Prospect Info: Filip Mesar

[Heffyhoof]

It's definitely nice to see a case where a SKILL forward is put in a position to exploit his SKILL. I think the simplest development method is this one: put them in a position to succeed and build their game off their strengths. The BergevinTherrienTimmins Habs would seem to insist on building players off their weakest facet and it never lead to greatness. Mesar being allowed to dominate the OHL is a completely different approach and I hope to see it as a case study in success in the very near future.

No comment here on the development of the other Slovak in our organization.

You're dragging up awful memories. The amount of times I recall us drafting a skilled player only for management to make comments about how the prospect needs to focus on the defensive side or something else would infuriate me. Player XYZ is an extremely good skater with fast hands and good playmaking, let's focus the next 3-5 years of development trying to force them to become a 30 point two-way player who plays da right way. Why draft a prospect for their strengths if you only ever focus on weaknesses.

 

[Scriptor]

You're dragging up awful memories. The amount of times I recall us drafting a skilled player only for management to make comments about how the prospect needs to focus on the defensive side or something else would infuriate me. Player XYZ is an extremely good skater with fast hands and good playmaking, let's focus the next 3-5 years of development trying to force them to become a 30 point two-way player who plays da right way. Why draft a prospect for their strengths if you only ever focus on weaknesses.

Yet another trivial analysis of the development process to marginalize any workout on making a player a more complete player.

It's obvious from reading countless posts oaths subject that the average fan needs to have something gift-wrapped in the simplest of approaches to understand somewhat how development works.

At some point, unless a player produces 300 points a season and spends 99.99% of his time on ice in the O-zone (one of the most effective defensive stratagems ever), he needs to be at least somewhat defensively responsible to justify his ice time to the level you would need it to be to benefit from his offensive acumen.

The easiest concept to understand when it comes to this is that of the offensive player's need to play with a positive goal differential when he is on the ice to be valuable to the team.

You score 27 goals, with 20 minutes of ice time a game, including 13 goals the PP, but your line has a negative goal differential where it give up 36 goals more than you score, at even strength, on the PP, or on the PK..

While I'd still use you on the PP, hoping you will score goals there endnote give up that many, I'd have a serious problem handing out even strength minutes toy like candy.

The key about working on a player's defensive game, when they are an offensive players to get them a level where their defensive game is at least not a major handicap. That way, giving them more ice time will only come with a greater positive goal differential that will increase the odds of winning games.

There's nothing worse than talented offensive players that need sheltered minutes with strictly O-Zone draws, PP minutes, game situations that aren't as crucial, etc...

Working on a player's defensive game also serves to help increase puck touches and puck recovery to initiate transitions to offense and lead to more scoring opportunities.

Working on a player's defensive game isn't limited to only working on D.

A better D-game will lead to increased ice time and more opportunities to rack up more points.

Choosing to describe the situation as such, to minimize its importance, is either a bad faith observation or a lack of understanding.

 

[Andy]

Expecting at least a 1.25 ppg pace so he's currently well beyond that.

He also seems like mostly a rush player and not too interested in using his body to win/keep possession. So if you're mostly a perimeter softie, point production is not an option.

I’m not sure what the criticism is here. Is he not producing?

 

[montreal]

Sure. But if he wasn’t keeping up, we’d be very concerned. Which begs the question, what are we expecting from Mesar this year?

Last year his issues were -

lack of consistency (production)
Inconsistent effort (without puck)
very weak physically, easily pushed off pucks

 

[Andy]

Last year his issues were -

lack on consistency
Inconsistent effort
very weak physically, easily pushed off pucks

Thanks for giving a substantial answer. One of these can be worked on (strength). The other two for me usually depends on talent progression. Hopefully he can continue to keep progressing

 

[Scriptor]

I think 2PPG in D+2 in the OHL isn't particularly noteworthy but those of us who said "let him cook!" are quietly pleased to see sincere progress in his effectiveness as a hockey player. Maybe he'll never amount to much in the NHL, but he's not on the wrong track.

So, would 3 points per game be somewhat noteworthy? 4 PPG and we're suddenly starting to talk, now?

I think it's safe to say that getting 2PPG, even in the D+2 season as a 19-yr-old is noteworthy.

Unless you're implying it's all the rage and just about every player is a 2PPG player at that stage in their development?

Seriously...

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

trust me lol this board knows more than what you expect.

yeah like a shadow government

 

[ReHabs]

Yet another trivial analysis of the development process to marginalize any workout on making a player a more complete player.

It's obvious from reading countless posts oaths subject that the average fan needs to have something gift-wrapped in the simplest of approaches to understand somewhat how development works.

At some point, unless a player produces 300 points a season and spends 99.99% of his time on ice in the O-zone (one of the most effective defensive stratagems ever), he needs to be at least somewhat defensively responsible to justify his ice time to the level you would need it to be to benefit from his offensive acumen.

The easiest concept to understand when it comes to this is that of the offensive player's need to play with a positive goal differential when he is on the ice to be valuable to the team.

You score 27 goals, with 20 minutes of ice time a game, including 13 goals the PP, but your line has a negative goal differential where it give up 36 goals more than you score, at even strength, on the PP, or on the PK..

