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OT: General Video Game Discussion IX

BagHead said:
Interesting. I'm not sure it's as black and white as is being presented in this article. They've got one side of the story, but here's another from The Motley Fool (for what they're worth):


So the idea is that they'll hurt these garbage-game-shovelers via this policy, stopping them from peddling, or at least earning some money from them. Further, Apple's privacy updates also hurt Unity's ability to make money via advertising, one of their two main sources of income. I've also attached the image below of their "profitability". You'll notice all of the numbers are both negative and growing in magnitude. They need to find a way to start earning money, and I think this move is a bit of desperation.

View attachment 743061

I don't know that this is a good move by them, but I think I can understand why they're doing it. The question is, do developers want to have Unity for a price, or not have Unity at all?

From a video gamer's POV: This is bullshit, and this is an example of why I was against owning a digital license to play a game, instead of owning a game outright, in the first place.
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Admittedly I haven't gone digging through licensing agreements to know the details, but I don't think the "stopping shovelware" angle holds much water. If that was the goal I don't see why they'd change the terms for already established, fully developed games. That's a huge rug-pull on what's probably their most important users (developers that have actually released successful Unity games).

I'm also curious as to whether or not they actually can do that. It's not exactly retroactively changing the terms of the agreement, but with how game distribution works in practice these days (i.e. you buy a license but generally don't retrieve a copy of the game until you want to play it) it amounts to the same thing.

Doing this in an attempt to solve cash flow problems? That I believe. "Squeeze our existing customer base for every penny while alienating everyone" has been Oracle's business model for like 3 decades, so maybe it'll work.
 
Bazeek said:
Admittedly I haven't gone digging through licensing agreements to know the details, but I don't think the "stopping shovelware" angle holds much water. If that was the goal I don't see why they'd change the terms for already established, fully developed games. That's a huge rug-pull on what's probably their most important users (developers that have actually released successful Unity games).

I'm also curious as to whether or not they actually can do that. It's not exactly retroactively changing the terms of the agreement, but with how game distribution works in practice these days (i.e. you buy a license but generally don't retrieve a copy of the game until you want to play it) it amounts to the same thing.

Doing this in an attempt to solve cash flow problems? That I believe. "Squeeze our existing customer base for every penny while alienating everyone" has been Oracle's business model for like 3 decades, so maybe it'll work.
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I'll admit readily that I don't know the legality of it at all, and will not speculate on that, but if someone does I'd love to hear them speak about it.

I think what they're doing is extremely unfriendly to the entire video game ecosystem - publishers, developers and gamers - but I don't know what the ramifications will be. Plenty of things get lots of bluster from people, and little follow-through, but sometimes follow-through also happens (see DnD's OGL controversy).

I don't know Unity's business in depth, so I don't know if this is a last-ditch effort by Unity to keep their company afloat, or if it's just an easy (re: lazy) fix for them, but if it's the former we may see a world where Unreal is the only game engine for indy studios. Dark days, them be.
 
Lapa said:
Baldur's Gate 3 is addicting as Hell. Amazing game.
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Agreed. Been slowly easing into it after trying a few characters. Runs great on PS5 and, although it will never be as easy as a keyboard/mouse, the controller works OK
 
Recently got Stardew valley. I don't really like games like Minecraft and was worried it was going to be similar. However, this is actually a pretty addicting game and very go at your own pace which is nice.
 
HotDish said:
Recently got Stardew valley. I don't really like games like Minecraft and was worried it was going to be similar. However, this is actually a pretty addicting game and very go at your own pace which is nice.
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that game is a masterpiece
 
Anyone try Starfield yet? With my youngest off at college now I may fire up his Xbox and try it out.

Talon, now that you have a PS5 you should give God Of War - Ragnarok a go. It's my favorite PS5 game so far.
 
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Built a new PC a couple of months ago. Late to the party with Diablo 4. Never played 3 but was a huge fan of 2.

