German Prospects for the NHL Draft
- Thread starter Maverick41
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GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
Same here. Would’ve been a really random pick otherwise. The agent is the same as Luca Münzenberger’s, Nico Sturm’s, Tim Stützle’s (he was committed to New Hampshire at one point and drafted by Sioux City) and Parker Tuomie’s (among others), I believe. So that makes sense too.
GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
Couple of interesting names going forward I found going through the WSI on EP
Interesting, Schneider and Treinis I was aware of, the other two are completely new for me.
GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
Stopora in paticular played as a 2010 born in a tournament for 2009 borns of note.
Not sure why a club like DEG should be better than Straubing for Brandl. I guess Straubing is a good place to be for prospects. Zimmermann, Samanski, Bugl etc. all young succesfull prospects who are even interesting for the national team and on their way. I expect all of them will do the next step in the upcoming season. And Straubing plays fast and attractive hockey addtionally Landshut is not far away if he will get more time on the ice and honestly...I think he will benefit if he can have many games for Landshut. I didn't follow him much in the DNL but the last 18wc and I believe it will be a huge step for him (as for most of those young guys).
GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
He‘s only playing AA in Sweden from the looks of it, but someone to keep an eye on nonetheless
I guess I just haven’t followed Straubing closely enough to make a qualified statement, it just felt like an odd place to go for one of the top prospects in the country right now.
Among others the 3 guys (Samanski, Bugl, Zimmermann) from Straubing are missing who made their debut in the German national team recently. I'm pretty sure they can play a good role in the furure even if I don't believe to see them in NA.
Spieler Archiv - Straubing Tigers
I'd be very surprised if the ex-Mannheimers Brandl, Bicker, and Niehus find themselves in anything resembling a somewhat regular role in the DEL next season, despite having now signed with DEL teams.
We simply can't forget that there's basically a world of difference between the DEL and DNL.
In fact, looking at recent years, I'd almost say Niehus has a better shot at being a 6/7 Dman with Frankfurt than the other two have with their clubs. It seems like young Dmen have just been getting more looks and even surprising roles along the way with the likes of a Düsseldorf and a few others.
I'm more interested in seeing if Rossmy can be another player now that he's with Düsseldorf. And in seeing if Lutz can finally take the next step (push is starting to come to shove).
I'm also more interested in seeing if Krening, the Heigls, and Bader can make some noise in Munich. I definitely see them closer to the DEL than any of Brandl, Bicker, and Niehus.
We simply can't forget that there's basically a world of difference between the DEL and DNL.
In fact, looking at recent years, I'd almost say Niehus has a better shot at being a 6/7 Dman with Frankfurt than the other two have with their clubs. It seems like young Dmen have just been getting more looks and even surprising roles along the way with the likes of a Düsseldorf and a few others.
I'm more interested in seeing if Rossmy can be another player now that he's with Düsseldorf. And in seeing if Lutz can finally take the next step (push is starting to come to shove).
I'm also more interested in seeing if Krening, the Heigls, and Bader can make some noise in Munich. I definitely see them closer to the DEL than any of Brandl, Bicker, and Niehus.
I don't disagree, but I definitely see Bicker getting a fair shot with Frankfurt. For starters, they don't have high-end depth and will need someone to fill in sooner or later. But I also think Bicker has what you need to play in the league early. His motor and tenaciousness are perhaps his biggest traits, and he couples that with strong defensive habits. So even if he doesn't get a huge role, I can see him playing well in a bottom-six role. The real question then becomes if that's where Frankfurt want him to develop into the skilled top-six scorer he's actually supposed to be.
I have been away for a while, after I had a bit of a health scare/emergency (not heart related) during the 2nd period of the World Championship final.
Afterwards I was extremely busy at work, making up for lost time. This will likely continue for a while, probably well into August.
At least I will get back to reading a bit more on this site again, and post occasionally and probably not often posts as long as this one.
As far as the upcoming DEL season is concerned, I agree with @Chapin Landvogt, that very few of the 05s will see any significant, let alone consistent ice time. Bicker in Frankfurt seems like the only one who could get a real shot, and maybe Panocha could get at least a decent taste in Berlin. They have always been pretty good at easing defensemen into the DEL.