While I'd still use you on the PP, hoping you will score goals there endnote give up that many, I'd have a serious problem handing out even strength minutes toy like candy.

The key about working on a player's defensive game, when they are an offensive players to get them a level where their defensive game is at least not a major handicap. That way, giving them more ice time will only come with a greater positive goal differential that will increase the odds of winning games.

There's nothing worse than talented offensive players that need sheltered minutes with strictly O-Zone draws, PP minutes, game situations that aren't as crucial, etc...

Working on a player's defensive game also serves to help increase puck touches and puck recovery to initiate transitions to offense and lead to more scoring opportunities.

Working on a player's defensive game isn't limited to only working on D.

A better D-game will lead to increased ice time and more opportunities to rack up more points.

Choosing to describe the situation as such, to minimize its importance, is either a bad faith observation or a lack of understanding.

Obviously — and this should go without saying — we are aware that a hockey player needs a collectively acceptable game.

What we’re remembering is how the Habs over-emphasized two way play in all their forward prospects before the otherwise skilled prospects even developed their authentic, instinctive game.

Now if you’re going to rant and rave about how we’re unfair to the endlessly bad Bergevin regime I think we should cut the discussion off right there. You would have little evidence to support the notion the Habs did anything right with skill prospects during that managerial regime.

 

[ReHabs]

So, would 3 points per game be somewhat noteworthy? 4 PPG and we're suddenly starting to talk, now?

I think it's safe to say that getting 2PPG, even in the D+2 season as a 19-yr-old is noteworthy.

Unless you're implying it's all the rage and just about every player is a 2PPG player at that stage in their development?

Seriously...

Is it safe to say? Are you certain?

Calm down.

D+2 vs D year, you see higher production in the drafted D+2s than what you see from D-year prospects. So it’s not something to get caught up on. The game is different in Juniors. Over-emphasis (there is that word again) on production of overagers in the CHL is fool’s gold.

Mešar is doing well and that’s a good thing in and of itself. He’s still a teenager in a new country, etc. the fact that he’s actually playing his skill game now is what will positively influence his development. More than elsewhere, the high production is a product of his ability to play his game.

 

[Skip Bayless]

I’m not sure what the criticism is here. Is he not producing?

I’m not criticizing him, just answering your question as to what is expected of him and why.

 

[Heffyhoof]

Yet another trivial analysis of the development process to marginalize any workout on making a player a more complete player.

It's obvious from reading countless posts oaths subject that the average fan needs to have something gift-wrapped in the simplest of approaches to understand somewhat how development works.

At some point, unless a player produces 300 points a season and spends 99.99% of his time on ice in the O-zone (one of the most effective defensive stratagems ever), he needs to be at least somewhat defensively responsible to justify his ice time to the level you would need it to be to benefit from his offensive acumen.

The easiest concept to understand when it comes to this is that of the offensive player's need to play with a positive goal differential when he is on the ice to be valuable to the team.

You score 27 goals, with 20 minutes of ice time a game, including 13 goals the PP, but your line has a negative goal differential where it give up 36 goals more than you score, at even strength, on the PP, or on the PK..

While I'd still use you on the PP, hoping you will score goals there endnote give up that many, I'd have a serious problem handing out even strength minutes toy like candy.

The key about working on a player's defensive game, when they are an offensive players to get them a level where their defensive game is at least not a major handicap. That way, giving them more ice time will only come with a greater positive goal differential that will increase the odds of winning games.

There's nothing worse than talented offensive players that need sheltered minutes with strictly O-Zone draws, PP minutes, game situations that aren't as crucial, etc...

Working on a player's defensive game also serves to help increase puck touches and puck recovery to initiate transitions to offense and lead to more scoring opportunities.

Working on a player's defensive game isn't limited to only working on D.

A better D-game will lead to increased ice time and more opportunities to rack up more points.

Choosing to describe the situation as such, to minimize its importance, is either a bad faith observation or a lack of understanding.

I don't know how you read my comment and assumed I'm too stupid to realize that there can exist a scenario wherein an offensive player is such a liability that their negatives outweigh the production. I'm a fellow Habs fan bud, we just went through watching great examples in Drouin, Hoffman, and Dadonov.

I'm specifically complaining about the seeming long held development strategy in Montreal of hyper focusing on mitigating weaknesses with almost no focus on isolating and improving strengths. Development isn't just about rounding out a player, it's also about accentuating the facets of their game that made them draft worthy in the first place.

That said, this is the Mesar thread and we're starting to deviate a bit too much.

 

[Scriptor]

I don't know how you read my comment and assumed I'm too stupid to realize that there can exist a scenario wherein an offensive player is such a liability that their negatives outweigh the production. I'm a fellow Habs fan bud, we just went through watching great examples in Drouin, Hoffman, and Dadonov.

I'm specifically complaining about the seeming long held development strategy in Montreal of hyper focusing on mitigating weaknesses with almost no focus on isolating and improving strengths. Development isn't just about rounding out a player, it's also about accentuating the facets of their game that made them draft worthy in the first place.

