GDT: Four Nations Face-Off

[Dennis Bonvie]

I know they won't, but god damn give me this over the allstar game shit any day of the week.

The highest level of hockey vs. not even hockey?

Yep, this is a lot better.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Schiefele is a right-handed shot and doesn't play the same position. I do expect him to make the team a year from now.

You make it sound like Tavares won't age between now and then. He'll be 35 in September he's about 2 years and 4 months younger than Marchand. His numbers while slightly better it's not like they are light years apart in production. Tavares has 21+24 in 48 games, Marchand has 20+24 in 57. Marchand also doesn't have the the supporting cast around him up front that Tavares does. Then factor in Marchand while older is the superior skater and the tournament is over in Italy so I'm assuming larger ice. Then factor in Marchand can kill penalties, and doesn't need to switch positions (zero chance Tavares is chosen to play C).

Maybe Marchand doesn't make it, We'll see. Tavares on the Olympic team? Zero chance.

Tavares is 2 years younger and that's a difference when Marchand has been steadily regressing and will turn 38 three months after '26 Olympics.

When is the last time Team Canada as iced a non-generational player at Forward
at 37 years old? Come on man, if Canada can't select a better alternative to 37 year old Marchand that will speak volumes negatively on Canadian hockey. Can't imagine they don't take one of Johnston or Bedard over him. Those two are poised to breakout next year and odds are substantial March and continues to decline.

Hagel, Cirelli and Konecny can easily give PK service with more speed than
Marchand. Odds are absolutely against Marchand.

Incidentally those numbers your referencing isn't a slight difference. Tavares has played 9 fewer games. His production is 20% higher.

And how did that turn out, the Leafs stripped him of his captaincy this summer to put another uninspiring type of leader in his place (Mathews).

Tavares has already made a Canadian Olympic Team over Marchand.

 

[BruinDust]

Tavares is 2 years younger and that's a difference when Marchand has been steadily regressing and will turn 38 three months after '26 Olympics.

When is the last time Team Canada as iced a non-generational player at Forward
at 37 years old? Come on man, if Canada can't select a better alternative to 37 year old Marchand that will speak volumes negatively on Canadian hockey. Can't imagine they don't take one of Johnston or Bedard over him. Those two are poised to breakout next year and odds are substantial March and continues to decline.

Hagel, Cirelli and Konecny can easily give PK service with more speed than
Marchand. Odds are absolutely against Marchand.

Incidentally those numbers your referencing isn't a slight difference. Tavares has played 9 fewer games. His production is 20% higher.

And Tavares's hasn't regressed? Give me a break.

I said in my last post that we'll see if Marchand makes it next year. I never said it was a guarantee.

Johnston already has broken out, I thought he had a chance to make it this year but he got off to a slow start. If you want to say there is a chance Bedard or Johnston make it over Marchand, I hear you. Handiness and position will come into play, they aren't taking 11 right-shot forwards.

But quite frankly I find your take on John Tavares to be bizarre.

 

[Oates2Neely]

Tavares was on the 2014 Canadian Olympic Team, picked over Marchand what are you talking about?

Yes and in 2014 Tavares played in 4 of the 6 games and total ZERO points. IIRC he skated RW on their 4th line.

I’d suggest you’re all alone with this take. As someone previously mentioned, maybe Marchand isn’t there next time around but there’s zero chance Tavares is in. Intangibles matter in these short tournaments.

 

[HumBucker]

Glad that Canada won, but I was getting concerned about their OT play. They seemed to be relying on too many individual efforts by players like McDavid and Mackinnon. The Swedes had the better strategy: puck possession and movement as a 3-man unit. The winner came because of Crosby's smart use of his teammates and Marner's great shot.

 

[lopey]

Tavares was the captain for the Islanders for 5 seasons and for the Leafs for 5 more.

Yes also got his captaincy stripped this year

 

[Oates2Neely]

When is the last time Team Canada as iced a non-generational player at Forward
at 37 years old? Come on man, if Canada can't select a better alternative to 37 year old Marchand that will speak volumes negatively on Canadian hockey. Can't imagine they don't take one of Johnston or Bedard over him. Those two are poised to breakout next year and odds are substantial March and continues to decline.

The same 2014 team Canada you keep referencing had a 38 year old Martin St Louis on the roster. I believe a 35 year old Chris Kunitz skated on their 1st line.