But even among the 04s I don't see a lot of guys stepping up next season. Lutz is the one guy I see becoming a solid contributor even on a strong team. Guys like Kechter, Hördler, Krening, Oswald and Bettahar could get some looks, but would likely benefit from some more development and more ice time in the DEL2 or, in the case of Krening in Austria (ICEHL and AlpsHL).
The 03s should be the ones ready to be DEL regulars, unfortunately there are very few of them with great upside.
Klein should continue to get his games in Straubing, but if his ice time doesn't increase quite a bit, his development might stall a little.
Roßmy and Proske are, to me, two of the strongest candidates to break out at some point.
The Heigls, van Calster and Bader are in the next group as far as I am concerned.
And then there is Nikita Quapp, who, for the most part, played amazing in the DEL2 last season. I could honestly see him stealing the starting spot or at least forcing a 1a/1b situation in Berlin next season.
Speaking of goalies, I am very interested to see what Köln will do with all their young goalies next season.
Pantkowski and Ancicka should be the duo in the DEL (I would prefer if both were starters on different teams, but it is what it is) and I am guessing Lunemann will play full time in the DEL2, and Willerscheid could get loaned to an Oberliga team to get some senior level experience while also playing in the DNL.
Afterwards I was extremely busy at work, making up for lost time. This will likely continue for a while, probably well into August.
At least I will get back to reading a bit more on this site again, and post occasionally and probably not often posts as long as this one.
As far as the upcoming DEL season is concerned, I agree with @Chapin Landvogt, that very few of the 05s will see any significant, let alone consistent ice time. Bicker in Frankfurt seems like the only one who could get a real shot, and maybe Panocha could get at least a decent taste in Berlin. They have always been pretty good at easing defensemen into the DEL.
But even among the 04s I don't see a lot of guys stepping up next season. Lutz is the one guy I see becoming a solid contributor even on a strong team. Guys like Kechter, Hördler, Krening, Oswald and Bettahar could get some looks, but would likely benefit from some more development and more ice time in the DEL2 or, in the case of Krening in Austria (ICEHL and AlpsHL).
The 03s should be the ones ready to be DEL regulars, unfortunately there are very few of them with great upside.
Klein should continue to get his games in Straubing, but if his ice time doesn't increase quite a bit, his development might stall a little.
Roßmy and Proske are, to me, two of the strongest candidates to break out at some point.
The Heigls, van Calster and Bader are in the next group as far as I am concerned.
And then there is Nikita Quapp, who, for the most part, played amazing in the DEL2 last season. I could honestly see him stealing the starting spot or at least forcing a 1a/1b situation in Berlin next season.
Speaking of goalies, I am very interested to see what Köln will do with all their young goalies next season.
Pantkowski and Ancicka should be the duo in the DEL (I would prefer if both were starters on different teams, but it is what it is) and I am guessing Lunemann will play full time in the DEL2, and Willerscheid could get loaned to an Oberliga team to get some senior level experience while also playing in the DNL.
MasterMatt25
Registered User
Not a draft for me as of today. That could of course change with a strong season, particularly if he somehow ends up playing (as in getting ice time, not just dressing) pro. Don’t like the hockey sense, not sure about the skill, not as physical as he should be at his size. The size and skating are intriguing, though, so I look forward to watching him next season.
Well that were 3 more Germans than I expected to be selected in this year's draft.
Bicker was the most surprising for me where he was selected, Panocha in the 7th round seems about right (could have seen him go even a little sooner), and Tiefensee was really good last season, so it's not that surprising that a team took a chance on him.
Also, I really like the landing spots for all three. Detroit, Dallas and Buffalo should be good destinations for them, even if their chances to make it to the NHL are slim.
Bicker was the most surprising for me where he was selected, Panocha in the 7th round seems about right (could have seen him go even a little sooner), and Tiefensee was really good last season, so it's not that surprising that a team took a chance on him.
Also, I really like the landing spots for all three. Detroit, Dallas and Buffalo should be good destinations for them, even if their chances to make it to the NHL are slim.
