOUNCE COACHING STAFF CHANGES​

April 16, 2023
GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. – Grand Rapids Griffins general manager / Detroit Red Wings assistant general manager Shawn Horcoff announced on Sunday that the Red Wings will not renew the contracts of Griffins head coach Ben Simon, assistant coaches Matt Macdonald and Todd Krygier, and goaltending development coach Brian Mahoney-Wilson.
Simon just completed his fifth season as the Griffins’ head coach and has spent the last eight campaigns on the team’s coaching staff. Mahoney-Wilson, Macdonald and Krygier have served in their positions for the last seven, five and four seasons, respectively.


Knuble is a part time coach. He mainly is there for most home games and select road games. Too focused on his kid with his travel hockey team.
Is Knuble kind of like Kronwall to our guys in Sweden? Sort of like a developmental coach? That's always the vibe I've gotten.
 

GrGriffins

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Jan 30, 2017
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Grand Rapids, MI
Is Knuble kind of like Kronwall to our guys in Sweden? Sort of like a developmental coach? That's always the vibe I've gotten.
Knuble is a big time local hero here. He was born here, was a great high school player here in GR, and then went on to play in the NHL for so many years. He was selected to the GR Sports Hall of Fame a couple of years ago. Pretty much a local celebrity than a developmental coach.
 

GrGriffins

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Jan 30, 2017
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Grand Rapids, MI
Silly question now that Grand Rapids season is over can they send some players to Toledo?

SEVEN PLAYERS REASSIGNED TO TOLEDO WALLEYE​

April 16, 2023
GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. – The Detroit Red Wings on Sunday reassigned defensemen Seth Barton, Donovan Sebrango and Eemil Viro, and goaltender John Lethemon from the Grand Rapids Griffins to the Toledo Walleye (ECHL). In addition, the Griffins reassigned forwards Trenton Bliss, Kirill Tyutyayev and Drew Worrad to the Walleye.
Toledo enters its season finale tonight against the Fort Wayne Komets with a 45-19-4-3 record (0.683), which is good for second place in the Central Division of the ECHL. The Walleye will begin the Kelly Cup playoffs on Friday, April 21 when they travel to Indianapolis to compete in game one of a best-of-seven series with the Fuel in the Central Division semifinals. A season ago, the Walleye dropped a 4-1 series against the Florida Everblades in the Kelly Cup Finals.
 

Henkka

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Jan 31, 2004
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All the young guys lately that have passed through Grand Rapids have looked really good when they've made it to Detroit. Seider, Berggren and Edvinsson all look really good and spent a decent chunk of time down there. Seider and Edvinsson both had obvious improvement over the season in Grad Rapids and Berggren looked much less soft/more suited for North America after being there.

I'm not sayingSimon is a great coach but the young guys are developing. Who cares about guys like Olkinuira?
It's not about the guys.

Olkinuora-case was clear indication about systemic flaws which will create losing environment to our farm system.

Young players could develop well there as it was under Simon, but I think they would develop much better at winning enviroment.
 

Kingpin794

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Apr 25, 2012
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All the young guys lately that have passed through Grand Rapids have looked really good when they've made it to Detroit. Seider, Berggren and Edvinsson all look really good and spent a decent chunk of time down there. Seider and Edvinsson both had obvious improvement over the season in Grad Rapids and Berggren looked much less soft/more suited for North America after being there.

I'm not sayingSimon is a great coach but the young guys are developing. Who cares about guys like Olkinuira?
I think the thing to remember with the guys you just listed (Seider, Berggren, Edvinsson) all played a good chunk of time in pro European leagues before they got to Simon. They were all about 90% ready to go before they even got to NA. I would say they developed IN SPITE of Simon not because of him. The guys who you could really say he had a hand in were probably Hronek, Zadina, and Veleno. Hronek is gone and I'd bet money Veleno and/or Zadina are moved at some point pretty soon too.
 
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OgeeOgelthorpe

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I think the thing to remember with the guys you just listed (Seider, Berggren, Edvinsson) all played a good chunk of time in pro European leagues before they got to Simon. They were all about 90% ready to go before they even got to NA. I would say they developed IN SPITE of Simon not because of him. The guys who you could really say he had a hand in were probably Hronek, Zadina, and Veleno. Hronek is gone and I'd bet money Veleno and/or Zadina are moved at some point pretty soon too.

Don't forget Rasmussen, though he's really turned a corner since moving from center to wing.
 
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