I don't know if I'll go back to it once this season is over. Once you stomp wt4 stuff, only thing left is Uber Lilith and ain't no one got time for that grind.

Considering BG3.
 
Jbcraig1883 said:
Built a new PC a couple of months ago. Late to the party with Diablo 4. Never played 3 but was a huge fan of 2.

I don't know if I'll go back to it once this season is over. Once you stomp wt4 stuff, only thing left is Uber Lilith and ain't no one got time for that grind.

Considering BG3.
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Sounds very similar to the sequence of events for me. I played Diablo 4 until just a bit before season 1 started. I'd done everything except grind my levels and gear up enough to fight the absolute toughest bosses. The fact of the matter was that I didn't see any value in doing so, I wasn't having much fun. I thought I'd come back once season 1 began, but then it began and I just couldn't be bothered to. Didn't see the point in it.

Luckily, Baldur's Gate 3 came out around then and I've been playing it ever since. It's been so well designed for fun that I don't see the point in stopping. If you end up playing BG3 next, I hope you enjoy it as much as I have!
 
BagHead said:
Sounds very similar to the sequence of events for me. I played Diablo 4 until just a bit before season 1 started. I'd done everything except grind my levels and gear up enough to fight the absolute toughest bosses. The fact of the matter was that I didn't see any value in doing so, I wasn't having much fun. I thought I'd come back once season 1 began, but then it began and I just couldn't be bothered to. Didn't see the point in it.

Luckily, Baldur's Gate 3 came out around then and I've been playing it ever since. It's been so well designed for fun that I don't see the point in stopping. If you end up playing BG3 next, I hope you enjoy it as much as I have!
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That is great to hear! For BG3, do I have to be a D&D fan to enjoy it? I've played a wide range of games over the years but never got into D&D.

Re D4 - one part of me enjoys it being simpler than Path of Exile, but being able to trade/upgrade gear and improve yourself seems much better compared to the Paragon system. The lack of equipment (I went 6 levels in my 70s without ever seeing an improvement. If I didn't get focused on completing region milestones, I'd prolly have never come back.
 
Jbcraig1883 said:
That is great to hear! For BG3, do I have to be a D&D fan to enjoy it? I've played a wide range of games over the years but never got into D&D.

Re D4 - one part of me enjoys it being simpler than Path of Exile, but being able to trade/upgrade gear and improve yourself seems much better compared to the Paragon system. The lack of equipment (I went 6 levels in my 70s without ever seeing an improvement. If I didn't get focused on completing region milestones, I'd prolly have never come back.
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I'll admit that having played the tabletop version of the 5e ruleset made it so I had almost no learning curve. You'll probably have one, but the game teaches it to you on the fly and well. Just a tip in regards to learning, there are lots of keywords like "advantage" or conditions like "poisoned" in the game. If you ever see those and want to know what they are, just hover over the ability that has it, hit the examine button (T on keyboards, not sure on controller), and it'll tell you.
As far as the story goes, no, you can be new and enjoy it just fine. Everything gets explained in a really diegetic way, no real lore dumps or anything that goes overboard. There's some callbacks/fanfare to the greybeards who played the first games, but you won't feel left out.

D4 had its moments of fun for me, but most of those were in the first 50 levels. The game has some good parts, but I just never felt like everything clicked all at once to make a great experience.
 
BagHead said:
Sounds very similar to the sequence of events for me. I played Diablo 4 until just a bit before season 1 started. I'd done everything except grind my levels and gear up enough to fight the absolute toughest bosses. The fact of the matter was that I didn't see any value in doing so, I wasn't having much fun. I thought I'd come back once season 1 began, but then it began and I just couldn't be bothered to. Didn't see the point in it.

