[Gord Miller] Future of Russia/Belarus in IIHF events (Mod warning post 7)

[Tuoppi]

based upon scuttlebutt here in Europe. It is Sweden and Finland that are leading the charge to keep them out.

I think Latvia and Czech rep. also.

 

[paul-laus]

I mean seeing how pathetic and boring 2023 WHC has been and the fact that NHL players aren’t participating in the Olympics, I couldn’t care less.

The WJHC is really the only tournament I truly miss with all teams participating

Which is funny to me. The World Juniors is the only iihf tournament that I couldn’t care less about. For me, it’s the draft eligibles in the under 18 tournament that is the most entertaining and enjoyable…. The world juniors has become the most predictable, telling, according to script, and as a result unwatchable tournament…

 

[NatusVincere]

The pro-Russia crowd here vastly overrates their country’s importance to the rest of the world. Nobody outside of Russia and its allies will miss their presence in international play.

Russians are getting paid millions of dollars to play in NA. Your posts on HF are for free.

And almost nobody on the world cared about the IIHF for like half an century. Without Russia/the USSR the NHL would have eaten the IIHF alive long ago.

 

[Caser]

Which is funny to me. The World Juniors is the only iihf tournament that I couldn’t care less about. For me, it’s the draft eligibles in the under 18 tournament that is the most entertaining and enjoyable…. The world juniors has become the most predictable, telling, according to script, and as a result unwatchable tournament…

In general I think the closer a tournament gets to the best-on-best the less unpredictable it gets, so that's kind of the downside, yes.

 

[Gold Standard]

Well that's Good Hockey News from the WHC.

LOL at all the bluffs to "leave' the IIHF. Oh just do it already. LOL.

Now I think I'm going to go read the comments to this story on Russian websites and have a good laugh with my morning coffee.

Cheers Everybody. Welcome to semi-final Saturday to what has been a pretty entertaining tournament. Enjoy.

 

[Gold Standard]

I'm just having a look at the ROC roster from 2021. aside from 3 players that's a pretty unimpressive list of some D-level talent right there contributing to WHC degrading in recent years. So, with or without the two teams in question the WHC has its challenges.

And I'm still laughing at the way that 2021 tournament ended for ROC and the captain's idiotic presser after the quarters. truly classic idiocy.

 

[Caser]

I'm just having a look at the ROC roster from 2021. aside from 3 players that's a pretty unimpressive list of some D-level talent right there contributing to WHC degrading in recent years. So, with or without the two teams in question the WHC has its challenges.

And I'm still laughing at the way that 2021 tournament ended for ROC and the captain's idiotic presser after the quarters. truly classic idiocy.

That D-level talent team took that year's Team Canada to OT, so I guess they had C-level talent at best lol.

As for Slepyshev I'm not exactly sure what he said there, but I think we can excuse him for that, playing for the Oilers might left it's mark.

 

[Shocker]

Good, no one cares about those 2 countries.

 

[Snauen]

The biggest problem here is that people running these international sporting bodies, including IIHF, having no clue what is happening around them. The world, we knew, is over, the new upcoming era, including sporting/hockey, will NOT be run by the same institutions as before. The biggest victim will be Europe (European hockey).

Interesting, please enlighten us of what you "know"!

 

[Albatros]

The biggest problem here is that people running these international sporting bodies, including IIHF, having no clue what is happening around them. The world, we knew, is over, the new upcoming era, including sporting/hockey, will NOT be run by the same institutions as before. The biggest victim will be Europe (European hockey).

I doubt Hockey Canada or USA Hockey have much interest in establishing an alternative to the IIHF either, and that's already pretty much all of the world of hockey. India isn't going to decide one day that they'd actually prefer to play their hockey on ice and establish a new ice hockey federation open to Russia.

 

[Kshahdoo]

The pro-Russia crowd here vastly overrates their country’s importance to the rest of the world. Nobody outside of Russia and its allies will miss their presence in international play.

I personally think the HF crowd even more overrates IIHF importance to Russian hockey. It's important for Tretyak and FHR because without it they can't control KHL where actual money is. But the longer FHR is basically out of IIHF the harder it'll be to prevent the league from going independent. If IIHF's aim is to make the second biggest hockey league in the world fully independent from the organization (given the biggest one is already fully independent), then I will suport these efforts wholeheartedly.

 

[ozo]

I personally think the HF crowd even more overrates IIHF importance to Russian hockey. It's important for Tretyak and FHR because without it they can't control KHL where actual money is. But the longer FHR is basically out of IIHF the harder it'll be to prevent the league from going independent. If IIHF's aim is to make the second biggest hockey league in the world fully independent from the organization (given the biggest one is already fully independent), then I will suport these efforts wholeheartedly.

You are absolutely correct, KHL don't need IIHF, but what actual "shackles" IIHF impose on KHL lol? Fine drop out, but then what? What actually will change?

 

[JackSlater]

The delusions of grandeur here, while predictable, have delivered the laughs.

I personally think the HF crowd even more overrates IIHF importance to Russian hockey. It's important for Tretyak and FHR because without it they can't control KHL where actual money is. But the longer FHR is basically out of IIHF the harder it'll be to prevent the league from going independent. If IIHF's aim is to make the second biggest hockey league in the world fully independent from the organization (given the biggest one is already fully independent), then I will suport these efforts wholeheartedly.

Honestly any league geared toward making money should be completely independent of the IIHF. I would think that this would be better Russian hockey.

As far as the actual information Miller posted it doesn't look like more than his own speculation. I will say that they should flip the 2027 and 2028 tournaments. We do not need Canada, USA (but really Canada) and then Canada again three years in a row.

