GDT: Game # 51 Rangers vs Islanders - 7pm EST - MSG
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Richard Banger
Mamba Mentality
i find it interesting that Quinn was brought in to be a developmental coach and yet he continues to play the vets failing badly. Last time i checked if you get brought in to do a job and fail at it. You are gone.
Maybe i am just use to the NFL world where the shelf live on players and coaches are minimal.
Crease
Chief Justice of the HFNYR Court
- Jul 12, 2004
- 24,766
- 27,709
I don’t care if the fourth line has its shit together more than Zibanejad or Panarin, the top lines at 50% still give you a better chance to score. Please stop rolling out Howden and Rooney when you’re behind in the game.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Brendan Smith and Kaapo Kakko at the top of the analytics mountain post-Hajek:Just not an NHL player, but it was Smith’s fault when he was having bad numbers
effen
Registered User
- Jun 27, 2003
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it won't be. they are slowly moving to being a N/S puck possession team. think Chicago Blackhawks, with Panarin as Kane, but the other guys being Hossa and Toews. they are very clearly prioritizing making the kids well rounded players early in their careers to cement behaviors. at least it seems really obvious to me. but im not slobbering about quinn sucking and despairing over their counting stats.
Edge
Kris King's Ghost
The thing is that while we can debate how he's using the forwards, and I certainly do not agree with the ice time they are getting, I do think we are developing them and making them better players.
My beef with DQ on the issue is more that I think we're making it harder than it needs to be, or put another way, we're not as efficient as we could be.
I can take the good with the bad on that for DQ. I've never liked the approach of everything bad is the coach's fault and everything good is in spite of him. I think that tends to miss the point that it's somewhere in the middle.
BBKers
Registered User
Down 3 and a mere 12 minutes lewft. Still Rolling downthe river.... a la the notso MightyQuinnn
Richard Banger
Mamba Mentality
I think that the young players will be better Defensively because of Quinn. but i think thats the only thing they will be able to take from quinn,
Kakko doesn't get a chance. He's driven play and suppressed chances against, he's even put up points in stretches. He's played a 15:00 min game twice this month
Edge
Kris King's Ghost
I think their best days will come long after DQ is gone, no matter how the coach approaches things. And fully expect that when those days arrive, most fans will probably still be debating DQ's impact and whether they are doing so well because he's gone or because it's part of their natural development cycle.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Also, maybe we should just not be an east-west rush team seeing as we drafted two golden geese and neither of them skate particularly well.
Like, the Rangers know they can change the system, right?
BBKers
Registered User
David Quinn has no future here. NONE. Whatsover. His best before date has to be real close. And.. .other changes are needed too. Coaching and personel. Talent and assets are almost there. It looksverypromising actually. Seal the deal and close the bag. GEt the job done now Big Boys...
Paulie Walnutz
HFNYR JUST AS SOFT AS NYR
- Oct 1, 2008
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effen
Registered User
- Jun 27, 2003
- 12,726
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this is a hard truth, and LOTS of guys don't do this right now, but he also doesn't impose his will on a game. he very much takes whats there and even steals a little, but he's not forcing the issue. there were games he was, and he got 19 mins those games.
when you're not forcing him, quinn's gonna go with guys with history, like most coaches.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
I still can't get over the fact that in a game this important, DQ decided out of the clear blue sky to throw a Hajek-shaped grenade at the best defenseman in the league.
Oscar Lindberg
Registered User
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
If that was the logic, I would be fine with it, but you just know it was "Libor adds grit and we need somebody steady to play with our offense guy."
will1066
If you score four, you better f'n win the game
- Oct 12, 2008
- 52,381
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Edge
Kris King's Ghost
I think, to some extent, there's also a disagreement on this team's abilities at the present time, compared to the team's abilities when it's developed and gained experience.
It's kind of like savings bonds. People look at the number on the bonds and they say, "We should be rich! Why the hell are we struggling to pay the bills?"
