GDT: Free agency part III-toed sloth slow

[MadeUpName]

With Burns, Pacioretty and Stastny brought in I could see Carolina being more aggressive at the deadline on a rental. Things would have to "feel" right though.

Most teams that pay 1sts+ for rentals end up regretting it shortly after. Florida isn't picking in the first round until 2026 and all they got for Giroux + Chiarot was a 2nd round sweep.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

exactly but it still more likely than miller

I disagree. I could totally see the Canes going all in on Miller at the deadline as a pure rental. Kotkaniemi is our 2C of the future, but as a one-time Stanley Cup ploy, a 1-2 punch of Aho and Miller would be nuts.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I disagree. I could totally see the Canes going all in on Miller at the deadline as a pure rental. Kotkaniemi is our 2C of the future, but as a one-time Stanley Cup ploy, a 1-2 punch of Aho and Miller would be nuts.

we are talking different acquisitions cost then. We were talking about acquiring MIller now as a rental. At the deadline is a lower acquisition cost with a decent known range of our first round pick.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

With Burns, Pacioretty and Stastny brought in I could see Carolina being more aggressive at the deadline on a rental. Things would have to "feel" right though.

Most teams that pay 1sts+ for rentals end up regretting it shortly after. Florida isn't picking in the first round until 2026 and all they got for Giroux + Chiarot was a 2nd round sweep.

I don't think that Florida regrets it as much as you think. Florida has a narrower contention window than the Canes do because their prior management wasted so much of Huberdeau and Barkov's RFA value seasons. The Zito team managed to recoup some of it with the Tkachuk trade, but it's still a harder slog for them in the medium-term because of that prior mismanagement.

 

[Svechhammer]

We'd only be trading for Miller with an extension, so I'd be okay giving up a good player in that scenario. But given the cap gymnastics required, I don't think there's a chance in hell he winds up in Raleigh.

I mean we almost got Tkachuk until Florida panicked, so it would very much be part of our MO to pull off this kind of trade, even if it means an extension is coming.

I do think that we would need to shed a roster player to make it work, and who knows who that would be, but it would be hard to argue we wouldn't be incredibly stacked for a while if we did.

I don't think that Florida regrets it as much as you think. Florida has a narrower contention window than the Canes do because their prior management wasted so much of Huberdeau and Barkov's RFA value seasons. The Zito team managed to recoup some of it with the Tkachuk trade, but it's still a harder slog for them in the medium-term because of that prior mismanagement.

Florida's pipeline has basically run dry, they are hard up against the Cap and they have a dearth of quality draft picks for the next few years. Their contention window is right now, but don't have many assets available to improve upon their situation if they need a deadline add. And if their team doesn't gel, they're pretty much boned in being able to fix it without getting incredibly creative through trades.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Florida's pipeline has basically run dry, they are hard up against the Cap and they have a dearth of quality draft picks for the next few years. Their contention window is right now, but don't have many assets available to improve upon their situation if they need a deadline add. And if their team doesn't gel, they're pretty much boned in being able to fix it without getting incredibly creative through trades.

Florida had a similar issue back when the new management came in. They got out of that hole because they invested in really smart, low-dollar UFA bets, often from the non-tender/non-QO crop. It would not shock me if Florida's management team keeps finding more pieces in that way.

 

[WreckingCrew]

I mean we almost got Tkachuk until Florida panicked, so it would very much be part of our MO to pull off this kind of trade, even if it means an extension is coming.

I do think that we would need to shed a roster player to make it work, and who knows who that would be, but it would be hard to argue we wouldn't be incredibly stacked for a while if we did.


Florida's pipeline has basically run dry, they are hard up against the Cap and they have a dearth of quality draft picks for the next few years. Their contention window is right now, but don't have many assets available to improve upon their situation if they need a deadline add. And if their team doesn't gel, they're pretty much boned in being able to fix it without getting incredibly creative through trades.

Just when the Checkers were finally good (championship + Canes solid drafting), rich man pissing contest leads to affiliation change and now what looks to be a long, bleak, dark future

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

the Florida teams’, yes plural, longevity of competitiveness will be dependent on how quickly the cap goes up. Florida has the Bob monstrosity to limit their depth in the future and TB has recent head scratcher contracts that will cause depth issues.

Our window is completely dependent on Aho and to a smaller degree Pesce re-signing. We presumably have the farm to maintain longer success even with a minimally growing cap. Although a quicker hitting cap growth would be nice for us too.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

the Florida teams’, yes plural, longevity of competitiveness will be dependent on how quickly the cap goes up. Florida has the Bob monstrosity to limit their depth in the future and TB has recent head scratcher contracts that will cause depth issues.

Our window is completely dependent on Aho and to a smaller degree Pesce re-signing. We presumably have the farm to maintain longer success even with a minimally growing cap. Although a quicker hitting cap growth would be nice for us too.

I disagree about Pesce. Aho and Slavin are the main priorities and Skjei/Turbo/Pesce is more secondary. Canes have invested significant draft capital at RW (Gunler/Koivunen/Trikozov) and RHD (Honka/Morrow/Heimosalmi), and have Nikishin on the way, as well. Fensore is a long shot but has a rather high ceiling, too, as a Grzylcyk type, and could well be an option to replace Skjei if Nikishin doesn't come over in 2-3 years. Slavin and Aho are the only two truly irreplaceable pending UFAs in our entire organization.

