News Article: Geoff Molson re-affirms confidence in Marc Bergevin, will not hire a president of hockey operations

[Monsieur Miz]

His "mentor" have won two Stanley Cups. Don't try to link everything together. Doesn't make sense.

Dale Tallon built the team. Bowman came and the core was already there.

 

[Jee]

Guys just want the best hockey people end of discussion.....but the past 10-12 years we have not gone that route, we have gone with the best franco guy available, and..............here we are.
Rinse and Repeat...

but who exactly was the best guy available in 2012, Pierre McGuire ? Bergevin was already being groomed in one of the top market in the NHL, not exactly far fetched that he was one of the best hockey people available at the time.

 

[HuGo Sham]

As I've posted I felt bergevin deserved a reprieve after the cup run, but when one does some forensics on this roster, it's clear (in my opinion) he has to go.
He's always lacked vision and there's a sense he's improvising and throwing shit against the wall to see what sticks. In his defence, it could be teflon Geoff
telling him team can't rebuild - not consciously anyway lol.
but here goes...this summer.

-His logic concerning our C group is just baffling. There was no plan for losing 2 of our 3 Top C's. None. And then
they lose the depth, they finally, finally had after 30 years. It makes no f***ing sense. none. He threw shit against the wall
and brought in two, mediocre, over-the-hill, local guys who can't do shit. One is injured and the other is suspended and should be in minors.
It feels like a media appeasement / distraction more than anything while Mailloux fiasco played out (another dumb decision).
We're back to being a team relying on wingers and a goalie - which didn't work for the first 8 years of his mediocre reign.
and suzuki is overwhelmed and overmatched as a no.1 and far too young of an age IF CH wanted to actually contend.
Dvorak also looks like a 3C and not a 2.
- He resigns Gallagher because he's in love with the past character and leadership of a player without
really paying attention to the consequences - and then proceeds to get rid of his two line mates which has made
for a formidable trio the last 3 years.. Result? gallagher is lost.
-i'll give him a pass on Price as this happened last minute. but again blind loyalty will probably be what influences this decision
going forward.
-Weber: he didn't anticipate what to do after it was revealed Weber was going to retire. what did he do? signs Savard,
another 5/6 pylon. was he in on hamilton? who knows, but this is another symptom of his inability to develop a modern D-corps-
at the heart of why the team sucks.
-Then he proceeds to let 99.9% of the leadership walk. He wouldn't give perry a 2nd year but signs paquette at same price?
Even Staal would look good now.
I can go on and on. Granted, a long playoff run into late july will break a team which has to start again in fall. Injuries are probable,
he just doesn't feel like a man with a vision, and he relies on a combo of over-the-hill vets and young guys who are not ready for principal roles.
rinse and repeat

 

[sampollock]

habs need a Dale Talon

 

[Captain Mountain]

Dale Tallon built the team. Bowman came and the core was already there.

Dale Tallon was also way out of his depth by the time he was GM in Florida (look at how quickly Zito was able to turn things around). The league is evolving quickly and what worked 13-15 years ago doesn't work now. I'm not sure the Habs FO is adaptable enough to build a winner now. Even when they've made the right moves, it always felt they were trying to win a cup in the aughts instead of now.

 

[waffledave]

The team is ruined for years, too many big contracts and the pipeline is nothing special.

Just bring in Roy. If he bombs, he bombs. We are already the worst team I have ever seen.

 

[BLONG7]

but who exactly was the best guy available in 2012, Pierre McGuire ? Bergevin was already being groomed in one of the top market in the NHL, not exactly far fetched that he was one of the best hockey people available at the time.

without actually going back......not sure....but one thing is for sure, we did NOT need a guy who had NEVER been a GM at any level....so we ended up with the guy who needed training wheels for 9-10 years.....how can anyone be impressed.

There would have been many guys avaialble, but again, they wanted no part of any anglos.....only franco, so that's what we got..................Pierre Mcguire by the way, is like a cartoon character....again zero experience.

 

[Captain Mountain]

but who exactly was the best guy available in 2012, Pierre McGuire ? Bergevin was already being groomed in one of the top market in the NHL, not exactly far fetched that he was one of the best hockey people available at the time.

The bilingual GM bench has always been pretty shallow, but with hindsight the Habs should have gone with the other top candidate and brought back Brisebois. Even before he was GM, Tampa made a lot of moves that were reminiscent of some of the better low-key moves the Habs made when Brisebois was here. Specifically work done with the Syracuse Crunch and Hamilton Bulldogs (bringing in undrafted UFAs and player development). Brisebois had more AGM experience than Bergevin at the time too.

Bergevin was well respected, but I really doubt he was "one of the best hockey people available at the time". For frame of reference, Bergevin had less than a year's experience as an AGM before he was hired by the Habs.

 

[bcv]

GMs are mostly all the same.

I much prefer having one that speaks french. (#FireBergevin)

 

[Kriss E]

The team is ruined for years, too many big contracts and the pipeline is nothing special.

Just bring in Roy. If he bombs, he bombs. We are already the worst team I have ever seen.