That said, this is the Mesar thread and we're starting to deviate a bit too much.

"I'm specifically complaining about the seeming long held development strategy in Montreal of hyper focusing on mitigating weaknesses with almost no focus on isolating and improving strengths"

I just don't see that with the Hughes-lead team and harping on Bergevin and prior failures is a useless endeavour, IMO.

Complaining about things that have no present bearing might be fun for some and, perhaps,weshould start a thread for such complaints if there is a high enough demand.

I don't think you're too stupid to realize the scenario I described and that you experienced as a Hab fan, but you wrote your post sounding like you are by trivializing the whole development process. You also forgot Galchenyuk as a prime example, and Souray who scored tons as a D, but was on the ice for more score against us.

 

[Garnet76]

Mesar is making great strides so far this year. Great to see after a rocky season last year. I hope he keeps it up as I see him as a boom or bust prospect. If he put it together he would a major asset to the habs.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Mesar deniers be like uhh umm must have been the uhhhh

 

[le_sean]

Wah wah what about Kulich.

Writing off Mesar after being a PPG in his first CHL season is one of the most ridiculous movements I’ve seen on this board.

 

[Bombshell11]

Mesar has improved his shot

What a pick dis guy is

 

[Ezpz]

Mesar deniers be like uhh umm must have been the uhhhh

He's better than he showed last year and is quickly reasserting himself in the top 10 of our prospect list. It should be noted the best player in the OHL is on his line though and his team has the top 3 spots in league scoring with another in the top 10 before you even get to Mesar.

Kitchener are easily the best team in the league and were even before Mesar was sent down. That is to say he is not driving the team forward, though he is a heavy contributor.

Still, I will happily eat crow if Mesar becomes an NHL player of any significance.

 

[Bombshell11]

He's better than he showed last year and is quickly reasserting himself in the top 10 of our prospect list. It should be noted the best player in the OHL is on his line though and his team has the top 3 spots in league scoring with another in the top 10 before you even get to Mesar.

Kitchener are easily the best team in the league and were even before Mesar was sent down. That is to say he is not driving the team forward, though he is a heavy contributor.

Still, I will happily eat crow if Mesar becomes an NHL player of any significance.

Man... Rehkopf? what are you saying dude...

Don't look at stats and try to pretend you know what you're talking about. Rehkopf is maybe just a little bit better than Pinelli

Pineli's projected season this year:

Projected

AHL

70

6

6

12

The best player on Mesar's line is Mesar... by far. He's a better PPG

just watch him play man, its tiring trying to argue with people who just follow stats sheets

 

[Heffyhoof]

Not watching the game, but a quick stat check shows a hattie with the third period left to play tonight. Good to see him add some goal scoring to his torrid pace.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Mesar wasn't my first pick there (Hutson was, things work out sometimes - otherwise Firkus would have been) but I'm really happy to see he's progressing. Maybe he can be our Marchessault

 

[Ezpz]

Man... Rehkopf? what are you saying dude...

Don't look at stats and try to pretend you know what you're talking about. Rehkopf is maybe just a little bit better than Pinelli

Pineli's projected season this year:

Projected

AHL

70

6

6

12

The best player on Mesar's line is Mesar... by far. He's a better PPG

just watch him play man, its tiring trying to argue with people who just follow stats sheets

This isn't even remotely true. Kitchener fans have been praising Rehkopf all year and praising his pro-ready tools in a way pinelli never was talked about. Mesar on the other hand is a guy who plays a cute game that doesn't project as well against pro players.

PPG isn't an argument when Mesar joined a team already firing on all cylinders. If you look at their PPG only in the games they've played together there is no difference. Let mesar play 11 games without Rehkopf and he likely has the same or lesser PPG. They literally both had 18 points in their last 10 and 4 (Mesar) and 5 (Rehkopf) points tonight so far. They're playing at the exact same pace together.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

An assist for Filip! 4 points so far tonight.

2 points per game again.

Stud.

When he drops to 1.8 points per game he's a bust and a terrible pick. Don't debate me you know it's true.

 

[Goldenhands]

Man... Rehkopf? what are you saying dude...

Don't look at stats and try to pretend you know what you're talking about. Rehkopf is maybe just a little bit better than Pinelli

Pineli's projected season this year:

Projected

AHL

70

6

6

12

The best player on Mesar's line is Mesar... by far. He's a better PPG

just watch him play man, its tiring trying to argue with people who just follow stats sheets

Dont be ridiculous, both have been great and show great chimestry, both are much better prospects than Pinelli who drove me crazy last year.

 

[Bombshell11]

Dont be ridiculous, both have been great and show great chimestry, both are much better prospects than Pinelli who drove me crazy last year.

both have played together last year, that helps for sure

but no, Mesar is better than both players, he was last year where his ppg was lower than Pineli's and higher than Rehkopf's

Rehkopf has definitly improved alot, im not trying to knock him down but he's not at the same level offensively as Mesar and it showed tonight in some plays where again he couldn't convert nice wide open shots.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Mesar right now to anyone who ragged on him and Habs for selecting him: