TSN: Gord Miller / Jamie Noodles McLennan give their opinion on Michael Bunting

[Wafflewhipper]

Hyman is gone so replacing him doesn’t mean cloning him. Novel idea Marner and Matthews stop getting let off the hook and do some dirty work themselves on the forcheck. Nick Robertson might steal the spot yet and Bunting is in the bottom 6 where he might be better.

 

[ITM]

You can't miss something until its gone and Zach Hyman will be missed.

2020-21 - Zach Hyman ... 43 games 15 goals 18 assists 33 points [= 82 games 29 goals 34 assists 63 points] pace on full season.** With only 3 goals 2 assists via PP time ***

It easier said than done to pull a 26 year old, 6 year career minor leaguer with 14 NHL points to his name out from AHL, and toss him on a top 6 line and think results will be the same and get him for <$1 ml.

The "on pace for" argument appeals for players who aren't about to turn 30 and have never touched that level of production. Doesn't mean Hyman wasn't a good player, or won't be that player for Edmonton, but to suggest it means he was going to be even more than he was is a touch hopeful for reasons I'm not sure why.

Full credit for the work Hyman was able to put in to become the pro he is today. And kudos to parents with means that provided what seems like a singularly optimal situation to focus in. But Hyman is a product of hard work, incredible support and relatively late blooming.

Michael Bunting from the short work I've seen, looks -- I say "looks" -- like a more skilled player than Hyman. Don't know why the 25 year old -- and he is 25, not 26 -- soon to be 26 year old didn't flourish earlier. Everyone knows the reasons why its possible to languish, don't we?

Ok...So say, Michael Bunting was spelled: R-o-s-s C-o-l-t-o-n. And we were The Tampa Bay Lightning. I think we would be a much more open fan base. Granted two Cups helps, but so does a lack of constant cynicism.

For me, I'll reserve judgement against a completely unsustainable shooting percentage and an outlier game with a hat-trick to state the man is the next this or that.

But good riddance to Zach Hyman and the distorted appreciation that only Toronto's peculiar brand of sado-masochistic fans can produce. Because he accomplished nothing for the team. He didn't lift the team past any obstacle. He took no discounts to stay.

Say what you will about other players, but while they're Leafs, they're LEAFS. Zach Hyman seemingly breathing the same air as Clark and Gilmour and Sundin makes me queasy.

Reading Michael Bunting has lived a life diametrically routed to that of Zach Hyman makes my spirts lift that we got a guy who will FIGHT! to be a Maple Leaf while another guy toured the proverbial Edmontonian amenities in order to make a sound financial decision silver spoon firmly tipped in hand.

The only thing you can assure anyone of in the "on pace for" argument, is Zach Hyman is on pace for a season that will cost more per point for Edmonton than it did for Toronto.

I call that, good management.

 

[egd27]

And they may have done so, considering that Bunting said he had offers higher than the Leaf offer. But Bunting also has to want to play there.

Funny how so many players claim they're taking less to come to the Leafs but want top dollar to re-sign once they're here.

 

[Gabriel426]

I mean....Joe did alright with them and Spezzs is clearly better than Joe so.....yes.

I don't see why Spezza is not an option at this point.

 

[Antropovsky]

Their guesses are as good as ours.

 

[The Iceman]

Hyman was way over rated here. Good kid. Worked hard. Got better.

got injured. Got paid. He isn’t the loss thar people think.

BUT he will continue to put up good numbers with McDavid.
No other player in the league has benefited from their line mates more than ZH

 

[IPS]

That's the nice thing about these sub $1M players, you don't need to have much expectations for them.

If he's better than the 4th liners it's already a fair deal.

 

[Racer88]

Funny how so many players claim they're taking less to come to the Leafs but want top dollar to re-sign once they're here.

Ya, kind of like Marners offer sheet and Tavares taking a discount to sign here.

 

[ottomaddox]

The "on pace for" argument appeals for players who aren't about to turn 30 and have never touched that level of production. Doesn't mean Hyman wasn't a good player, or won't be that player for Edmonton, but to suggest it means he was going to be even more than he was is a touch hopeful for reasons I'm not sure why.

Full credit for the work Hyman was able to put in to become the pro he is today. And kudos to parents with means that provided what seems like a singularly optimal situation to focus in. But Hyman is a product of hard work, incredible support and relatively late blooming.

Michael Bunting from the short work I've seen, looks -- I say "looks" -- like a more skilled player than Hyman. Don't know why the 25 year old -- and he is 25, not 26 -- soon to be 26 year old didn't flourish earlier. Everyone knows the reasons why its possible to languish, don't we?

Ok...So say, Michael Bunting was spelled: R-o-s-s C-o-l-t-o-n. And we were The Tampa Bay Lightning. I think we would be a much more open fan base. Granted two Cups helps, but so does a lack of constant cynicism.

For me, I'll reserve judgement against a completely unsustainable shooting percentage and an outlier game with a hat-trick to state the man is the next this or that.

But good riddance to Zach Hyman and the distorted appreciation that only Toronto's peculiar brand of sado-masochistic fans can produce. Because he accomplished nothing for the team. He didn't lift the team past any obstacle. He took no discounts to stay.

Say what you will about other players, but while they're Leafs, they're LEAFS. Zach Hyman seemingly breathing the same air as Clark and Gilmour and Sundin makes me queasy.

Reading Michael Bunting has lived a life diametrically routed to that of Zach Hyman makes my spirts lift that we got a guy who will FIGHT! to be a Maple Leaf while another guy toured the proverbial Edmontonian amenities in order to make a sound financial decision silver spoon firmly tipped in hand.