But the bond hasn't matured yet, so even though it might say $5,000 on it, it's only worth a fraction of that right now.
I don't think DQ will be the coach beyond next season. But I also don't think that we're an uber-talented team that is failing to meet expectations. I really do think we're right about where we should be.
Right down to the slow star and the late season surge ultimately falling short, literally all of this is stuff I talked about on here months ago.
Some people just did not want to hear that. At all. Likewise, I've been saying for close to a year now that some big decisions are looming on the horizon for guys like Zibanejad and Buch, with their being legit concerns about the former. People did not want to hear that.
So at some point, I get the anger and frustration. I feel both as well. But none of this should be a surprise. It really shouldn't. The conversations in April 2021 are not all that different than they were in December 2020.
pld459666
Registered User
Pretty telling when your top players show nothing in games against your biggest local rival AND the team you have the best chance to catch.
Playoff atmosphere? Not to this group.
This team is done.
Playoff atmosphere? Not to this group.
This team is done.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
This keeps coming up so maybe I should just say it: it's absolutely not ok that this team gets brutalized on faceoffs on a nightly basis and I don't think anybody in the analytics community has implied that it is.
Here's what we have said:
1) The absolute best faceoff guys in the world lose 4 out of 10, so you can't look at a one-play sample of the other team scoring off the faceoff and say "well, that doesn't happen if we win the faceoff." Nobody just wins the faceoff all the time.
2) Faceoffs don't drive individual performance metrics in a meaningful way. If Player A is better than Player B, but player A wins 0% of his faceoffs and Player B wins 100% of his faceoffs, Player A is still better and will perform better in every stat (except faceoffs).
But as a team, over large samples, yes, it hurts.
Here's what we have said:
1) The absolute best faceoff guys in the world lose 4 out of 10, so you can't look at a one-play sample of the other team scoring off the faceoff and say "well, that doesn't happen if we win the faceoff." Nobody just wins the faceoff all the time.
2) Faceoffs don't drive individual performance metrics in a meaningful way. If Player A is better than Player B, but player A wins 0% of his faceoffs and Player B wins 100% of his faceoffs, Player A is still better and will perform better in every stat (except faceoffs).
But as a team, over large samples, yes, it hurts.
haohmaru
boomshakalaka
Thoughts:
Will this organization ever get it in their thick heads that face-offs matter? I feel like this has been an issue for the last TWENTY years
Hot potato passing/clears. I mean, you struggle all shift long to get possession, get it, and it's the end of the shift so you clear it right to the Islanders. This is exactly what they want you to do and the Rangers did it, and chased the game, all night long. If you're struggling that much to get the puck then you better make a much better effort to keep it when you do
Stick checking, lack of physicality, lack of discipline, "big guns" disappearing, etc... I'm not an anti-Quinn guy, but he clearly can't coach playoff hockey.
Howden, Kravstov, Kakko are your best players. If those are your three stars, and nothing against these young men, then you're going to lose against a seasoned veteran playoff team like the Islanders like boys vs. men.
I didn't look up numbers but how bad was Zibanejad on the draws tonight? Holy hell.
Will this organization ever get it in their thick heads that face-offs matter? I feel like this has been an issue for the last TWENTY years
Hot potato passing/clears. I mean, you struggle all shift long to get possession, get it, and it's the end of the shift so you clear it right to the Islanders. This is exactly what they want you to do and the Rangers did it, and chased the game, all night long. If you're struggling that much to get the puck then you better make a much better effort to keep it when you do
Stick checking, lack of physicality, lack of discipline, "big guns" disappearing, etc... I'm not an anti-Quinn guy, but he clearly can't coach playoff hockey.
Howden, Kravstov, Kakko are your best players. If those are your three stars, and nothing against these young men, then you're going to lose against a seasoned veteran playoff team like the Islanders like boys vs. men.
I didn't look up numbers but how bad was Zibanejad on the draws tonight? Holy hell.
When the movie plays out exactly the same next year, this place is going to be mt vesuvius
- Jan 18, 2012
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