Garth Snow Pt. III - Snow’s inactivity

[ThreeLeftSkates]

The link works, and it's from 2018. How often would you want a quote from a minority owner who isn't involved in the hockey operations?

Confused as to why you're even commenting. You think Wang is running the hockey operations?

No, but it did not work the first time. He might as well be at this point.

 

[Lame Lambert]

I think lost in all of his other f*** ups is his complete inability to manage the cap and negotiate with free agents. This moron has given us:
UFA Ladd 7 x 5.5 with NMC and NTC
UFA Clutterbuck 5 x 3.5
RFA Cizikas 5 x 3.35
UFA Greiss 3 x 3.33
UFA Boychuk 7 x 6 NMC and NTC
RFA Pelech 4 x 1.6
RFA Mayfield 5 x 1.45

Meanwhile the top 6, the only good thing about this team, has four players that need new contracts in the next 2 years: Tavares, Lee, Eberle, and Barzal.

 

[Costigan77]

I think lost in all of his other **** ups is his complete inability to manage the cap and negotiate with free agents. This moron has given us:
UFA Ladd 7 x 5.5 with NMC and NTC
UFA Clutterbuck 5 x 3.5
RFA Cizikas 5 x 3.35
UFA Greiss 3 x 3.33
UFA Boychuk 7 x 6 NMC and NTC
RFA Pelech 4 x 1.6
RFA Mayfield 5 x 1.45

Meanwhile the top 6, the only good thing about this team, has four players that need new contracts in the next 2 years: Tavares, Lee, Eberle, and Barzal.

Out of all of those, the only one I disagree with is Boychuk. It's long, but there is a CBA coming, possible buyouts, and I believe with the momentum they had he was necessary. The guy plays hard he is just breaking down. I kind of think Czikas was the same boat, but they over paid. I was a huge Clutterbuck fan, but he has gotten way soft and is a waste. Ladd I thought at the time was a good move. So I was wrong. Greiss, Pelech, Mayfield (sorry threw up in my mouth) Clutter are horrendous

 

[Lame Lambert]

Out of all of those, the only one I disagree with is Boychuk. It's long, but there is a CBA coming, possible buyouts, and I believe with the momentum they had he was necessary. The guy plays hard he is just breaking down. I kind of think Czikas was the same boat, but they over paid. I was a huge Clutterbuck fan, but he has gotten way soft and is a waste. Ladd I thought at the time was a good move. So I was wrong. Greiss, Pelech, Mayfield (sorry threw up in my mouth) Clutter are horrendous

I’m perfectly fine with Boychuk, and we’re a better team with him. Just pointing out that it is not a good contract.

 

[Spybot]

Yeah, we've gotten (and continue to get) decent value out of Boychuk. The fact that all it amounted to is a single playoff series win is not the problem that has anything to do with his play. The Cizikas contract was so unnecesary. He was an RFA yet Garth gave him a long term 3 million+ contract as if he expected him to become a mainstain in the middle6. Yet the organization continues to deploy him predominantly in a 4th line role. As an RFA he could have just been given a 2-3 year 4th liner's contract. Out of all those deal that's the one I don't understand the most.

 

[Lame Lambert]

Since Garth Snow took over as GM the Bruins gave away Phil Kessel, Tyler Seguin, and Dougie Hamilton. Despite this, they rebuilt into a cup contender within 4 years.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I think lost in all of his other **** ups is his complete inability to manage the cap and negotiate with free agents. This moron has given us:
UFA Ladd 7 x 5.5 with NMC and NTC
UFA Clutterbuck 5 x 3.5
RFA Cizikas 5 x 3.35
UFA Greiss 3 x 3.33
UFA Boychuk 7 x 6 NMC and NTC
RFA Pelech 4 x 1.6
RFA Mayfield 5 x 1.45

Meanwhile the top 6, the only good thing about this team, has four players that need new contracts in the next 2 years: Tavares, Lee, Eberle, and Barzal.