Really funny how things turn. Bunch of fans kept saying how awesome our prospect pool is....best in the league I heard!..
KK out, Romanov barely holding his own as a bottom D, Caufield in AHL, not even sure Poehling will ever be a regular NHLer given his injuries, who's left? Suzuki? Heck, even he is playing out of his depth.
Some fans never learn. Always overrate the prospects.
That said, our development team also sucks donkey balls.

 

[Miller Time]

Really funny how things turn. Bunch of fans kept saying how awesome our prospect pool is....best in the league I heard!..
KK out, Romanov barely holding his own as a bottom D, Caufield in AHL, not even sure Poehling will ever be a regular NHLer given his injuries, who's left? Suzuki? Heck, even he is playing out of his depth.
Some fans never learn. Always overrate the prospects.
That said, our development team also sucks donkey balls.

yup...

top-5 prospect pool in 2014... led to no playoffs 3 of the next 5 years (would've been 4 of 6 if not for COVID), and of the talent in that group, only Lekhonen & 7th rounder Evans came anywhere close to their potential.

top-5 prospect pool in 2020... will MB be allowed to oversee yet another implosion? sure hope not.

 

[bcv]

Really funny how things turn. Bunch of fans kept saying how awesome our prospect pool is....best in the league I heard!..
KK out, Romanov barely holding his own as a bottom D, Caufield in AHL, not even sure Poehling will ever be a regular NHLer given his injuries, who's left? Suzuki? Heck, even he is playing out of his depth.
Some fans never learn. Always overrate the prospects.
That said, our development team also sucks donkey balls.

Development team most definitely sucks. But I wonder what's lacking. That's why habs need to hire someone from a team that has been good at developping talent to replace Timmins. Molson doesn't seem to be eager to flex his money muscles. One of the richest team in the league and they don't even have an in-house skating coach for their prospects? Ridiculous.

 

[Archijerej]

Molson doesn't seem to be eager to flex his money muscles. One of the richest team in the league and they don't even have an in-house skating coach for their prospects? Ridiculous.

Come on. The guy has set up a farm team in Laval and a brand new ECHL team. It's not about the money. They just don't know how to do it.

 

[eklund the clown]

GMs are mostly all the same.

I much prefer having one that speaks french. (#FireBergevin)

Yep it's worked great for the last 28 years

 

[Riddick412]

Two words: Everything's Fine.

 

[Captain Mountain]

without actually going back......not sure....but one thing is for sure, we did NOT need a guy who had NEVER been a GM at any level....so we ended up with the guy who needed training wheels for 9-10 years.....how can anyone be impressed.

There would have been many guys avaialble, but again, they wanted no part of any anglos.....only franco, so that's what we got..................Pierre Mcguire by the way, is like a cartoon character....again zero experience.

I disagree with the bolded. They specifically wanted a guy like Bergevin because they saw the failings of an old school guy with Gainey and Gauthier. The issue is that Bergevin is pretty old-school too and Chicago was far less of a "model franchise" that the public was lead to believe

 

[bcv]

Yep it's worked great for the last 28 years

These are the teams that haven't won the stanley cups in the last 20 years. 17/18 (94%) had no language restrictions.

Please explain to me how my argument, which was that GMs are mostly the same, was wrong.

 

[1909]

Yep it's worked great for the last 28 years

Leafs have a unilingual English speaking GM since 1967.........

 

[bcv]

Also, here's the list of teams that are currently in a drought of post-seasons series win. 100% of them had no language restriction for their hires.

Most GMs are dimes a dozen.

 

[montreal]

Really funny how things turn. Bunch of fans kept saying how awesome our prospect pool is....best in the league I heard!..
KK out, Romanov barely holding his own as a bottom D, Caufield in AHL, not even sure Poehling will ever be a regular NHLer given his injuries, who's left? Suzuki? Heck, even he is playing out of his depth.
Some fans never learn. Always overrate the prospects.
That said, our development team also sucks donkey balls.

they do have one of the best in the league, but it's because of the '18 drafts and on. KK is out but that's not his fault or Timmins imo. Time will tell how good or not he is. Romanov was overrated by Hab fans just like Poehling was due to the WJC's, I said this many times. But Romanov is young, came to the Habs raw thanks to his KHL team using him as a 5th/6th/7th D and the Habs yet again rushing another kid to the NHL.

I think Romanov will be a solid bottom pairing D at worst but it may take some time. Poehling like Evans and countless others, yes you have to worry about anyone that gets a couple concussions as we saw what happened to Shaw, it sucks but sadly it's a part of the game. Not on Timmins, just as any injury isn't his fault of course.

Suzuki will be fine imo, the team sucks so everyone is piling on but I'm not worried about him at all or Caufield. I worry much more about Molson, MB, and the coaches they hire who think it's 1990's.

That said and it's not an excuse but a fact, it's hard to say what you have in prospects due to covid, as the OHL didn't play at all last year, the AHL played half a season and against the same 3 or so teams. The Q/WHL less then half a season. So what impact did that have? The Habs pick from '21 Vrbetic didn't play a game for 19 months or so, who knows what impact that has as we have never seen whole leagues not play for that long, especially when the OHL might be the best junior league in the world.