Luckily, Baldur's Gate 3 came out around then and I've been playing it ever since. It's been so well designed for fun that I don't see the point in stopping. If you end up playing BG3 next, I hope you enjoy it as much as I have!
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I played the hell out of the first 2. I was a huge PC gamer. Would build a new PC (except the vid card) every 2 years or so, then on the alternating years get a new video card. Then a few years back, my gaming PC started having issues and would randomly shut down. I got lazy, fed up and quit trying to track down the issue. Eventually I got an XBOX One and around the time I hit my early 40's I just lost interest in gaming. Kept buying games, would try and play, then after 30-60 minutes get bored with whatever game it was and never play it again. No idea what changed. After seeing BG3...I've really, really had to fight the urge to build a new gaming PC. Thankfully I'm old(er) and realize the other current priorities take precedence. (New truck and ATV payments)
 
MK9 said:
I played the hell out of the first 2. I was a huge PC gamer. Would build a new PC (except the vid card) every 2 years or so, then on the alternating years get a new video card. Then a few years back, my gaming PC started having issues and would randomly shut down. I got lazy, fed up and quit trying to track down the issue. Eventually I got an XBOX One and around the time I hit my early 40's I just lost interest in gaming. Kept buying games, would try and play, then after 30-60 minutes get bored with whatever game it was and never play it again. No idea what changed. After seeing BG3...I've really, really had to fight the urge to build a new gaming PC. Thankfully I'm old(er) and realize the other current priorities take precedence. (New truck and ATV payments)
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I've had the same issue with games. I actually hadn't bought any for quite a while before finally buying Diablo 4 and BG3. We're of an age, you and me, and I've come to realize that most games... I've played them already, just by a different name. I'll be sticking to quality games that I'm actually excited for from now on. BG3 fit that mold, and I don't regret it.

That said, I'm a big fan of being fiscally responsible. Don't spend the money unless you have it, and if you've got other priorities... well hey, BG3 will still be there in 3, 5, or 10 years.
 
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BagHead said:
I've had the same issue with games. I actually hadn't bought any for quite a while before finally buying Diablo 4 and BG3. We're of an age, you and me, and I've come to realize that most games... I've played them already, just by a different name. I'll be sticking to quality games that I'm actually excited for from now on. BG3 fit that mold, and I don't regret it.

That said, I'm a big fan of being fiscally responsible. Don't spend the money unless you have it, and if you've got other priorities... well hey, BG3 will still be there in 3, 5, or 10 years.
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For me, part of it is the games themselves. I wish I could articulate it in a way that would make sense. But, they just don't have a "vibe" I get anymore. I know that probably sounds odd. Like I say, I don't know how to explain it. I can actually think back to certain games and recall kind of a mood or feeling I had while playing. Not sure if it's me and my personality just changed? But, I do think there is a part of it, that the game developers have changed. They've gotten younger, game development direction, styles and whatnot has changed over the years, etc. Which I kind of think has more to do with it honestly. Which I get sounds like an old guy bitching about how it is now vs the "good old days". Which, maybe it is. But, the fact remains, there just isn't much about a lot of the new games that grabs me.
 
MK9 said:
For me, part of it is the games themselves. I wish I could articulate it in a way that would make sense. But, they just don't have a "vibe" I get anymore. I know that probably sounds odd. Like I say, I don't know how to explain it. I can actually think back to certain games and recall kind of a mood or feeling I had while playing. Not sure if it's me and my personality just changed? But, I do think there is a part of it, that the game developers have changed. They've gotten younger, game development direction, styles and whatnot has changed over the years, etc. Which I kind of think has more to do with it honestly. Which I get sounds like an old guy bitching about how it is now vs the "good old days". Which, maybe it is. But, the fact remains, there just isn't much about a lot of the new games that grabs me.
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No, it makes perfect sense. You used to get into a flow, and now you're not. I've felt that, too. This is also going to sound like such an old man thing to say, but they don't make them like they used to. Literally. My theory is that it's because they're focused on the software-as-a-service model of monetization, which is less risky, less boom or bust, than making a complete game and hoping it sells well for $60. Basically, they try making them addicting once people get into them, but they're sacrificing a complete, fun experience as a result.