The only thing you can assure anyone of in the "on pace for" argument, is Zach Hyman is on pace for a season that will cost more per point for Edmonton than it did for Toronto.

I call that, good management.

I don't care for "on pace for" thing either. People use the stat as though every player is going to reach those goals given the chance to play more. That they would never experience the ramp-up of tight checking and good defensive play heading towards the playoffs. Or that player would never experience a slump in that same time period. "On pace for" is clearly used by fans and player agents to pump tires.

 

[Mugzy97]

Patience is a virtue.

Lol
Barking up the wrong tree

 

[justashadowof]

Funny how so many players claim they're taking less to come to the Leafs but want top dollar to re-sign once they're here.

I honestly don't think it's a slight against the city, I think it's a slight against the current organization. I suspect that MLSE has become an annoying cauldron of empty corporate-speak and empowered human resources micro managers. I also suspect that unlike other NHL teams MLSE doesn't allow even its star players to brush off those mandatory on-line cartoon illustrated courses narrated by some marble mouthed, up speaking Bougie communications/marketing grad.

 

[Sypher04]

I honestly don't think it's a slight against the city, I think it's a slight against the current organization. I suspect that MLSE has become an annoying cauldron of empty corporate-speak and empowered human resources micro managers. I also suspect that unlike other NHL teams MLSE doesn't allow even its star players to brush off those mandatory on-line cartoon illustrated courses narrated by some marble mouthed, up speaking Bougie communications/marketing grad.

yeah, I see absolutely no reason to think that’s true at all.

 

[Sypher04]

I don't care for "on pace for" thing either. People use the stat as though every player is going to reach those goals given the chance to play more. That they would never experience the ramp-up of tight checking and good defensive play heading towards the playoffs. Or that player would never experience a slump in that same time period. "On pace for" is clearly used by fans and player agents to pump tires.

I would disagree. I think the overwhelming majority of people who post on pace numbers understand that they aren’t equivalent to actual production and don’t pass them off as such. I’m fairness, in most cases, the player in question is just as likely to keep up their pace as to not but I think the problem is when people draw final black and white conclusions extrapolated numbers

I personally prefer to use scoring rates vs on pace for however, as scoring rates represent actual production that happened

 

[Sypher04]

Ya, kind of like Marners offer sheet and Tavares taking a discount to sign here.

you can keep spewing your bs continually but Tavares DID take a discount to play here. This isn’t a matter of opinion. We know that at least the Isles and Sharks offered him more. And in the case of New York, that was also with an extra year.

also there was no Marner offer sheet

 

[Stonehands1990]

Because they currently have around $12M in cap space. It would have been dead easy for the Coyotes to outbid the Leafs.

He also turned down bigger offers to return to his home city

 

[Racer88]

you can keep spewing your bs continually but Tavares DID take a discount to play here. This isn’t a matter of opinion. We know that at least the Isles and Sharks offered him more. And in the case of New York, that was also with an extra year.

also there was no Marner offer sheet

I would love to see some actual prove that Tavares was actually offered more, not just opinions and speculation.
The talk of the day was that Marner was going to be offer sheeted and that’s why Dubas gave him so much.

 

[Sypher04]

I would love to see some actual prove that Tavares was actually offered more not just opinions and speculation.
The talk of the day was that Marner was going to be offer sheeted and that’s why Dubas gave him so much.

Oh, I see.

So reports of a Marner offer sheet,
But far more widespread reports of Tavares taking a discount to play here,

Got it.

 

[Racer88]

Oh, I see.

So reports of a Marner offer sheet,
But far more widespread reports of Tavares taking a discount to play here,

Got it.

I will concede that Marners offer sheet was only speculation. So with that miscommunication cleared up can you please provide proof that Tavares turned down more money to play here or are you only going on speculation as well?

 

[Coaches Coroner]

The "on pace for" argument appeals for players who aren't about to turn 30 and have never touched that level of production. Doesn't mean Hyman wasn't a good player, or won't be that player for Edmonton, but to suggest it means he was going to be even more than he was is a touch hopeful for reasons I'm not sure why.
.

I particularly like that the "on pace for" crowd never mention how many of his goals were empty netters.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Funny how so many players claim they're taking less to come to the Leafs but want top dollar to re-sign once they're here.

I haven't seen that happen. Who are you even talking about? Are you suggesting that Bunting lied?

 

[Sypher04]

I will concede that Marners offer sheet was only speculation. So with that miscommunication cleared up can you please provide proof that Tavares turned down more money to play here or are you only going on speculation as well?

A report from one of the most respected insiders is the best you're going to get, and were perfectly capable of finding for yourself, but here you go:
John Tavares, Sharks face off with no regrets over how free agency unfolded - Sportsnet.ca

This being just one of several people who have said as much.

Also, the Isles were reported by many to have offered 88 over 8, which might be the same AAV, but still $11 million left on the table.

 

[ottomaddox]

I would disagree. I think the overwhelming majority of people who post on pace numbers understand that they aren’t equivalent to actual production and don’t pass them off as such. I’m fairness, in most cases, the player in question is just as likely to keep up their pace as to not but I think the problem is when people draw final black and white conclusions extrapolated numbers

I personally prefer to use scoring rates vs on pace for however, as scoring rates represent actual production that happened

That's what I said.

 

[Sypher04]

That's what I said.

The disagreement was the second sentence of my post, which is not what you said.

 

[ottomaddox]

I haven't seen that happen. Who are you even talking about? Are you suggesting that Bunting lied?

I would say that Bunting lied and now he is subject to 'Trial by public opinion' even before he steps on the ice in training camp.

 

[ottomaddox]

The disagreement was the second sentence of my post, which is not what you said.

I said that.