I think the bigger sin is the term on each of those deals. The dollar amounts on some might be a bit high, but aren't that big of a deal if they were for 1 or 2 seasons. But Snow seems to want to lock up non-core guys for like 5+ years all the time.

IMO, the only guys who should get long term contracts are players who are core guys. The complimentary/depth guys should never be given long term deals.

 

[MJF]

Check out The Athletic’s Pierre LeBrun. He interviewed new Hurricanes owner Tom Dundon about why he fired Ron Francis and what he expects from his Hockey Ops Dept going forward. It makes me realize how much of a copout Jon Ledecky made on Boomer Esiason’s show in January with his “players play, coaches coah, owners own” crap. I get wanting to be a hands off owner in matters that you have no knowledge in but I’ve don’t recall Ledecky ever stating publicly what he expects from his Hockey Ops Dept. he should address it in light of the lack of success his current GM has had since the financial shackles came off and he started spending the Barclays money. Snow answers to ownership.

 

[Seph]

Since Garth Snow took over as GM the Bruins gave away Phil Kessel, Tyler Seguin, and Dougie Hamilton. Despite this, they rebuilt into a cup contender within 4 years.

While I get your point, the Bruins got Seguin and Hamilton for Kessel, so they really only gave away Kessel in the end.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

While I get your point, the Bruins got Seguin and Hamilton for Kessel, so they really only gave away Kessel in the end.

I think the Bruins are also proof that, as long as you have good management/scouting/development/coaching, you don't have to "win" every trade you make. You can afford to make a mistake or two, and still ice a strong club.

Which goes back to a comment I made a while ago. Judging a GM on their trading resume isn't the best way to look at things because all good GMs have made bad trades at some point, and all bad GMs have made good trades at some point.

 

[Seph]

I think the Bruins are also proof that, as long as you have good management/scouting/development/coaching, you don't have to "win" every trade you make. You can afford to make a mistake or two, and still ice a strong club.

Which goes back to a comment I made a while ago. Judging a GM on their trading resume isn't the best way to look at things because all good GMs have made bad trades at some point, and all bad GMs have made good trades at some point.

Fully agreed on both points.

A lot of that is having good ownership, too. The Bruins have been very stable and well financed for the entirety of the cap era. When you look at their scouting department, it dwarfs ours, and I feel like that says something about how much they're willing to pay their off ice staff, which has resulted in a consistently high quality product on the ice.

The Islanders, on the other hand, I'm guessing like Snow primarily for his willingness to do the job for cheaper than hiring a good GM would cost. Same probably goes for the coaching staffs, both past and present. The only coach we've hired since Wang took over that actually had NHL head coaching experience was a guy who was blacklisted by every other team, and I have little doubt that a lot of that is the budget only allows a salary at whatever the coaching equivalent of minimum wage is.

I was hoping this was something that would change under Ledecky/Malkin, but it appears they're running the team with Wang's advice, so I doubt it will.

 

[aronjudge11]

great points about only lowest paid coaches very few scouts and one can asume snow is not paid much. You want garth snow gone from the islanders? He would need to win 2 cups in a row here...ask for a raise...and be shown the door. Its a mickey mouse operation. Tavares can think otherwise because hes having the time of his life ..hes healthy...young..getting married..might even sign his career away with these losers but they are still a loser organization.

 

[12Dog]

great points about only lowest paid coaches very few scouts and one can asume snow is not paid much. You want garth snow gone from the islanders? He would need to win 2 cups in a row here...ask for a raise...and be shown the door. Its a mickey mouse operation. Tavares can think otherwise because hes having the time of his life ..hes healthy...young..getting married..might even sign his career away with these losers but they are still a loser organization.

And here lays the reason for Snow’s longevity, will work cheap wear many hats and function under a budget no real bonafide professional would.