 

[2014nyr]

ridiculous punishing players because of where they were born, especially the u18/u20s. they're kids ffs

 

[Faterson]

The pro-Russia crowd here vastly overrates their country’s importance to the rest of the world.

They should also set up their own HFBoards, and willingly pull all of their "stars" and players from the NHL.

Alternate universe is alternate universe – they really should be consequential about it, instead of sending out any emissaries to this filthy, rotten, corrupt West. No, no: complete separation would be ideal, to preserve purity and innocence.

By excluding the 2 countries, the IIHF is in fact doing them a big favor, helping them realize their dreams of cutting themselves off from the corrupt West all the more quickly and easily.

So, there is really no issue here, is there? After all, on this board, too, we're repeatedly being assured that the two countries don't need IIHF at all, that they will be better off without it and without relations with the corrupt West, so all seems to be pretty much as it's supposed to be, and all sides can be happy with the current status quo.

 

[Caser]

They should also set up their own HFBoards, and willingly pull all of their "stars" and players from the NHL.

Alternate universe is alternate universe – they really should be consequential about it, instead of sending out any emissaries to this filthy, rotten, corrupt West. No, no: complete separation would be ideal, to preserve purity and innocence.

By excluding the 2 countries, the IIHF is in fact doing them a big favor, helping them realize their dreams of cutting themselves off from the corrupt West all the more quickly and easily.

So, there is really no issue here, is there? After all, on this board, too, we're repeatedly being assured that the two countries don't need IIHF at all, that they will be better off without it and without relations with the corrupt West, so all seems to be pretty much as it's supposed to be, and all sides can be happy with the current status quo.

So far Russia hasn't shown any notable intention to self-isolate in general, doesn't matter if from the West or from the East, so it wouldn't make any sense. As for Hfboards, you might have noticed there are only like a dozen of Russians here, as the majority are hanging out on the local sports news/discussion platforms.

As for the IIHF, their main functions are organizing international tournaments and coordinating player transfers. The latter can be handled without them as proven by the NHL and the international tournament part obviously isn't something that Russian hockey can benefit from at this point.

So yeah, no issues for the Russian hockey system, yet a bit of the issue for those fans who would like to see some best-on-best international hockey at least in some form and for the players, who would like to prove themselves on the international stage.

 

[BB79]

Lol. Slovaks sucked at the WHC because some of their top players chose KHL money and were banned from national team, so you think Russian players will prefer WHC over KHL money?

No. I'm saying they'd prefer to play on a bigger stage than the KHL which no one outside of Russia is watching

 

[Caser]

No. I'm saying they'd prefer to play on a bigger stage than the KHL which no one outside of Russia is watching

Bigger stage than the KHL is the NHL and the NHL scouts are totally watching the KHL.

As for the international hockey, there are Russian players representing other countries like Romania, but if any on them had a KHL offer (or even a VHL one) I'm sure they wouldn't think more than couple of minutes on what to choose in that case.

 

[canuckster19]

it seems to me you overestimate importance of Russia and KHL to hockey fans in rest of the World. Average european hockey fan knows 10 KHL teams max and no one is tuning in to the WC to watch Dmitrij Jaskin.

If you want to show it to the IIHF to make yourself feel better: ok I guess, but there is nothing more to it.

10? That’s generous

 

[Channelcat]

Gord Miller is an Ahole, and his opinion should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[Caser]

Not at the expense of international law & order, however. Hockey, however fun to watch, is secondary in importance to that.



They can always give up the citizenship of a pariah country and request the citizenship of a country that is not excluded from the international community.

Just like the Šťastný brothers (and others) had to do it under Communism: if they wanted to play in the NHL, they had to flee to the West (a criminal offence back then), leave their families behind, give up the citizenship of their original Communist country, apply for the Canadian citizenship (which was granted to them pretty swiftly), and then they could "prove themselves on the international stage" as well as in the NHL.

Peter Šťastný got to play for Team Canada at one of the Canada Cups pretty promptly. And when, in Canada's game against Czechoslovakia, Šťastný scored a goal, the Czech Communist TV announcer was afraid to pronounce his name, so he simply said "Canada scored", afraid he might lose his job otherwise.

I feel like you didn't read my post, I was writing about the potential consequences of the KHL getting independent ftom the IIHF, not about the exclusion or Russian players. And yes, just in case you didn't notice, the IIHF eligibility rules have changed quite a bit since the Stastny brothers.

 

[Dala]

10? That’s generous

Perhaps depends on if the count is accounts or people?

Which of the different post-Russia nations will be invited is the bigger question and to clear up that mess could take decades.

 

[sansabri]

guess it'll be years before the WJC is interesting again. good way to make sure more people tune in

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

I think the precedent here is Yugoslavia who got kicked out of Euro 92 and not allowed to participate in qualification for WC 94 or Euro 96. Those sanctions were lifted after 3 years in late 1995 when a peace deal was reached. I expect this to turn out very similar.

 

[Kshahdoo]

You are absolutely correct, KHL don't need IIHF, but what actual "shackles" IIHF impose on KHL lol? Fine drop out, but then what? What actually will change?

Shackles are called international tournaments. Because of them there way less games in the KHL than it could be. 80 games season, why not? Soviet/Russian hockey has been a propaganda tool during absolute most of its history, it's time to stop this bullshit and start to develop it as a sport/business/entertainment. And the first step would be to cut ties with the IIHF. At least for the KHL.... Ok we can do some exclusions for the China team because developing hockey in China is a big deal but that's it.