GDT: Game 36: Red Wings vs caps 5:00 pm et 12/29/24

[redwingsfannn9191]

literally just beat a top 5 team

Love it

 

[Austrianwing]

I'm an austrian fellow and I'd much rather see Kasper playing 1C down in AHL than center the 4th line in the NHL.

I also think that even the points are not there, Kasper has shown that he is more than capable playing at NHL level. If u don't give him a chance playing with better wingers for the Wings, send him down to AHL.

I've followed Kaspers entire carreer and it's kinda strange to see what player he's become. He started out as pure playmaker when he was 13-14, they started to use him as "crash-the-net" hard nosed powerforward as soon as he's arrived professional men hockey.

Those natural playmaking skills are still there, but they won't flourish at NHL level on a 4th line. He's got a long taste of NHL now, let him become a PPG-Player in the AHL. He will become a serviceable top9 forward for the Wings for years to come. Except they do something stupid and trade him away.

Servus! Hast schon recht... wir koennen aber zwei drei Wochen erst warten.

 

[Gniwder]

He's been consistent in his assessment that Kasper needed more time in GR. Can't fault him for his opinion. I think between his current usage, and defensive play of late, he should go down as well.

People seem to have an issue differentiating between "needing more development" and "having no potential".

He probably would have been sent down already if the team had someone better than Fish and Motte. If Elmer wins a couple more fights against established fighters, he'll be worth calling up. He absolutely manhandled LaBate who isn't a top tier fighter, but the guy has been in quite a few.

 

[14ari13]

People seem to have an issue differentiating between "needing more development" and "having no potential".

He probably would have been sent down already if the team had someone better than Fish and Motte. If Elmer wins a couple more fights against established fighters, he'll be worth calling up. He absolutely manhandled LaBate who isn't a top tier fighter, but the guy has been in quite a few.

I would definitely send Kasper down.

I doubt Elmer is a good fighter, but he is huge.

Kasper and Berggren both have only 7 points and now Veleno joined them after getting 5 points in his last 7 games. A week or 2 down would maybe help Kaspers game.

 

[Gniwder]

I doubt Elmer is a good fighter, but he is huge.

Last night's game:

Elmer Soderblom vs. Joseph LaBate, December 28, 2024 - Grand Rapids Griffins vs. Cleveland Monsters | HockeyFights

HockeyFights - Elmer Soderblom vs. Joseph LaBate, December 28, 2024 - Grand Rapids Griffins vs. Cleveland Monsters

www.hockeyfights.com

LaBate is a Watson level fighter, but that was pretty impressive considering how little experience Elmer has. Plus he didn't even seem concerned about taking the whole line at the same time. Perfect technique and execution in a fight, but I broke that down in a different thread.

Note: The player he reverse hit is Owen Sillinger, Cole's older brother who is quite a bit smaller at 5'10" 182 lbs listed weight.

Additional note: Yeah, Elmer is making me change my tune. I did not see him becoming this physical, and if he keeps it up, I will be impressed.

 

[ElProfessor]

Kasper has shown some poor net front defense going -2 this game and -1 in Toronto. Meanwhile Copp goes +2 this game and even the previous one, while digging out a puck for an assist.

So you want to promote Kasper who's had some defensive brainfarts while demoting Copp who's basically playing the best he has since he put on a red jersey? I didn't see it, but apparently he threw a check for the first time in 20 games (or maybe they gave him one for pushing Roy off the puck, lol).

Kasper has a better chance of getting sent down to GR along with Motte, especially now that everyone is playing with more intensity. I'd be OK with Raz-Fish-Elmer 4th line latter in the season. I think Elmer needs a few more games kicking AHL ass, while Todd sorts out the players in Detroit.

I don't think I need to tell anyone here that I'm not a Copp fan, but the way he's playing, he deserves a few more games at 2C. 2C Copp, lol, I just said that. Let's see if Todd can make it work.

I disagree with your scouting of hockey.

You can't have Kasper there because both Kane and DeBrincat are bad defensively.

Seider is the only player on the team who plays the game the right way.

Kasper is outstanding defensively.

 

[Gniwder]

I disagree with your scouting of hockey.


Kasper is outstanding defensively.