HOOats
born Ruffian
It was nice to see 3 German players drafted this year, despite two major setbacks, namely the relegation of the U18 team and lack of steps taken by several overagers, namely Bennet Rossmy, who looked like a real option after the summer WJC last summer.
Panocha was the rising star of the first year eligibles and after loving his game in Berlin, I thought he was - under the circumstances - really good at the U18 Worlds. In general, he moves so smoothly in all directions, is very heady, and has strong puckmoving instincts in all three zones. So happy to see him selected.
Tiefensee was a monster this season and already plays a far more mature and well-schooled game than his age belies. Had little doubt he'd be selected and now we know that he's indeed been observed by the NHL.
I'm surprised about Bicker. I thought if he did get drafted, it'd be because scouts liked what they primarily saw at the Hlinka Gretzky tourney last summer. He has tools and thus, there's justification for him being selected. But he missed a good bit piece of the season with injury and then certainly didn't sell himself terribly well at the U18. I distinctly remember several situations where he made awful decisions with the puck, once even killing away a 2-on-1 opportunity. He has his deal with Straubing. We'll see what next season brings.
Ultimately though, the "DACH" countries were once again lacking in draft recognition - and rightfully so. 3 Germans, 1 OHL playing Swissman (Dionicio), and Reinbacher, who we all knew was going high. Scherzer was the next best Austrian and he went unselected.
But we've seen drafts where fewer than 3 Germans were selected, so there's that.
Panocha was the rising star of the first year eligibles and after loving his game in Berlin, I thought he was - under the circumstances - really good at the U18 Worlds. In general, he moves so smoothly in all directions, is very heady, and has strong puckmoving instincts in all three zones. So happy to see him selected.
Tiefensee was a monster this season and already plays a far more mature and well-schooled game than his age belies. Had little doubt he'd be selected and now we know that he's indeed been observed by the NHL.
I'm surprised about Bicker. I thought if he did get drafted, it'd be because scouts liked what they primarily saw at the Hlinka Gretzky tourney last summer. He has tools and thus, there's justification for him being selected. But he missed a good bit piece of the season with injury and then certainly didn't sell himself terribly well at the U18. I distinctly remember several situations where he made awful decisions with the puck, once even killing away a 2-on-1 opportunity. He has his deal with Straubing. We'll see what next season brings.
Ultimately though, the "DACH" countries were once again lacking in draft recognition - and rightfully so. 3 Germans, 1 OHL playing Swissman (Dionicio), and Reinbacher, who we all knew was going high. Scherzer was the next best Austrian and he went unselected.
But we've seen drafts where fewer than 3 Germans were selected, so there's that.
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Good to see 3 Germans drafted. It is always difficult with goalies, but in my eyes Tiefensee has good chances to make it in the NHL. Lets see how much and how good he will be in the NHL.
I’ll jump in here and share my thoughts too, if I may.
Panocha was probably my favourite dark-horse prospect for this draft. I didn't know him going into the year but here's the very short blurb on him that I wrote after the Hlinka:
I started following his season from there and was able to see him live quite a few times both in the DNL and at the U18s to close out the season. What stands out more than anything when looking at his whole year: I mentioned his intriguing toolkit at the Hlinka and throughout the year he got better and better at using it. He continuously improved and I liked him more and more with every viewing.
Panocha is a mobile two-way defender who stands out in transition. He has quick feet and good four-way mobility, which allows him to play a tight gap and defend the rush. He's mostly a stick-first defender and playing the body is something he definitely needs to work on. However, I believe in part it's just the result of playing against weak competition and not really needing to be physical. When he played pro games in the DEL2, he showed he can play the puck first and follow through with his body – which is exactly what you'd like to see – so I do think once he gets to the next level, he will improve and get more consistent in that regard. The most exciting part about Pancha's game is his puck play from his own end. He's excellent on retrievals. He does a great job reading pressure and frequently manages to get himself out of difficult situations. He's able to either shake off forecheckers with tight turns and use his quick first steps to skate the puck up ice himself or he can make a quick, smart play to move the puck to a teammate when he can't escape himself. I really like his upside as a two-way, transition D, but I'm not convinced there's a ton of offense in his game. The fact he didn't put up more points in the DNL is somewhat concerning (his 22 points in 34 games don't sound bad but it really isn't great for an NHL draft prospect at this level) and he didn't really show a ton to suggest that his skill level is better than the numbers suggest. However, I'd take the shot at an excellent transition D who can defend and move the puck up ice any day of the week. Definitely has the upside to be a #5 or #6 in the NHL, although if we're being honest, the chances of him actually getting there are very slim.