 

[Number8]

He is absolutely having a better year than Marchand (ONE POINT =/= ABSOLUTELY). He is 2.5 years younger than Marchand and the likelihood of Marchand regressing next year going on 38 is
absolutely greater than Tavares.

Honest question how many games have you watched Tavares this year?
I have seen Tavares play at least 30 of his games this year.


Pretty certain Tavares has played wing for Team Canada. He also was selected
for 2014 Canadian Olympic Team.

Come on.........

I've seen him probably five times. But it doesn't change my point - not one bit. With Canada having players like Makar, McDavid, McKinnon, Stone, Reinhart, Crosby, etc., how much "talent" do you need?

Do you think adding a guy who is 59th in NHL scoring this year over a guy who is 65th makes any difference? Again, not to rub it in, but by JUST ONE POINT

Add to that the fact that Tavares is a Center. Last I looked there is no room at the inn for that.

Finally, Brad Marchand is a winner. John Tavares is not. You cannot debate that.

There's a reason why teams have added guys like Pat Maroon at TDL for years. It's the intangibles -- not the ONE extra goal that Johnny T has scored this season.

By the way, in those 30 games you've watched Tavares, how many minutes of PK time has he played? I'm guessing about 0:02 seconds per game if it's like the 48 games he's played this season.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Come on.........

I've seen him probably five times. But it doesn't change my point - not one bit. With Canada having players like Makar, McDavid, McKinnon, Stone, Reinhart, Crosby, etc., how much "talent" do you need?

Do you think adding a guy who is 59th in NHL scoring this year over a guy who is 65th makes any difference? Again, not to rub it in, but by JUST ONE POINT

Add to that the fact that Tavares is a Center. Last I looked there is no room at the inn for that.

Finally, Brad Marchand is a winner. John Tavares is not. You cannot debate that.

There's a reason why teams have added guys like Pat Maroon at TDL for years. It's the intangibles -- not the ONE extra goal that Johnny T has scored this season.

By the way, in those 30 games you've watched Tavares, how many minutes of PK time has he played? I'm guessing about 0:02 seconds per game if it's like the 48 games he's played this season.

He has played 9 fewer games but just ignore that, come on e serious.

Tavares already made a Canadian Olympic Team over Marchand.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

And Tavares's hasn't regressed? Give me a break.

I said in my last post that we'll see if Marchand makes it next year. I never said it was a guarantee.

Johnston already has broken out, I thought he had a chance to make it this year but he got off to a slow start. If you want to say there is a chance Bedard or Johnston make it over Marchand, I hear you. Handiness and position will come into play, they aren't taking 11 right-shot forwards.

But quite frankly I find your take on John Tavares to be bizarre.

Why is it bizarre.? Tavares is pacing at a 75 point season and a goid PO run by him
will put him on the radar with his history with Team Canada. Nothing bizarre whatsoever.

 

[Number8]

He has played 9 fewer games but just ignore that, come on e serious.

Tavares already made a Canadian Olympic Team over Marchand.

Yeah and Tavares is on pace for less than a PPG season. Let's not act like he's gunning for McDavid.

And, regardless, if you want to tell me that Tavares isn't playing with a lot more firepower up top in those nine fewer games then I call bullshit.

Meanwhile........

Tavares was a Captain - is no longer. Not exactly a vote for Leadership skills.
Tavares is a Center - which Canada needs like an elephant needs girth.
Tavares is NOT a winner - Brad Marchand is.
Tavares does no PK at all. Brad Marchand does.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Yes and in 2014 Tavares played in 4 of the 6 games and total ZERO points. IIRC he skated RW on their 4th line.

I’d suggest you’re all alone with this take. As someone previously mentioned, maybe Marchand isn’t there next time around but there’s zero chance Tavares is in. Intangibles matter in these short tournaments.

Tavares suffered a season ending injury against Latvia in the Round Robin. You might think that had something to do with his numbers.

 

[lopey]

Lol wow never thought id see the day when someone backs Tavares over a hall of famer

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Yeah and Tavares is on pace for less than a PPG season. Let's not act like he's gunning for McDavid.

And, regardless, if you want to tell me that Tavares isn't playing with a lot more firepower up top in those nine fewer games then I call bullshit.

Meanwhile........

Tavares was a Captain - is no longer. Not exactly a vote for Leadership skills.
Tavares is a Center - which Canada needs like an elephant needs girth.
Tavares is NOT a winner - Brad Marchand is.
Tavares does no PK at all. Brad Marchand does.

By the time this season ends, Tavares will get more consideration than Marchand
so time will tell.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Lol wow never thought id see the day when someone backs Tavares over a hall of famer

Marchand is further off his peak than Tavares is. Tavares was considered for this team so its by no means insane Tavares will be considered next year.

 

[BruinDust]

Why is it bizarre.? Tavares is pacing at a 75 point season and a goid PO run by him
will put him on the radar with his history with Team Canada. Nothing bizarre whatsoever.

Good playoff run? He hasn't exactly lit the world on fire in the playoffs as a Leaf. 38 games, 12 goals, 12 assists.

Think what you want. I just don't see it.

 

[JAD]

I watched the game last night, but was so frustrated trying to stream the game. My normal streaming links did not have the game and had to search to find a stream. I ended up watching the game on a you-tube feed but had to set my VPN to Japan because it was not available in my country. Then because I had to use my VPN I could not mirror cast the game to my TV and ended up watching the game on my phone.

One would think that the NHL and hockey overlords in general would want people to have easy access to these games, especially those out of market, to help promote the sport. But like everything else it's about money and screwing the little non-wealthy peasants over. Personally, I can't afford subscriptions ... hell, I don't even have TV reception other than internet streaming.

Otherwise, a fun game to watch and loved the pace. Canada was very fortunate not have had a penalty called in overtime for too many men. Also, a little disappointed Marchand did not get on the ice in OT.

I'm looking forward to tonight's game. Hopefully I will have better luck with the streaming knowing now what to possibly expect.

 

[bobbyorr04]

Does anybody know where the 4 Nations thread is??

I stumbled into the John Tavares thread by mistake

 

[Number8]

By the time this season ends, Tavares will get more consideration than Marchand
so time will tell.

You can't say "time will tell" and then tell me what time will actually tell. It's not how it works.

I'm not trying to be a prick, but you're dying on a hill there is no need to die on.

Crosby, MacKinnon, Point, Reinhart....

Add in Bedard plus the fact that any GM with any smarts would add in Scheifele who is younger and better than Tavares.

I suspect you will be disappointed, but time will tell. (OK, now I'm being a prick -- but this is how it's done)

 

[Bruin4]

 

[DaBroons]

They out played Canada for long stretches , Canada is not that much better than the rest of the teams in the all-star tourney.

Having the best player on the planet sure gives you an advantage. He was electric.

Which one? Seriously, MacKinnon, McDavid, and Crosby were all spectacular. I also was impressed with Sweden's team game, passing, weaving, puck possession. Great hockey game. Both goalies were better than I expected. Surprised not to see Marchy in OT, because he has scored so many OT goals.

 

[TP70BruinsCup]

Which one? Seriously, MacKinnon, McDavid, and Crosby were all spectacular. I also was impressed with Sweden's team game, passing, weaving, puck possession. Great hockey game. Both goalies were better than I expected. Surprised not to see Marchy in OT, because he has scored so many OT goals.

Canada should have won 3-1. Some soft goals let in

 

[khanomcat]

Marchand has always been a clutch performer both in the NHL & international play. Tavares while a very talented player has never been known to show up in big moments. I recall a playoff game vs the B’s recently where he coasted through neutral ice as the bruins came back the other way to score a game winning goal. The Toronto media was all over him for it. In a short tournament Marchand over Tavares is a no brainer.

I'd definitely choose Marchand. IIRC, Tavares played well for Canada in the World Juniors. Aside from that however,...

 

[KillerMillerTime]

You can't say "time will tell" and then tell me what time will actually tell. It's not how it works.

I'm not trying to be a prick, but you're dying on a hill there is no need to die on.

Crosby, MacKinnon, Point, Reinhart....

Add in Bedard plus the fact that any GM with any smarts would add in Scheifele who is younger and better than Tavares.

I suspect you will be disappointed, but time will tell. (OK, now I'm being a prick -- but this is how it's done)

Ok Number8, but time will tell and that's exactly how it works.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Good playoff run? He hasn't exactly lit the world on fire in the playoffs as a Leaf. 38 games, 12 goals, 12 assists.

Think what you want. I just don't see it.

He sits 15th amongst Canadian forwards PPG and is 12th in Goals and top 10 amongst Canadian Forwards in Goals per game. Those are damn good numbers
and people are letting their hate of the Leafs completely take over evaluating
is play. He was considered for the team and keeps his play up will be considered next year.