 

[Svechhammer]

I disagree about Pesce. Aho and Slavin are the main priorities and Skjei/Turbo/Pesce is more secondary. Canes have invested significant draft capital at RW (Gunler/Koivunen/Trikozov) and RHD (Honka/Morrow/Heimosalmi), and have Nikishin on the way, as well. Fensore is a long shot but has a rather high ceiling, too, as a Grzylcyk type, and could well be an option to replace Skjei if Nikishin doesn't come over in 2-3 years. Slavin and Aho are the only two truly irreplaceable pending UFAs in our entire organization.

Right now I would think the only truly untouchable players in our entire system are Aho, Svech, Slavin, Jarvis, and Kochetkov with a decent chance that Morrow and possibly Nikishin could be in that mix.

Literally everyone else is probably someone who could be included in a deal where we're looking to upgrade the roster. Those others are either players that we'd be selling way too low on (Jarvis, Kochetkov, Morrow, Nikishin) and there is no way we'd get equity without dumb luck, or they're players that its incredibly unlikely we'd be able to get someone back who is a big enough upgrade to make it worth it without us needing to significantly add to it (Svech, Aho, Slavin).

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

I'm very hesitant to call more than 10 goalies in the league untouchable, let alone our 3rd string from the last 2 years.

We are a year removed from having traded our Calder finalist for a 3rd round pick and probably still feel pretty darn good about it.

 

[Chrispy]

I'm very hesitant to call more than 10 goalies in the league untouchable, let alone our 3rd string from the last 2 years.

We are a year removed from having traded our Calder finalist for a 3rd round pick and probably still feel pretty darn good about it.

Agreed. I wouldn't put Kochetkov in the "untouchable" category, but I think putting him in a "worth more than the return a typical goalie prospect with a small NHL sample size would get" is reasonable.

Back to your point: Ned only got a 3rd after a longer track record at the AHL and NHL level. No one wants to give up on Kochetkov for a 3rd right now.

 

[MinJaBen]

It’s hard to believe we’re getting Miller without giving up at least one piece that hits a tender spot. There are other suitors, and they have to be offering something of value.

Really? Where?

 

[NotOpie]

That's not how you play darts, dude!

Unless you're like a gnome thief in d&d or something.

Maybe not.....but this is how you play darts.

 

[Svechhammer]

Agreed. I wouldn't put Kochetkov in the "untouchable" category, but I think putting him in a "worth more than the return a typical goalie prospect with a small NHL sample size would get" is reasonable.

Back to your point: Ned only got a 3rd after a longer track record at the AHL and NHL level. No one wants to give up on Kochetkov for a 3rd right now.

Exactly. There is no way we could trade Kochetkov right now and get a return that is even remotely worth it for our means. For that reason, he's untouchable.

If there was a way we could trade him for someone like Shesty or Varly, we'd absolutely do it, but that's not possible, so he's basically immovable.

 

[MinJaBen]

Exactly. There is no way we could trade Kochetkov right now and get a return that is even remotely worth it for our means. For that reason, he's untouchable.

You are describing "not being touched" versus the state of not able to be touched, which is what untouchable is.

 

[Tryamw]

You are describing "not being touched" versus the state of not able to be touched, which is what untouchable is.

but can I touch this board? or is it untouchable..
Obviously I can interact with it.. (See this post)

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

You are describing "not being touched" versus the state of not able to be touched, which is what untouchable is.

Yeah that's my thought as well. I understand the point being made about Kochetkov, but when you talk about an untouchables list, you're generally talking about the folks that are so integral to the core of the team that you're not trading them. I think Aho/Svech/Slavin is a perfectly reasonable list.

 

[HisIceness]

Just when the Checkers were finally good (championship + Canes solid drafting), rich man pissing contest leads to affiliation change and now what looks to be a long, bleak, dark future

FWIW, I've "heard" that the Checkers might be going back to the ECHL soon, this from someone I know whose a STH. It isn't confirmed and may not happen but the travel costs and lost revenue from Covid aren't helping. It'd be a lot cheaper to travel to Greenville, Savannah, Atlanta etc than Hershey and Syracuse though.

As for the Florida Panthers, I mean yeah if they win a cup it's absolutely worth giving up futures. In their case, they need to capitalize on their window while fan interest is at a high probably not seen since 1996.

 

[LostInaLostWorld]

You are describing "not being touched" versus the state of not able to be touched, which is what untouchable is.

 

[geehaad]

I never saw much use in being untouchable.
I prefer to be touchable.

 

[DaveG]

FWIW, I've "heard" that the Checkers might be going back to the ECHL soon, this from someone I know whose a STH. It isn't confirmed and may not happen but the travel costs and lost revenue from Covid aren't helping. It'd be a lot cheaper to travel to Greenville, Savannah, Atlanta etc than Hershey and Syracuse though.

As for the Florida Panthers, I mean yeah if they win a cup it's absolutely worth giving up futures. In their case, they need to capitalize on their window while fan interest is at a high probably not seen since 1996.

May want to hold up on Atlanta if some of the other rumors I've heard are true.

 

[AD Skinner]

You are describing "not being touched" versus the state of not able to be touched, which is what untouchable is.

 

[Chrispy]

You are describing "not being touched" versus the state of not able to be touched, which is what untouchable is.

That’s not the use of ”untouchable” I recall from my early teens. “Able” was not the issue.

 

[Svechhammer]

May want to hold up on Atlanta if some of the other rumors I've heard are true.

And what are these rumors