To be honest I was quite late to fully jumping on the bandwagon for this kid.
At the start of the season he was barely on my radar, by the spring I though he could maybe a very long shot to be drafted as he moved up my rankings, but my opinion of this draft class overall went further and further south.
If I had not missed out on making pre-draft rankings in June, due to bad health and busy work, he would have claimed the number 1 spot, but I still wouldn't have thought him to be more than a long shot to even be drafted, let alone make the NHL. (This only would have included first time eligibles in a combined ranking I probably would have had Tiefensee ahead of everyone)
As for my thoughts on his game I'll divide his skills into two categories (those that make him an interesting NHL prospect and definitely worth a late round pick, and those that may keep him out of the league)
I'll start with the latter.
Panocha needs to get a lot stronger. His board play is severely limited. If he wasn't so smart about it, his deficiencies in this area would be more glaring. Because of this he doesn't need to turn into a physical beast, but to play in the NHL he still needs to spend a good amount of time in the weight room.
For his overall skillset I don't think his top speed is good enough for the NHL level. Either he needs improve in this area or build on his already existing strength of hockey IQ and mobility to further compensate for lack of speed. Don't get me wrong he is far from slow, but compared to some of the great skating, big defensemen that entered the league in recent years, he is not fast enough for my liking considering he is also not exactly huge.
The last concern I have is his shot, although I have seen him shoot the puck very well and quite hard a number of times. So, it's not that he can't shoot it is more about consistency and shot selection. This should be easily fixable.
Now for the more fun part, the positives.
I already mentioned his mobility, which is excellent, and he uses it well both on offense, eluding opposing players carrying the puck up the ice, and also on defense where he manages to keep up with the attacking players even when they try to create space with quick pivots.
I really like his puck moving ability and his transition game from defense to offense. As mentioned above he is very good at carrying the puck up the ice side stepping forecheckers and then distributing the puck to the forwards. He is also a pretty good passer with great vision, which also aids his transition game. He reliably finds rushing forwards with tape to tape passes either from his own zone, or as he carries the puck through the neutral zone himself.
He also has pretty good puck control when it is on his stick, especially for a defenseman.
I also already mentioned that he is a very smart player. Of course he still makes the typical mistakes young players make as they try to figure out what they can and cannot do. Sometimes I worry a little about the quickness of his decision making, but I think that were just a couple of gaffes I noticed in a game or two, and not really a pattern.
He is not a bad PP QB, though I doubt it would translate to the NHL level and with the Sabres I would guess that they are set up pretty nicely in that role for a long time, anyway.
Before anybody gets too excited, though he is still a 7th round pick and if he ever plays in the NHL it would be huge and it is far more likely that doesn't make it. And if anyone asks me, my optimistic but not unrealistic expecation for him would be to turn into a player on the level of Leon Gawanke, Kai Wissmann or Jonas Müller, which would be great for the German national team, but not really all that helpful for the Sabres.
Love the detailed write-up!
Regarding your potential concerns in his decision-making, I think that's another issue that comes with being better than everyone else but won't be a problem at the next level. Even Stützle looked like he had hockey sense and specifically decision-making issues in the DNL, but it was just because he was often relied on to do everything himself. It's similar with Panocha, albeit obviously not quite at the same level. He tries to make plays every time he gets the puck and often it doesn't work out, but he doesn't have much support to work with. I thought it's looked much better at the U18s and even DEL2. He can definitely make quick decision and execute quick, smart plays when he has to. But I like that he tries to play with the puck as much as possible at his current development stage, rather than trying to get rid of the puck too quickly.
