Post-Game Talk: Game #21: Sharks 2, Canucks 1 in OT - At least we don't play tham again this season

[Rotting Corpse*]

Gillis... terrible terrible terrible terrible.

I actually dry heaved when I read that.

4.85M through 2017-2018. David Booth suddenly looking pretty good.

 

[Rotting Corpse*]

Thanks for the review. Your breakdowns are always concise, on point and fair. Always the first thing I look for (along with orcatown) in a post game thread of a game I missed.

You can say whatever you want, whenever you want (well, the mods will disagree with that) however not everyone is going to agree with you. When "fans" start going off about how we need to trade the Sedins and Luongo is old and washed up there will be Chicken Little accusations. Let's not pretend like all this reactionary commentary is warranted.

Then let's not pretend like those people actually exist.

 

[Rotting Corpse*]

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=690428

There it is. Notice how in 2011, we did not even qualify for a playoff spot by November 8th? Funny, we won our second President's Trophy that season.

If this were 50-60 games in? Sure, there may be some merit to worry, but 21? We have done this song and dance before. We will be fine down the stretch.

See, in statistics, this is referred to as "cherry picking."

I would be very interested to know (no BS) how often a team similar to ours, in our position, wins the president's trophy, or what their average finish is. If anyone has this study, please send it to me. Maybe I'll ask pitseleh.

 

[StringerBell]

Then let's not pretend like those people actually exist.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1538921

 

[Rotting Corpse*]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1538921

So you link to a different thread. On a different board. A thread where one guy posts something and is immediately piled on by an angry mob.

I'm going to bed.

 

[Canucks LB]

We have another buyout window next year, booth will get bought out, why the panic?

 

[MS]

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier in this thread, but Botchford put out an article post game saying that the Canucks offered their first round pick for Ryan Clowe at the deadline last year.

Talk about getting lucky and dodging a bullet.

Hmmm ... not sure I believe that.

San Jose ended up getting the #50 or so pick out of that deal ... I know they would have preferred to trade Clowe out of conference, but there's no way you turn down a #1 pick to take a late #2.

 

[Canuck16]

The problem is, we HAVE played our best hockey and mostly every night we have work ethic, and we are STILL 10th (once Dallas catches up games in hand) in the west. Talent wise, we dont have enough. Torts doing the et w what he has, Gillis really botched this one

Wow.. you sound worried (and pathetic). Its a long season and no we haven't played our best. Our PP is not potent. It will get there. The Canucks are at their best when we have both special teams going and right now we're 1 for 2 in that department. Henrik and Daniel are superstars in this league (im not living in the past). We have a solid D core and Luongo is a world class goalie who can win on any given night with tons of experience. Torts is a hungry, hard coach and he will motivate this team. He won't settle with 59 minute efforts. The Canucks are miles ahead of many teams. You won't get what you want.. Henrik and Daniel will be Canucks for life or at least 4 more years.

The Canucks are a very good 2nd half team (typically from Jan to March)... You think the Avs are gonna maintain a spot all year.. Teams are ready for them now. They got futile D despite their lowest GA in the league. Its a complete anomaly. They worked hard, they work hard but their Patrick Roy honeymoon is coming to an end. 20 games into a season is just that.. 25%. Lots of change will take place..


Burrows will start producing. Hansen will give us depth but we need guys like Kassian to step up.. Didnt see him in the 3rd? was he playing? Luongo was a minute away from the lead league in shutouts. This is a good team and things will click. 99% not worried about this team.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Daniel had 104 points and won the Art Ross in 2011. He's pace to finish in the top forty for points. Henrik has continued his scoring pace but Daniel has taken a big hit.

Well, obviously this isn't 2011 anymore.

 

[canuck4life16]

hopefully they fix the PP soon than later......we need the PP to click please

 

[BrandonL]

Hmmm ... not sure I believe that.

San Jose ended up getting the #50 or so pick out of that deal ... I know they would have preferred to trade Clowe out of conference, but there's no way you turn down a #1 pick to take a late #2.