Yeah, whatever. Plays like this do little to impress a new coach:

Just standing and watching in front of the crease. This was the first Toronto goal and set the tone for the game:

Kampf scores in 500th NHL game | NHL.com

TOR@DET: Kampf kicks off scoring with his first goal of season

www.nhl.com

Ovechkin goal where he coasts:

Ovi sets sights on Gretzky | NHL.com

WSH@DET: Ovechkin notches goal No. 870, now 25 from breaking Gretzky's record

www.nhl.com

Dowd goal where he gets outmuscled:

WSH@DET: Dowd scores goal against Alex Lyon | NHL.com

WSH@DET: Dowd scores goal against Alex Lyon

www.nhl.com

What do you think the new coach is thinking?

 

[ElProfessor]

What do you think the new coach is thinking?

Great clay to mold.

 

[14ari13]

Last night's game:

Elmer Soderblom vs. Joseph LaBate, December 28, 2024 - Grand Rapids Griffins vs. Cleveland Monsters | HockeyFights

HockeyFights - Elmer Soderblom vs. Joseph LaBate, December 28, 2024 - Grand Rapids Griffins vs. Cleveland Monsters

www.hockeyfights.com

LaBate is a Watson level fighter, but that was pretty impressive considering how little experience Elmer has. Plus he didn't even seem concerned about taking the whole line at the same time. Perfect technique and execution in a fight, but I broke that down in a different thread.

Note: The player he reverse hit is Owen Sillinger, Cole's older brother who is quite a bit smaller at 5'10" 182 lbs listed weight.

Additional note: Yeah, Elmer is making me change my tune. I did not see him becoming this physical, and if he keeps it up, I will be impressed.

Thanks. I tried to find it on the internet, but didn't succeed.
It wasn't much of a fight, but it seemed Soderblom landed the lone 2 punches and then outmuscled him. I have no idea who LaBate is.
This team could definitely use a power forward.


We finally won the special units battle. Even with the Leafs 1 for 3 both teams, and we won vs the Caps 1 for 4 vs 0 for 3. This is impressive for this team.

Larkin has not scored in 15. Correct?

I don't think we are bad as we were vs the Leafs and not as good as we were vs the Caps, but a good example of not having and having puck luck.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Yeah, whatever. Plays like this do little to impress a new coach:

Just standing and watching in front of the crease. This was the first Toronto goal and set the tone for the game:

Kampf scores in 500th NHL game | NHL.com

TOR@DET: Kampf kicks off scoring with his first goal of season

www.nhl.com

Ovechkin goal where he coasts:

Ovi sets sights on Gretzky | NHL.com

WSH@DET: Ovechkin notches goal No. 870, now 25 from breaking Gretzky's record

www.nhl.com

Dowd goal where he gets outmuscled:

WSH@DET: Dowd scores goal against Alex Lyon | NHL.com

WSH@DET: Dowd scores goal against Alex Lyon

www.nhl.com

What do you think the new coach is thinking?

New coach likely understands that 20 year old rookie won’t be greatest defensive player of all time. Your cherrypicked examples aren’t even bad plays. He’s in the right position on all 3, losing 50/50 battles at the net front happens (again, especially for a 20 year old rookie).

 

[Pavels Dog]

I'm an austrian fellow and I'd much rather see Kasper playing 1C down in AHL than center the 4th line in the NHL.

I also think that even the points are not there, Kasper has shown that he is more than capable playing at NHL level. If u don't give him a chance playing with better wingers for the Wings, send him down to AHL.

I've followed Kaspers entire carreer and it's kinda strange to see what player he's become. He started out as pure playmaker when he was 13-14, they started to use him as "crash-the-net" hard nosed powerforward as soon as he's arrived professional men hockey.

Those natural playmaking skills are still there, but they won't flourish at NHL level on a 4th line. He's got a long taste of NHL now, let him become a PPG-Player in the AHL. He will become a serviceable top9 forward for the Wings for years to come. Except they do something stupid and trade him away.

He had multiple great set ups the last few games. Including one that would have been Wings GOTY contender if Ras scored.

We need our young players to adapt to the NHL. It’s impossible for them all to be inserted into the top 6, that literally means we will never bring up anyone. Marco is doing well in the role he has. I would only send him down if we’re calling up 2+ of Elmer/Nate/Mazur/Lombardi from GR and want some rotation on these kids.

 

[cvaicunas]

People seem to have an issue differentiating between "needing more development" and "having no potential".

He probably would have been sent down already if the team had someone better than Fish and Motte. If Elmer wins a couple more fights against established fighters, he'll be worth calling up. He absolutely manhandled LaBate who isn't a top tier fighter, but the guy has been in quite a few.

