Post-Game Talk: Game #2 Pens vs Wings: Much better game

[Big Friggin Dummy]

It's not really the fact that Jarry, the "starter" for this team, is making a bit under $5.5M AAV. It's that he sucks, he's volatile as hell, he routinely craters in the final 3-4 months of the season, he has injury issues, and he's an unlikable whiner.

Paying your starter what the Pens are paying Jarry is fine. Jarry's just a mess. /shrug

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

You do. You have to pay. Ya goalies are Vodoo sure whatever but you still pay them especially the good ones. Fleury was bad for a bunch of years sure but he was exactly what they needed for the cups when they needed him. He was highly paid during that time too.

Not all teams are Vegas, Chicago and Colorado. Tampa, and the Kings, Florida go nowhere without there goalies.

Eh... 5-6M for a starter is about right IMO. It's just a difference in team building opinions though I tend to think results are MOSTLY on my side over the last 20ish years. It's just not really a goaltending league anymore IMO. But I'm not hardline enough about it that if say Mush turned out to be the next Vasi I would be upset if the Penguins paid him his 8M or whatever.

I just can't help but cringe a little bit when I think about a goaltender making like 8-11M and possibly (probably?) getting mixed results when you could pay a franchise forward that and get more or less consistent results for many years barring major injury. Paying out for goaltending puts a cramp on your cap situation but with that evidently going up a bunch soon... perhaps a bit less relevant of an argument.

 

[SEALBound]

Wish they would have kept Math

If they kept Matheson, they likely don't make the Karlsson trade. Imagine having Matheson on the 2nd pairing but then adding an additional $5+mil somewhere else. It would have put a high-quality wing (or center) in the conversation either of the past two seasons. Shame.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

If they kept Matheson, they likely don't make the Karlsson trade. Imagine having Matheson on the 2nd pairing but then adding an additional $5+mil somewhere else. It would have put a high-quality wing (or center) in the conversation either of the past two seasons. Shame.

That was largely my thought process as well, yeah.

Dunno if the team would have done that, though. They'd probably find yet another middle six wing to overpay with that money for way-too-many years.

 

[Shrimper]

I assume Youtube is the best place to get highlights still these days?

 

[BillyOcean]

James Patterson frequency of novels defending Fleur...Jarry ... From the same culprits in this thread

 

[TooManyHumans]

I hung in with Jarry for as long as I could and longer than a lot of people. He is what he is at this point, and it is not someone you can rely on and not someone the team in front of him seems to believe in. I wish we could dump him but I fear we are stuck with him since every other team gets to see him play.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I love bitching about the alcoholic perverts I obsessively post with.

 

[SEALBound]

I love bitching about the alcoholic perverts I obsessively post with.

And how many of those accounts are actually you?

 

[Pens x]

The Yzerplan suckkkkks

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The Yzerplan suckkkkks

Indeed. I particularly enjoyed watching 38 year old Malkin turnstile the entire Yzerplan coast-to-coast.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Yeah, as good as Yzerman's time with the Bolts was (and how much of it was up to scouts/drafting/development?), this Wings tenure has been El Stinko Grande.

 

[eXile3]

I assume Youtube is the best place to get highlights still these days?

NHL.com has them.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Ironic that Beauvillier looked better on his strong side. Or well, ironic to a dumb f*** like Sullivan.

 

[Gurglesons]

That was largely my thought process as well, yeah.

Dunno if the team would have done that, though. They'd probably find yet another middle six wing to overpay with that money for way-too-many years.

The issue is Mike Matheson is one of the dumbest players we've ever seen play hockey.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The issue is Mike Matheson is one of the dumbest players we've ever seen play hockey.

They're current employing Graves so that crown has already been stolen.

At least Math was entertaining.

 

[Gurglesons]

They're current employing Graves so that crown has already been stolen.

At least Math was entertaining.

Eh. Matheson trade was a good deal IMO. Imagine this team with Ryan Poehling still here.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I am imagining.

We would still have a guy on the team with the handle "LilUziPoehls" and that's not nothing.

 

[Turin]

Eh. Matheson trade was a good deal IMO. Imagine this team with Ryan Poehling still here.

Anything to give Hextall his flowers

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Eh... 5-6M for a starter is about right IMO. It's just a difference in team building opinions though I tend to think results are MOSTLY on my side over the last 20ish years. It's just not really a goaltending league anymore IMO. But I'm not hardline enough about it that if say Mush turned out to be the next Vasi I would be upset if the Penguins paid him his 8M or whatever.

I just can't help but cringe a little bit when I think about a goaltender making like 8-11M and possibly (probably?) getting mixed results when you could pay a franchise forward that and get more or less consistent results for many years barring major injury. Paying out for goaltending puts a cramp on your cap situation but with that evidently going up a bunch soon... perhaps a bit less relevant of an argument.

My issue isn't allocating that much cap space to a starting goalie, it's allocating that much to a starting goalie who has never proven he can come up big when it matters.

Why this club thought extending them for as long as they did still boggles my mind. Because not only did they give a decently high cap hit to a choke artist, they also doubled down by giving him term, too.

"Hey Tristan, not only are we signing you to suck for our club, we're signing you to suck for half a decade!"

That signing is the second worst decision this club has made in the past handful of years. The first being the obvious keeping deputy dipshit behind the bench.

 

[Gurglesons]

Anything to give Hextall his flowers

watch Matheson with the Habs and tell me you want him back.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I expect him to make 5 saves without a goal to start a game. He’s paid 5.75 million.

Making a difficult save isn’t impossible. If goalies got scored on no matter what, the league would be very different.

It's 5.375 and that's top cap for a goaltender of like a decade or more ago.

Fleury got 5.750 in 2015/16. These days they are getting 7.0 and more... lots more. He's paid to be average. Though I'd like for him to make those first 5 saves, this team is not the kind to not let up bad chances defensively on a regular basis.

And to top it off, he didn't let up a soft goal in the opening period vs. the NYR's. So the initial 1st goal was a tip in nothing he can do with both Letang and Carrick cutting in front of him. The only goal anyone can even remotely gasp at is #2 and I think Lafs did a heck of a curl and drag around a sliding Petts.

Expectations might be a little too grand considering the team he plays for.

 

[OtherThingsILike]

The biggest difference between the Detroit game and Rangers game was Blom vs Jarry.

The biggest difference between the Detroit game and Rangers game was that the team allowed 40 shots from a team with only three powerplays (Rangers) and allowed 31 shots from a team with 5 powerplays (Detroit.)

Unfortunately, Jarry has played himself into an area that will be VERY difficult to get out of. I posted about this a couple days ago. It doesn't matter if the game is 1-1 and you're posting a .975 sv%, if you let in the soft goal late in the third and the team losing 2-1, no one gives a shit about the awesome stats. If you're battling in a 6-6 game and running a 0.825 sv% but you make the key save late in the third and the team wins 7-6, no one gives a shit about the crappy stats.

This is actually a much better and significant insight than 'one goalie bad, one goalie good.'

The fact of the matter is, every game, any given team will put 30+ shots on our goalie.

Why is this a fact of the matter? Half the league allowed fewer than 30 shots against on average, last season.

 

[Darren McCord]

Eh. Matheson trade was a good deal IMO. Imagine this team with Ryan Poehling still here

I have no idea why you are so keen on Poehling. He will be 26 and has had one healthy year where he put up 11g and 28 pts.

Dude is whatever and not worth crying over. Probably has a couple years left in the league as a bottom 6 player. Lizotte will be just as effective when healthy.

 

[Pancakes]

In fairness to Yzerman, the Wings have had horrible luck in the draft lottery. This is why I caution those Pens fans who want to leap headlong into the tank because you can get stuck in that for a while if the lottery balls don't bounce your way.

Them and Buffalo are great examples of how tanking isn't guaranteed to lead to success.