If I remember the situation correctly, I believe that Clowe had some sort of restricted movement clause in his contract that allowed him to pick the Rangers over the Canucks.

Not a hundred percent sure though?

 

[Superpest]

Well, obviously this isn't 2011 anymore.

I'm gonna need proof otherwise its just he said she said at this point.

 

[vanuck]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1538921

Just an embarrassment of a thread.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

See, in statistics, this is referred to as "cherry picking."

I would be very interested to know (no BS) how often a team similar to ours, in our position, wins the president's trophy, or what their average finish is. If anyone has this study, please send it to me. Maybe I'll ask pitseleh.

Not when the year prior, our best season in franchise history only had us in fourth, with Anaheim and Chicago nipping at our heels. We managed to run away with the Western conference. It was not intended as a definitive, but merely a demonstration that a slow start does not mean the season in finished. We have been adjusting to a new season, have had a plethora of injuries and two suspensions.

Regardless, I would take cherry picked stats verse pessimistic assumptions we're going to miss the playoffs due to our play in November.

 

[SgtToody]

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=690428

There it is. Notice how in 2011, we did not even qualify for a playoff spot by November 8th? Funny, we won our second President's Trophy that season.

If this were 50-60 games in? Sure, there may be some merit to worry, but 21? We have done this song and dance before. We will be fine down the stretch.

Problem is, we don't have weak Calgary, Edmonton , Minnesota and Colorado to feast on anymore. Yes, Calgary and Edmonton still are a shambles, but now our division has the California monsters, teams we haven't played .500 with in a long long time. Are the playoffs possible? Could the team continue to pleasantly surprise? Maybe, but regression, exhaustion, underwhelming offence (how I'd love to have a.500 chance of winning a shoot out with this popgun attack!) are just as likely going to weigh us down.

 

[Derp Kassian]

Was that penalty a make up for the Buffalo no goal in OT for SJ back a few games? What a joke.

Team needs a shakeup badly and Burrows has been Baaaad, cant wait til honey badger comes back.

 

[mossey3535]

^ Agreed.

Thanks for this. I remember you've mentioned in the past that his skating has always been a weakness of his, but when can we expect him to be able to do so though? You have to think opponents would be looking to exploit this on east-west plays.

He currently has three ways to play that situation, but he picked the wrong one. He is strong enough to get over had he made a wiser save selection that would allow him to push off using his skate.

Lu being exploited on east-west plays has actually gradually decreased since Melanson arrived. I don't anticipate it being a major problem going forward for two reasons:

1. He is more likely to slide across with square pads now. Before he would kicksave.

2. Collapsing defence a la Torts makes it much harder to cut across the ice below the hash marks compared to the contain defence we used under AV.

The two Chicago series we got killed in prior to slaying the dragon, Chicago was constantly just walking across the goal mouth to exploit this weakness. That we don't see it as much now speaks to Lu's improvement laterally as well as the team starting to anticipate that play.

Having said that, even the most technically sound goalie is susceptible to a player being allowed to move laterally for long distances. That's how one-timers work after all.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

I'm gonna need proof otherwise its just he said she said at this point.

You might be my favourite, Mama S.

 

[Bougieman]

I've watched the replay on the OT goal about 10 times now, and the more I watch it, the more I can't figure out what Lou was thinking there. I'm often the first one to defend him (usually because people have piled on for no good reason many times in the past), but that goal really stuck in my craw. That it came after such a solid game from him was equally frustrating.

It almost seems like he loses sight of the puck or something, because his reaction to a cross ice pass isn't just "slow lateral movement" as many are saying.. it's just utter confusion. It's like he stutter-steps and falls, because he doesn't know where it is. Then he's laying there flailing with his glove when he realizes that he's totally out of the play, and hoping the Shark will miss the wide open net. Ugh... it's so ugly.

I dunno. It's just a really frustrating goal, man. The whole end to that game was just gross. Put me in a sour mood for a good hour, and I'm not usually one to let non-playoff hockey get me down.