You certainly caught some flak earlier in the season when you stated your desire to see Kasper remain in the AHL. Admittedly most of us were probably showing our excitement in watching a kid jump to the NHL. I think at this stage you've been proven right. We all want him to become more Kesler than Helm, and it's not impossible for him to grow in the NHL, but it certainly would be easier in the AHL.

 

[norrisnick]

You certainly caught some flak earlier in the season when you stated your desire to see Kasper remain in the AHL. Admittedly most of us were probably showing our excitement in watching a kid jump to the NHL. I think at this stage you've been proven right. We all want him to become more Kesler than Helm, and it's not impossible for him to grow in the NHL, but it certainly would be easier in the AHL.

I mean... it's not as if Kasper isn't getting involved in scoring chances. All the AHL would do is reinforce "how to beat an AHL defense/goalie". That's not going to help him at the NHL level. You see similar things in other sports. Take baseball. Facing AAA pitching does not prepare you adequately for MLB pitching. At some point you have to face the best to learn and adjust to it.

 

[LongTimeDRWF]

You certainly caught some flak earlier in the season when you stated your desire to see Kasper remain in the AHL. Admittedly most of us were probably showing our excitement in watching a kid jump to the NHL. I think at this stage you've been proven right. We all want him to become more Kesler than Helm, and it's not impossible for him to grow in the NHL, but it certainly would be easier in the AHL.

It is a hard choice. Kasper started out last year in GR slowly (even allowing for his knee recovery) and then adjusted quite well to the new league by the end of the season.

Watching him play, I am at a coin toss to give him some more runway to adjust to the NHL with some better line mates or return to AHL to tune up his offense a little more, he is not out of place, but I think there is a lot more to his game that needs to be polished.

I would suggest he gets a real stint on a higher line, with either Larks/Ray as a winger or centering Kane/DCat for 10-15 games and then maybe swap him out for Elmer at the 4 Nations break if looks like the AHL may be better for development, another month with the wings will not change his floor. (Keep in mind, while at GR he will impact development ice time of other centers like Nat)

He did have some lapses last game that led to 2 GA, but let's see what the coach thinks, after all, he did have a few pretty good kids develop in his Edmonton days too.

 

[LongTimeDRWF]

I mean... it's not as if Kasper isn't getting involved in scoring chances. All the AHL would do is reinforce "how to beat an AHL defense/goalie". That's not going to help him at the NHL level. You see similar things in other sports. Take baseball. Facing AAA pitching does not prepare you adequately for MLB pitching. At some point you have to face the best to learn and adjust to it.

I agree, an AHL stint may build confidence if that is what he is lacking, if it is shot placement and play choices, then on-ice practice with the wings will better for him. Coach's call.

 

[cvaicunas]

It is a hard choice. Kasper started out last year in GR slowly (even allowing for his knee recovery) and then adjusted quite well to the new league by the end of the season.

Watching him play, I am at a coin toss to give him some more runway to adjust to the NHL with some better line mates or return to AHL to tune up his offense a little more, he is not out of place, but I think there is a lot more to his game that needs to be polished.

I would suggest he gets a real stint on a higher line, with either Larks/Ray as a winger or centering Kane/DCat for 10-15 games and then maybe swap him out for Elmer at the 4 Nations break if looks like the AHL may be better for development, another month with the wings will not change his floor. (Keep in mind, while at GR he will impact development ice time of other centers like Nat)

He did have some lapses last game that led to 2 GA, but let's see what the coach thinks, after all, he did have a few pretty good kids develop in his Edmonton days too.

I certainly don't pretend to know what the best decision is for Kasper. I would still like to see Kasper get an opportunity to play with Raymond, or even shift him to Larkin's wing for a stint as well.

 

[SirloinUB]

Man, that game last night was a real breath of fresh air. Obviously the first period was a lot of fun. I liked what I saw in the 3rd period as well. Less of a shell and more "stick to the game plan" which I loved to see.

As for Kasper, that kid has loads of potential. his ability to transport the puck might only be matched by Larkin, Ed, Ray and maybe Kane. Would an AHL stint be good for him? Maybe, but I dont think its necessary either. He is performing at this level.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInDetroit]

i think the best thing for kasper, and for the team, would be to allow veleno to build trade value on the first line until the tdl. then let kasper get a look there for the rest of the year to really see what kind of offensive potential he has

also, compher sucks at faceoffs. 3 for 15 last night? center depth chart should reflect face-off ability, larkin - copp - kasper - compher

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

He had multiple great set ups the last few games. Including one that would have been Wings GOTY contender if Ras scored.