One of the Habs top prospects is Guhle but who knows what he really is as he missed almost an entire year of one of the most important years of development imo (his age 18 season). Outside the WJC's he played a couple games, very hard to get a read on that. Then you have Mailloux, never played much at a high level so who knows what he is.

The Habs have 3 of the current top 8 or so scorers in the Q, one of the top goalies in the NCAA so far, Farrell just put up 7 pts in 2 games though vs weak teams. Biondi will likely easily have more goals then he had points last year. Mysak looks solid. Norlinder if he can stay healthy is the one I'm holding out most hope for. Harris will be an NHLer, 100% no doubt in my mind. Tuch is very interesting. There's clearly a lot to like but with prospects it's always about how much they continue to progress or not. Of course having shit development does have it's impacts.

But I've this what feels like a 1000 times, Fans of any sport will ALWAYS overrate their prospects, it's human nature and I don't see the problem as it gives us some hope for the future. Molson, MB, the MT/Juline/Dom/clone these guys can't be here forever.

 

[eklund the clown]

View attachment 475961

Also, here's the list of teams that are currently in a drought of post-seasons series win. 100% of them had no language restriction for their hires.

Most GMs are dimes a dozen.

Am not going to get in the language debate again.Just to say when you are picking a GM that has to speak a certain language instead of choosing the best candidate available you are behind the 8 ball right off the get go.I don't care what sport it is or business for that matter.

 

[bcv]

Am not going to get in the language debate again.Just to say when you are picking a GM that has to speak a certain language instead of choosing the best candidate available you are behind the 8 ball right off the get go.I don't care what sport it is or business for that matter.

Yes, that seems to be the argument of the people who don't have anything to back up what they're saying.

Who was available that would've been a better hire than Bergevin when he was hired? Who became available while Bergevin was working for the habs at a time that replacing him would've been possible that would've done a better job?

Yzerman? He was going to Detroit. Zito? Too early to tell. Don Sweeney? Only 3 years after Bergevin was hired, so the Habs weren't really looking at anyone. Brisebois? Well, perhaps. But he's franco so...

 

[dinodebino]

without actually going back......not sure....but one thing is for sure, we did NOT need a guy who had NEVER been a GM at any level....so we ended up with the guy who needed training wheels for 9-10 years.....how can anyone be impressed.

There would have been many guys avaialble, but again, they wanted no part of any anglos.....only franco, so that's what we got..................Pierre Mcguire by the way, is like a cartoon character....again zero experience.

Jim Nill refused to be interviewed. FYI. He's as French as Christiano Ronaldo is Chinese.

 

[dinodebino]

Yep it's worked great for the last 28 years

Sam Pollock says hi.

 

[dinodebino]

I wish that, one day, on this forum of hockey fans (and a few Habs fans), someone would have the gonads to stop this foolish nonsense about the Québec factor in le Club de hockey Canadien Inc.

This is an Anglo site, I understand that. I also understand that the Ys and the Millenials dominate discussions here. I do, really.

I wish that some moderator would care to have a sticky thread (no replies, just a simple post) about why, oh! why this organization will ALWAYS have a Québec-based or Franco-based administrative core. A thread where our younger ones (and some older and stubbornly redneck posters) would learn WHY it is that way, and WHY it will never change. It is getting tiresome to reply to all the ignorant posts about the language issue. It's like trying to plug the holes of a sinking Titanic with your fingers.

I suggest to the younger ones to read some of the great books put forth by the likes of Camil DesRoches, Claude Mouton and Ken Dryden on the history of this club. To learn and think before posting such absurd comments about the Francophone factor. Dryden, in his recent Scotty Bowman biography explains it. He explains why Bowman was first given a chance as a young coach in the minor ranks. He explains why Sam Pollock was chosen by the outsider that Frank Selke was (Selke understood the culture and the importance of having 'locals' run the show). He explains how Pollock understood what he had done by naming Al McNeil as coach. And he never repeated it afterwards.

Go read on how Pollock understood the importance of the universal draft before anybody else in the league. The man was a genius. Arguably the best GM in pro sports history. Un tit-cul de Snowdon, Montréal, PeeQue.

This is the Club de hockey CanadiEN. Not CanadiAN. It was done with a purpose. I even wonder if people here on the forum know why was the name chosen. Does anyone have a clue? And does anyone here know how players were picked by teams at the time of the original six (yes, some poster STILL believe that all Québec-born players automatically went to the Club de hockey Canadien Inc.)?

All I can say is that : there are 32 teams in the NHL as of today. Your Maroons died a long time ago. You have the choice of 31 other teams to cheer from. Go ahead! Make my day!

BriseBois WAS the best candidate at the time of Bergevin's hire, in hindsight. He was too close to the old regime. There was a period in hockey where I thought that Blair McKasey (good old Lac St-Louis guy) had the talent and the knowledge to be a good GM.

YES, I favour our locals. Just like Taranna favoured the kid as GM because he was a 'local' product. You know who would be a good candidate too, and he's not from Québec, but close enough to me? Bobby Smith! Played here, speaks the language of the majority (at least he used to) and comes from Ottawa. Plus he KNOWS the Q by heart.

So there. Sue me.