It's very anecdotal, but I can count on one hand the number of games in the last 7-8 years that have gotten me into a flow state, and none of them had in game shops. Actually, one did, but it didn't at first. Once that shop opened, the game went downhill.
 
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Dickie Dunn said:
Anyone try Starfield yet? With my youngest off at college now I may fire up his Xbox and try it out.

Talon, now that you have a PS5 you should give God Of War - Ragnarok at go. It's my favorite PS5 game so far.
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It is every bit a Bethesda game, this time in space. If you generally like how Skyrim and Fallout 4 played, you will like Starfield. I'm having a good time.
 
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BagHead said:
No, it makes perfect sense. You used to get into a flow, and now you're not. I've felt that, too. This is also going to sound like such an old man thing to say, but they don't make them like they used to. Literally. My theory is that it's because they're focused on the software-as-a-service model of monetization, which is less risky, less boom or bust, than making a complete game and hoping it sells well for $60. Basically, they try making them addicting once people get into them, but they're sacrificing a complete, fun experience as a result.

It's very anecdotal, but I can count on one hand the number of games in the last 7-8 years that have gotten me into a flow state, and none of them had in game shops. Actually, one did, but it didn't at first. Once that shop opened, the game went downhill.
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I would 100% agree with that assessment. When Raph Koster left SOE and the Star Wars Galaxies team back in 2004 ('05?) He even said back then that that's the direction the entire industry was headed and where he was going to focus. "Microtransactions". Said these companies realized they could make far more money than doing simple monthly sub fees. He was clearly not wrong. But, I believe for sure that it has been detrimental to the gaming experience.
 
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AKL said:
It is every bit a Bethesda game, this time in space. If you generally like how Skyrim and Fallout 4 played, you will like Starfield. I'm having a good time.
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Thanks. Fallout 4 is one of my favorite games so this sounds like something I will like.
 
Lapa said:
I’ve never played D&D and I enjoy it.
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BagHead said:
I'll admit that having played the tabletop version of the 5e ruleset made it so I had almost no learning curve. You'll probably have one, but the game teaches it to you on the fly and well. Just a tip in regards to learning, there are lots of keywords like "advantage" or conditions like "poisoned" in the game. If you ever see those and want to know what they are, just hover over the ability that has it, hit the examine button (T on keyboards, not sure on controller), and it'll tell you.
As far as the story goes, no, you can be new and enjoy it just fine. Everything gets explained in a really diegetic way, no real lore dumps or anything that goes overboard. There's some callbacks/fanfare to the greybeards who played the first games, but you won't feel left out.

D4 had its moments of fun for me, but most of those were in the first 50 levels. The game has some good parts, but I just never felt like everything clicked all at once to make a great experience.
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I'll probably give it a shot after D4 season ends.

I also might give COD MW3 a shot, simply because I heard that the maps will all be from 2009 MW2, which was the COD I really got into. Also looking to try Forza Motorsports - played the first two.

To the points above about not making games like they used to - this is something that has kept me away for years. I always tend to compare games to the old ones I played growing up - Ultima Online, Shadowbane, Star Wars Galaxies, MUDS, Final Fantasy Tactics, etc. all seemed way more fun/better than the modern ones.

Anywho, I figured I'd give gaming one last shot with the new computer, so we will see what happens.
 
Dickie Dunn said:
Thanks. Fallout 4 is one of my favorite games so this sounds like something I will like.
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I'm enjoying it, I can't say it really breaks any new ground in terms of gameplay or features, the ship customization is cool if you can get into it, my friend is really into it but I haven't been so far
 
It starts pretty slow but I'm enjoying Starfield a lot now. Wish it wasn't so tedious to store / craft stuff though. I also liked the fallout 4 settlement / shared resources more.
 
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