We need our young players to adapt to the NHL. It’s impossible for them all to be inserted into the top 6, that literally means we will never bring up anyone. Marco is doing well in the role he has. I would only send him down if we’re calling up 2+ of Elmer/Nate/Mazur/Lombardi from GR and want some rotation on these kids.

That high lob pass by Kasper was pretty great. Sadly, it was Ras on the receiving end of a breakaway.

 

[stillwater]

All this talk about Kasper. It's folly to only blame his linemates for his lack of production. He's still very young. That has more to do with it than anything else. It will come, be patient a little.

For me, obviously he's not really clicking on offense just yet. There are signs of it, but he's still developing. But, he needs to stay in Detroit and not go back to GR. He also needs set linemates. Berggren is a good start, they're good together and can grow together and Tarasenko has only ever played well this year with those 2. But, I'd like to see Tarasenko waived and gone, with Watson or preferably Danielson coming up to round out that line.

Kasper - Danielson - Berggren

Want to see Kasper play with more grit as well. In the SHL he was a chippy SOB who was really a pain in the ass to play against. Haven't seen much of that here yet. Not expecting him to fight, but I want to see that physical game in him once again.

 

[Gniwder]

Thanks. I tried to find it on the internet, but didn't succeed.
It wasn't much of a fight, but it seemed Soderblom landed the lone 2 punches and then outmuscled him. I have no idea who LaBate is.
This team could definitely use a power forward.

Look at LaBates fight log, he's got quite a few in the NHL and AHL. He's their Watson.

To me, that is a perfect fight, let the other guy drop the gloves first, so no instigator, then land a few punches and take him down to the ice. I don't want to see an extended fight where both players wind up injured, make your point quickly but make it hurt a little.

I'm really critical, and I think that whole sequence was perfectly played from the puck drop to finish. If he can do that on a consistent basis, there's definitely a spot in the NHL for him somewhere.

New coach likely understands that 20 year old rookie won’t be greatest defensive player of all time. Your cherrypicked examples aren’t even bad plays. He’s in the right position on all 3, losing 50/50 battles at the net front happens (again, especially for a 20 year old rookie).

Cherrypick, lol. That is what Todd is watching. Kasper allowed the first goal in both of his first 2 games that Todd coached, and the only 2 goals the Caps scored.

The Ovie goal was bad, and if he loses enough 50/50 battles, he'll be in GR.

I mean... it's not as if Kasper isn't getting involved in scoring chances. All the AHL would do is reinforce "how to beat an AHL defense/goalie". That's not going to help him at the NHL level. You see similar things in other sports. Take baseball. Facing AAA pitching does not prepare you adequately for MLB pitching. At some point you have to face the best to learn and adjust to it.

You're the type of person that would teach a friend how to ski by sending him down a black diamond run, lol. He's only got 15 AHL goals, it's not like he's even close to mastering scoring at the AHL level, and it shows. Development is a progression, and he never completed his last learning step. The only reason why he's on the roster is because Stevie picked up a bunch of loser UFAs.

What you're saying applies to Burger who has 49 goals in 130 AHL games. I don't think he'll learn anything by getting sent down (and he'd have to go through waivers). Burger needs to figure out the NHL because he's already figured out the AHL. Kasper hasn't. Both Nate and Lombardi are outpacing Kasper's AHL production.

 

[Hobnobs]

Veleno - LArkin seemed to have chemistry. Now if one them could actually score it could be a good line with Raymond.

 

[Oddbob]

We looked so much better getting the puck out of our zone in this one. Only complaint was we played a little scared in the 3rd and kind of stopped attacking. Even Gus looked decent in this one and I don't think I have thought that at all this year.

If it's Mazur that gets called up, then Mazur-Kasper-Burger makes sense, but if it's Elmer, Todd will probably run Raz-Fish-Elmer. That's a heavy line.

Mazur won't be getting called up anytime soon in my opinion. He has been out for awhile now and is still out til at least mid January. Can't see Steve calling up a just returned injured youngster who has never played in the NHL.

 

[Oddbob]

He's been consistent in his assessment that Kasper needed more time in GR. Can't fault him for his opinion. I think between his current usage, and defensive play of late, he should go down as well.

I will say, if they aren't going to play him on the top 2 scoring lines, I would rather he be in GR learning more offence, than just being turned into another grinder which seems to be what they are doing right now.

 

[Oddbob]

Not sure if Larkin is hurt, but he just seems "off" for quite awhile now, even last night.