 

[periferal]

When basically the most positive thing on your 12 year resume is another GM's work...

 

[Instant]

When basically the most positive thing on your 12 year resume is another GM's work...

You think Chiarelli is a fan of the Islanders and is trying to do Snow's job for him?

 

[Seph]

When basically the most positive thing on your 12 year resume is another GM's work...

Technically, the draft pick used to select Beauvillier came from Yzerman.

 

[periferal]

Technically, the draft pick used to select Beauvillier came from Yzerman.

Officially, that is not the point.

 

[BelovedIsles]

When basically the most positive thing on your 12 year resume is another GM's work...

Honestly, they had one of the best 1st lines in the league too! That's the Snow line, pains me to give him any kind of credit.

 

[Seph]

Officially, that is not the point.

To be fair, the point wasn't really valid anyway. I want Snow gone as much as the next guy, but acting like Snow had no part in drafting Barzal and Beauvillier is just baseless. Yes, Chiarelli traded Snow some good picks, but Snow was the one that selected the right players with them, and even made a separate move to improve the value of the 2nd one so that he could get the guy he had targeted. If this is what we're now stooping to find ways to criticize Snow, I'm afraid we're really going off the deepend.

 

[MJF]

To be fair, the point wasn't really valid anyway. I want Snow gone as much as the next guy, but acting like Snow had no part in drafting Barzal and Beauvillier is just baseless. Yes, Chiarelli traded Snow some good picks, but Snow was the one that selected the right players with them, and even made a separate move to improve the value of the 2nd one so that he could get the guy he had targeted. If this is what we're now stooping to find ways to criticize Snow, I'm afraid we're really going off the deepend.

I don’t have to stoop. I’ve got an arsenal full of things to criticize Snow for getting wrong without the Barzy and Tito picks.

 

[Seph]

I don’t have to stoop. I’ve got an arsenal full of things to criticize Snow for getting wrong without the Bo and Tito picks.

That's pretty much my point.

 

[redbull]

Honestly, they had one of the best 1st lines in the league too! That's the Snow line, pains me to give him any kind of credit.

Snow's had a lot of chances at that top line, starting from Parenteau - Moulson, some Cory Conacher, Jason Chimera, Thomas Vanek, Kyle Okposo and Frans -- maybe if he gets that many chances at re-building this team he'll get it right.

Someone get the man some monkeys and some typewriters.

 

[sabremike]

Check out The Athletic’s Pierre LeBrun. He interviewed new Hurricanes owner Tom Dundon about why he fired Ron Francis and what he expects from his Hockey Ops Dept going forward. It makes me realize how much of a copout Jon Ledecky made on Boomer Esiason’s show in January with his “players play, coaches coah, owners own” crap. I get wanting to be a hands off owner in matters that you have no knowledge in but I’ve don’t recall Ledecky ever stating publicly what he expects from his Hockey Ops Dept. he should address it in light of the lack of success his current GM has had since the financial shackles came off and he started spending the Barclays money. Snow answers to ownership.

You realize the reaction around the league to what Dundon (who fancies himself as Mark Cuban) is doing is "this is not going to end well"? That doesn't excuse L&M for not taking action that it is painfully obvious needs to be taken, but the situation in Carolina is going to be just as bad and counterproductive.

 

[gordie43]

Snow's had a lot of chances at that top line, starting from Parenteau - Moulson, some Cory Conacher, Jason Chimera, Thomas Vanek, Kyle Okposo and Frans -- maybe if he gets that many chances at re-building this team he'll get it right.

Someone get the man some monkeys and some typewriters.

Don’t forget Peter Regin and Pierre Marc Bouchard

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

I’m perfectly fine with Boychuk, and we’re a better team with him.

Problem is that the team paid him #1 defenseman money and he isn't one.

The rest of those contracts... 1 or 2 would be fine. Problem is that you have all these bottom 6 types on long term money deals. That's bad.