Pre-Game Talk: Game 7: last chance for the core

[IrishInOntario]

Honestly, I get everyone is pissed but matthews has been really solid for most of the series. Was our best player for the first couple of games. Also our best player against columbus last year and again with bruins and again with capitals. He is not a playoff choker.

Nylander has been bad in the playoffs except for this year and capitals. So he has been bad for like 4 years straight until this year.

Marner on the other hand. He hasnt had a single great series. Been bad for pretty much every single playoff series.

In my eyes, marner is the playoff choker. Nylander is getting by only because of this year. Matthews has been our best playoff player on this team overall

Matthews has 1 goal in the entire series, after winning the Rocket. I fully understand that he's playing a quality two way game, but I'm begging you to stop excusing him. He makes 11.7 million dollars to do 1 job. Score goals and produce the offense this team needs to win. That's his only job. Everything else he brings to the table is just extra.

1 goal. He's fundamentally failing to do his job, in the most miserable fashion possible. How many powerplays have the Leafs had? How many good looks has he flat out missed the net on? What's his shooting percentage in this series?

We expect Mackinnon numbers. We expect Kucherov numbers. We expect Rantanen numbers. We expect Marchand numbers. We expect numbers in line with the other best scorers in the world, who are carrying their teams right now. Nothing more and nothing less... And those aren't unreasonable expectations.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Ok, actual thoughts on Game 7 that isn’t just a trauma induced rage:

This team NEEDS to take the lead, no ifs, ands, or buts. Doesn’t matter if they can come back from down 1, 2, or 3 goals, they cannot complete the comeback. So they can’t put themselves in that position anymore. I don’t care who gets it, if it’s at EV, on the PP or the PK, someway somehow that puck needs to cross the goal line behind Price first!

If the Leafs go down again I don’t think they’ll have the capacity to tie it up, let alone comeback and win the f***ing thing. Even if they start like shit again, which I’d rather they didn’t, as long as they handle the storm and pot the first goal they should be ok.

But I’m probably deluding myself and they’ll find a way to blow it even if they score first.

 

[Superstar]

Not garbage, just undisciplined.

You mean like not being ready for the start of the game or not being engaged to start the post-season last year?

 

[IrishInOntario]

You make a good point.

I just think it's simpler than that. If the Leafs can somehow teach Marner not to overdo it every time he get frustrated, he'd be miles ahead. But he's been like this ever since he was in Junior and he won't change without a hard ass coach.

And, for the record, I am sure Marner hates to lose as much as the Tkachuk boys.

Marner doesn't bring any of the intangibles, skill set wise, nor from a physical standpoint, that make an elite PLAYOFF performer. When the whistles get put away and the clutching and grabbing starts, the cross checks in front of the net get ignored and teams play with better defensive structure, you better be able to get the net front, fend off a defender for a rebound, or be able to shoot heavily, with accuracy, from distance.

Mitch can't do either of those things and they just bully the shit out of him because he's small, soft, and unable to handle his own when the games get real and guys aren't screwing around.

 

[ECYCLE]

Matthews has 1 goal in the entire series, after winning the Rocket. I fully understand that he's playing a quality two way game, but I'm begging you to stop excusing him. He makes 11.7 million dollars to do 1 job. Score goals and produce the offense this team needs to win. That's his only job. Everything else he brings to the table is just extra.

1 goal. He's fundamentally failing to do his job, in the most miserable fashion possible. How many powerplays have the Leafs had? How many good looks has he flat out missed the net on? What's his shooting percentage in this series?

We expect Mackinnon numbers. We expect Kucherov numbers. We expect Rantanen numbers. We expect Marchand numbers. We expect numbers in line with the other best scorers in the world, who are carrying their teams right now. Nothing more and nothing less... And those aren't unreasonable expectations.

At the very least, you expect them to be ready for the game from the start. Call me crazy but if the Leafs pushed the Habs from the very start of the game, the hot takes in here would have been a lot more positive, if you can believe that.

 

[pcruz]

Can anybody tell me why #34 suddenly can't hit the net at all? And when he does, it's right into Price's chest? Where the hell did the release and the accuracy that won him the Rocket and had him on pace for 60 goals in the regular season, go?

He is being forced to take bad shots due to having a shadow on him.
Also, whenever he gets open, nobody is looking for him on the ice.
Marner is looking for his first goal in forever, and has forgotten how to pass.