 

[ChilliBilly]

Pissed off that I wasn't able to watch this game. Comments are interesting. There are a number of posters who basically are trying to find things to ***** about in what was apparently a very good game by the Canucks. Outchanced the opponents but didn't finish. Unlucky goal against and a ******** call in OT. Yet a ton of chicken little comments.

And we would be tied with Boston (yes games in hand I know) for 2nd if we were in the E.

 

[vanuck]

He currently has three ways to play that situation, but he picked the wrong one. He is strong enough to get over had he made a wiser save selection that would allow him to push off using his skate.

Lu being exploited on east-west plays has actually gradually decreased since Melanson arrived. I don't anticipate it being a major problem going forward for two reasons:

1. He is more likely to slide across with square pads now. Before he would kicksave.

2. Collapsing defence a la Torts makes it much harder to cut across the ice below the hash marks compared to the contain defence we used under AV.

The two Chicago series we got killed in prior to slaying the dragon, Chicago was constantly just walking across the goal mouth to exploit this weakness. That we don't see it as much now speaks to Lu's improvement laterally as well as the team starting to anticipate that play.

Having said that, even the most technically sound goalie is susceptible to a player being allowed to move laterally for long distances. That's how one-timers work after all.

I see. Appreciate the responses mossey. I just wonder what made him finally move away from the Clark/Allaire school of thought in his offseason training and commit fully to what Melanson is teaching. And whether he'll be prone to going back, I guess.

Kind of mind-boggling to think that, as good as he has been throughout his career, some better-suited instruction might have made him even better as a goalie.

 

[Grumbler]

Wow Luongo... we're not winning anything with this kind of goaltending in the playoffs.

 

[John Belushi]

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier in this thread, but Botchford put out an article post game saying that the Canucks offered their first round pick for Ryan Clowe at the deadline last year.

Talk about getting lucky and dodging a bullet.

Botchford doesn't have sources. He's just praying no one calls him on his bullsh*t. Worst 'journalist' in Vancouver.

 

[tantalum]

Problem is, we don't have weak Calgary, Edmonton , Minnesota and Colorado to feast on anymore. Yes, Calgary and Edmonton still are a shambles, but now our division has the California monsters, teams we haven't played .500 with in a long long time. Are the playoffs possible? Could the team continue to pleasantly surprise? Maybe, but regression, exhaustion, underwhelming offence (how I'd love to have a.500 chance of winning a shoot out with this popgun attack!) are just as likely going to weigh us down.

For every game against weak divisional opponents that was taken away, a game against weak Eastern teams was added. It all ends up balancing out really.


Anyways on the penalty. Those saying it was the correct call I guess could be technically correct. It was a bit of a hook. However, they are wrong because IF they want to call a light one handed hook in that situation where is that call almost each and every shift? Far worse infractions taking away scoring chances happened all night but that one gets called? Terrible officiating on that one. How terrible? The San Jose crew who is one of the most biased crews around called it a great back check and weak call (seriously they scream for too many men any time a puck goes near a bench on a change...doesn't matter if no one touches it)

But as I also said the canucks allowed them to stay in it which is also a problem. As was the terrible save attempt from Luongo.

HOWEVER, compared to the first week of the season you can see how much more prepared this team is to play the California teams. Far better efforts (well maybe not against LA) and if those efforts continue they will take 3 out of every 4 points against those teams just as they did against San Jose the last week. A little more finish would of course be nice and needed but the system works and works well. 60 games to go. They are essentially a head to head win away from passing such teams. Expectations of missed playoffs and selling off the core to tank are ridiculous.

 

[Orca Smash]

See, in statistics, this is referred to as "cherry picking."

I would be very interested to know (no BS) how often a team similar to ours, in our position, wins the president's trophy, or what their average finish is. If anyone has this study, please send it to me. Maybe I'll ask pitseleh.

I dont think his point was were going to win the president trophy again (I hope anyway) i think his point was there is still plenty of time to make playoffs and have a good season.