Five members from Canada’s 2018 world junior team (Hart, McLeod, Dube, Foote and Formenton) told to surrender to police, facing sexual assault charges

[onetweasy]

Borderline yes

So your going with “boys will be boys”?

Gross.

 

[93LEAFS]

I keep coming back to this point because it seems so obvious to me, yet people keep wanting to argue it.

If a woman is sexually assaulted, the moral fault lies 100% with the abuser. The woman does not deserve to be sexually assaulted - full stop.

Yet yes - there are things women can do to minimize the risk of being sexually assaulted. Primarily to avoid drinking to excess in situations where you don't have someone trustworthy looking out for you.

Two things can be true at the same time.

Because in the sense it's being discussed here, it comes off as "If she didn't go to the hotel with the first player, these other players wouldn't have ruined their reputations/careers."

I drank way more than I ever should have multiple times at the establishment in question (Jack's). Never was I concerned that I'd likely get sexually assaulted, and I never was. It's sort of just putting a double standard on the women, who is a victim in this scenario, and women in general.

 

[JadedRandom]

"DARVO: PR edition" is about to rear its ugly head, again.

It'll be a long, ugly prelude to "DARVO: Hockey Canada 2018 edition" that we should get mid-2026.

For those who don't know, DARVO is acronym for meta defense attorney tactic "Deflect, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender".

 

[JoVel]

As someone posted already

Official Site of the National Hockey League | NHL.com

The official National Hockey League website including news, rosters, stats, schedules, teams, and video.

www.nhl.com

Not a single mention. And that is why it must be torn down.

How weak...chickenbleep...I hope the media goes nuclear on the NHL.

I wouldn't hold my breath. No one even remembers who Kyle Beach is anymore.

That said, this league deserves to be nuked to the ground.

 

[covfefe]

As someone posted already

Official Site of the National Hockey League | NHL.com

The official National Hockey League website including news, rosters, stats, schedules, teams, and video.

www.nhl.com

Not a single mention. And that is why it must be torn down.

How weak...chickenbleep...I hope the media goes nuclear on the NHL.

Imagine we'll see a statement tomorrow as they'll have their crisis manager in place.

Will they go with Navigator, as seen w/ HC?

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Because in the sense it's being discussed here, it comes off as "If she didn't go to the hotel with the first player, these other players wouldn't have ruined their reputations/careers."

I drank way more than I ever should have multiple times at the establishment in question (Jack's). Never was I concerned that I'd likely get sexually assaulted, and I never was. It's sort of just putting a double standard on the women, who is a victim in this scenario, and women in general.

And beyond that, think of how many times people have felt compelled to make this public service announcement about the things women can do to prevent being sexually assaulted.

Now think about the number of times in this thread people felt the need to talk about teaching young men that if they're going to have sex with a stranger, consent is insanely important. When you add alcohol, consent and respect is even more important. Has anyone even brought up simply respecting women?

Imagine if this woman was the sister or cousin of a well liked teammate who wasn't in the room, do we think the guys all would've had the same attitude towards her? Probably not. Because they knew someone who actually cared about her as a human being and not just as something to stick their dick in.

I hate to resort to the "this is someone's sister/mother/etc" but some guys apparently can't wrap their heads around women deserving respect unless it's a relative they would not have sex with.



(to be clear this is me ranting and not criticizing anything you've said here)

 

[Sasha Orlov]

Sexual Assault is different from Aggravated sexual assault. One is rape that is extremely graphic in terms is violence. Sexual assualt is usually just dealing with consent issues. Could be as simple as an unwanted to touch.

There is no charge in Canada called “rape” actually

 

[Ezekial]

There are active NHLers who are now charged. I think that makes it an NHL story.

It's a story involving NHL players, sure, but I wouldn't expect them to advertise it in their front page.

NFL didn't have Ray Rice hitting his wife on their front page either.

You have to be searching for things to be mad at to be outraged that nhl.com isn't highlighting this.

 

[GeoRox89]

So your going with “boys will be boys”?

Gross.

Given the context of the initial post it’s worse and closer to ‘boys will be boys and girls will get raped’ which just thank goodness for all the pushback from the overwhelming majority here or I’d start really losing my faith in humanity

 

[jamo27]

Methinks this is all going to be a lot bigger than if 5 guys are found guilty and get to play more hockey. This is the start of a big change — when this is said and done, “hockey culture” is going to be extinct. I can’t see how society is going to tolerate any more of what we all have heard that has gone on for decades in hockey (I.e disgusting hazing rituals, bullying, alleged sexual assaults like this one). This case broke the camel’s back.