Also, because he doesn't get the chance to shoot much, he has been setting up great chances - 3 grade A chances created today. 1 whiffed, 1 got stopped point blank, 1 flubbed it in his feet.

 

[CanadasTeam]

even steve is broken

Pretty much sums it all up for me.

 

[IrishInOntario]

He is being forced to take bad shots due to having a shadow on him.
Also, whenever he gets open, nobody is looking for him on the ice.
Marner is looking for his first goal in forever, and has forgotten how to pass.

Also, because he doesn't get the chance to shoot much, he has been setting up great chances - 3 grade A chances created today. 1 whiffed, 1 got stopped point blank, 1 flubbed it in his feet.

Mackinnon does not makes these excuses, nor does he have them made for him. He just produces. So does Marchand. So does Rantanen. So does Kucherov. Hell, so does Ehlers and you know who else? Nylander and Spezza. If those guys can get it done, #34 has no excuses. None.

Get Marner off his line in game 7. Hell, take Hyman off too if you think the other guys are the problem. I'm just tired of the excuses for #34. You're one of the highest paid players in the world. You're expected to produce like it.

37 year old Jason Spezza and William Nylander, playing without a centerman, can both get it done. It's time for #34 to drive his line to success, without the excuses.

 

[AvroArrow]

Marner needs to get the f*** off this team. Win or Lose. This core needs a major shake up. Nylander has easily been our most complete forward this series. He shows up every single shift. Meanwhile the 11M dollar cry baby has been invisible. Take his 11M and fix the glaring weaknesses on this team. Other than Thornton, Marner has been hands down the worst forward in the series between both teams. He's so scared out there he's holding Matthews back too.

 

[Kiwi]

Turn up and fight for the full 60 minutes like you learned something from the other games you managed to butcher

No excuses, I'm sick and tired of this crap every bloody year when an opportunity opens up

Take it ffs

 

[ORRFForever]

You mean like not being ready for the start of the game or not being engaged to start the post-season last year?

I don't know what that means.

What I do mean :

At some point in Marner's career, a coach should have taught him to keep it simple when you're struggling, not overdo it.

To his credit Matthews does that. Marner, on the other hand, tires too hard and, the next thing you know, he's screwed up.

 

[pcruz]

Mackinnon does not makes these excuses, nor does he have them made for him. He just produces. So does Marchand. So does Rantanen..so does Kucherov. Hell, so does Ehlers and you know who else? Nylander and Spezza. If those guys can get it done, #34 has no excuses. None.

And when MacKinnon, Rantanen, Kucherov, Hers, etc, play for the Leafs, I'll Care.

What do those players, in completely different scenarios have to do with Matthews?

Nothing.

They are irrelevant.

Why can't people focus on the facts at hand? Instead, they start looking elsewhere for irrelevant arguments?

 

[Leafs87]

There’s many valid answers but I’d say this teams true biggest isssue is that they’re too soft still.
Marner, Nylander literally avoid contact.
Montreal finished all their checks tonight while the leafs didn’t respond.

I’d be happy to win game 7 but if this is what they bring for the rest of the playoffs there’s really no hope.

 

[ORRFForever]

Marner doesn't bring any of the intangibles, skill set wise, nor from a physical standpoint, that make an elite PLAYOFF performer. When the whistles get put away and the clutching and grabbing starts, the cross checks in front of the net get ignored and teams play with better defensive structure, you better be able to get the net front, fend off a defender for a rebound, or be able to shoot heavily, with accuracy, from distance.

Mitch can't do either of those things and they just bully the shit out of him because he's small, soft, and unable to handle his own when the games get real and guys aren't screwing around.

I agree, it's an issue, but he can start by just making a simple pass or taking a shot instead of trying to dangle or do something special all the time. He overdoes everything when he gets frustrated.

 

[Superstar]

I don't know what that means.

What I do mean :

At some point in Marner's career, a coach should have taught him to keep it simple when you're struggling, not overdo it.

To his credit Matthews does that. Marner, on the other hand, tires too hard and, the next thing you know, he's screwed up.

Maybe coaches have, and he doesn't care...he is in the NHL now and is getting paid $10.893 million per year, and that has gotten in his head...maybe he thinks he better than he is, or he's just not good enough.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I think the only promising thing with the Leafs is that if they win this series, they did so largely without the contributions of any of their top 3 players (Matthews, Marner, and of course Tavares). Even if it is Montreal, it is tough for any team in the NHL to beat another team when none of their top players are performing.