 

[OurlordAndSaviorKuch]

Glad we traded Foote when we did and got something before this blew up into our faces and had this situation hanging over the team.

 

[Jared Dunn]

I feel at least a couple defense teams are going to toy with the idea of throwing HC under the bus to reduce their clients' culpability. HC as an authority that told them to say this, keep quiet about that...That sort of thing. They will claim their clients were too young and insulated to know how serious the matter was.

I feel like it would be tough to find HC culpable in the act of sexual assault

 

[red devil]

 

[McFlyingV]

I’d bet Formenton is player 1, and it was his phone that was used to make videos, him talking to her, and him interacting with her. Id also bet if he is player 1 he will come out looking “the worst” out of the bunch. He was probably radioactive to touch to a larger degree than the other players when this became known

Player 1 is a completely disgusting human-being given the reports and texts that have been published. If it is Formenton, which I believe you're correct on, it's no surprise he was dropped by Ottawa.

 

[lionsDen]

Eh. Depends on which part of the US you live. Unfortunately we've been getting a bit lenient here

Yeah it’s a hate crime now.

 

[PensandCaps]

Hopefully all 5 get put under the prison for life. But they're rich so i have zero faith in true justice happening to them.

 

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

I keep coming back to this point because it seems so obvious to me, yet people keep wanting to argue it.

If a woman is sexually assaulted, the moral fault lies 100% with the abuser. The woman does not deserve to be sexually assaulted - full stop.

Yet yes - there are things women can do to minimize the risk of being sexually assaulted. Primarily to avoid drinking to excess in situations where you don't have someone trustworthy looking out for you.

Two things can be true at the same time.

As has also been noted, women already know this. They know that they are at risk of being victimized by men and they know how to mitigate the risks.

Let's say, though, that women comply and help the men that can't help themselves. Will sexual assaults magically stop? Will they even be reduced?

The problem is the actions of men. The "But also...!" of women mitigating risks really only benefits one group in discussions like this - the guys facing sexual assault charges and need to mount a defense in a power structure that still looks for any way to give the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Fish on The Sand]

Fascinated to learn the timeline of when teams became aware, both of the likely involvement and the specific development. Hart started a game on 1/20, allowed 5 in 2 periods and got pulled. Dube took his leave on 1/21 and the Flames put out that...statement. Hart took his two days later, on 1/23, and reading the Flyers statement and observing their total avoidance of the issue on their broadcast and pressers, you knew they knew. So did the Flyers start Hart knowing it would bevfor the last time?

And on a broader level, how long have teams been utilizing and marketing around players who they knew would eventually face sexual assault charges?

Me, some random dude with an Internet connection and absolutely no connections to the NHL or organized hockey at all, knew that Dube, Hart, et al were implicated, so there's no way their respective teams didn't.

 

[Whaddagoal]

Glad we traded Foote when we did and got something before this blew up into our faces and had this situation hanging over the team.

I wish I could say the same about my team.

It's as if the GM said... You know what, I'm going to go all in. Hard to believe they didn't know this about Foote being a possible implicated player.

 

[Kane One]

Hopefully all 5 get put under the prison for life. But they're rich so i have zero faith in true justice happening to them.

It’s also Canada. I’m expecting a weak sentence if they’re convicted. Hopefully it’s a harsh one to make a statement.

 

[Carl Hungus]

Glad we traded Foote when we did and got something before this blew up into our faces and had this situation hanging over the team.

Yes, I'm so glad the Tampa bay lightning were able to get Jeannot for cal foote and a billion draft picks. That's exactly what I was thinking too. Their ability to employ someone with these rumors surrounding him and get away with an overpriced asset is what's really important here, great call!

 

[El Travo]

Now think about the number of times in this thread people felt the need to talk about teaching young men that if they're going to have sex with a stranger, consent is insanely important. When you add alcohol, consent and respect is even more important. Has anyone even brought up simply respecting women?

I could be wrong (haven't followed this super closely), but isn't this the case where they got a video recording of her "consenting"? So it's not a matter of teaching them that consent is important, as they clearly knew and attempted to cover their asses.

 

[I Hart Conor Garland]

Glad we traded Foote when we did and got something before this blew up into our faces and had this situation hanging over the team.

Thank goodness we avoided the worst here.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Who is the biggest loser out of the 3 NHL teams?

Devils-2 players
Flyers-best player
Flames-foot in mouth

 

[T REX]

I mean if I wanted to be charitable to the NHL (which I don't really) - this was a Hockey Canada event, and not an NHL event.

NHL has not covered itself in glory in this event, but there you have it.

FOUR current NHL players...all tied to this incident. Uhhhhh...how is it NOT an NHL story...just curious?