 

[Stolie the Goalie]

Let's see what these character "locker room" guys like Foligno, Thornton and Simmonds bring to the game on Monday.

 

[Boxscore]

And, for the record, I am sure Marner hates to lose as much as the Tkachuk boys.

Marner has how many goals in his last 16 playoff games? ONE. Showing a sour puss on camera after the game is not hating to lose. Making sure you get a big goal the next game by any means necessary does. A top player cannot score 1 goal in 16 playoff games then convince me they absolutely hate losing--not buying it.

 

[IrishInOntario]

And when MacKinnon, Rantanen, Kucherov, Hers, etc, play for the Leafs, I'll Care.

What do those players, in completely different scenarios have to do with Matthews?

Nothing.

They are irrelevant.

Why can't people focus on the facts at hand? Instead, they start looking elsewhere for irrelevant arguments?

What's relevant about the players I'm mentioning is that they're playing under the same relative pressure, in the same important roles, playing the same high level minutes and they're all producing.

Matthews has 1 goal and a total of 4 points in the entire series, after winning the Rocket this year. In line with sub par production against Columbus last year as well. When you're playing as much as he is, your production should be through the roof.

McDavid and Draisaitl got roasted by the media for their awful production, that cost their team the series vs the Jets and Matthews and Marner deserve the exact same criticism.

 

[Aashir]

There’s many valid answers but I’d say this teams true biggest isssue is that they’re too soft still.
Marner, Nylander literally avoid contact.
Montreal finished all their checks tonight while the leafs didn’t respond.

I’d be happy to win game 7 but if this is what they bring for the rest of the playoffs there’s really no hope.

I’ll take avoiding hits if you produce. Matthews isn’t avoiding hits and he isn’t playing any better then Marner.Hits and production aren’t interconnected as nylander has 7 in 6. If Marner and matthews had 7-8 in 6 no one would be complaining, production is needed and Marner and Matthews aren’t bringing it.

 

[IrishInOntario]

I agree, it's an issue, but he can start by just making a simple pass or taking a shot instead of trying to dangle or do something special all the time. He overdoes everything when he gets frustrated.

He's just not a winner, IMO. No Patrick Kane or Martin St. Louis, unfortunately.

Johnny Gaudreau, 2.0.

 

[ORRFForever]

Maybe coaches have, and he doesn't care...he is in the NHL now and is getting paid $10.893 million per year, and that has gotten in his head...maybe he thinks he better than he is, or he's just not good enough.

We had a coach that could have corrected Marner (and Matthews) faults but we ran him out of town because we were too scared to offend the kids. Now we're upset because Marner can't play disciplined hockey.

Matthews, to his credit, is more disciplined. When things get tough, he stays within himself and doesn't overdo it. Marner goes bat**** crazy and tries to be Superman.

 

[ORRFForever]

He's just not a winner, IMO. No Patrick Kane or Martin St. Louis, unfortunately.

Johnny Gaudreau, 2.0.

Playoff hockey is a different animal. Rougher. Tougher. No space.

Again, he just needs to keep it simple and he'll be miles ahead of where he was tonight.

 

[Madap]

I think the only promising thing with the Leafs is that if they win this series, they did so largely without the contributions of any of their top 3 players (Matthews, Marner, and of course Tavares). Even if it is Montreal, it is tough for any team in the NHL to beat another team when none of their top players are performing.

I appreciate you trying to see some kind of positive out of this situation, but we do not deserve it. Don’t give them anything. This team is straight up pathetic. Regardless of if we win or lose the next game, don’t give them anything. This series should be far over by now. It’s ridiculous that it’s even this close. We’re relying on our 4th line to keep us in it? Ridiculous

 

[saffronleaf]

I don't even know if it matters. This team has proven it is hot garbage regardless. Maybe they sneak past a team that would never even be in the playoffs in a normal season. Most likely they don't. Either way, garbage.

What a pathetic team. No wonder Toronto is now a basketball town. Soon soccer and cricket will be ahead, too. No young kids choose to be a fan of such a pathetic, disgusting, sad sack of shit franchise that hasn't won a series since 2004 and a Cup since 1967.