F Adam Fantilli - Univ. of Michigan, NCAA (2023 Draft)

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NewEraGM

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Yeah there’s nothing wrong with thinking Fantilli is elite and I think he absolutely goes at least top 4 in the draft as the tools are all there, he’s just missed a bit of “wow” factor and has some IQ kinks to workout for sure.

It’s just very obvious watching them play together that Bedard is on another level.
Yea, the difference is clear but I do think Fantilli is just having a few off games too. These 2 first games, the difference has looked massive, and I don’t think the difference is as big as that. Bedard clearly ahead though
 

DuckDuckGetz

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I would be nervous to pick him at 2nd but something tells me this is a huge overreaction that will make his stock drop and some team will get an absolute steal at like 5th.
 

Nabrules

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With good reason maybe? Three years later and he's still not very good.
Ah yes PPG as a 20 year old in the AHL is soooooo bad. Everyone who properly follows the draft knew it’ll be a long game with QB and that’s ok
 

HanSolo

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Ah yes PPG as a 20 year old in the AHL is soooooo bad. Everyone who properly follows the draft knew it’ll be a long game with QB and that’s ok
When Justin Schultz was in the AHL and well above a PPG people hailed him as a future elite #1 defenseman and Norris contender. 633 NHL games later he's only had more than 40 points in a season once. You're gonna need a better argument than that.
 

SmytheKing

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When Justin Schultz was in the AHL and well above a PPG people hailed him as a future elite #1 defenseman and Norris contender. 633 NHL games later he's only had more than 40 points in a season once. You're gonna need a better argument than that.
How about the fact that when Schultz did that he was 3 years older than Byfield currently is? Schultz was in his sophomore year at the University of Wisconsin when he was the same age.
 

HanSolo

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How about the fact that when Schultz did that he was 3 years older than Byfield currently is? Schultz was in his sophomore year at the University of Wisconsin when he was the same age.
That's just one example off the top of my head. AHL performance doesn't always translate to NHL results is my main point.
 
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Rabid Ranger

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Ah yes PPG as a 20 year old in the AHL is soooooo bad. Everyone who properly follows the draft knew it’ll be a long game with QB and that’s ok
No one's really playing the "long game" with #2 overall picks, especially a player drafted out of the CHL and someone with the physical gifts Byfield has. The rightful expectation is he would step in and contribute right away in a top six role. He's had some setbacks but let's not pretend his development path is what was *expected."
 

SmytheKing

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That's just one example off the top of my head. AHL performance doesn't always translate to NHL results is my main point.
I don't think anyone claimed that though. They said his putting up a PPG in the AHL as a 20-year old is pretty good when someone else said he hasn't been very good. They never said it meant he was going to be a PPG player in the NHL.
 

HanSolo

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I don't think anyone claimed that though. They said his putting up a PPG in the AHL as a 20-year old is pretty good when someone else said he hasn't been very good. They never said it meant he was going to be a PPG player in the NHL.
Well that's relative as to what people's expectations are.

If Byfield comes out of the A as a career 45 point player, yeah that's good. In a bubble. But is it really what you want out of a second overall pick?
 

nbwingsfan

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Bedard 18/19 [2023-24]McDavid 26/27 [2023-24]
Bedard 19/20 [2024-25]McDavid 27/28 [2024-25]
Bedard 20/21 [2025-26]McDavid 28/29 [2025-26]
Bedard 21/22 [2026-27]McDavid 29/30 [2026-27]
Bedard 22/23 [2027-28]McDavid 30/31 [2027-28]
Bedard 23/24 [2028-29]McDavid 31/32 [2028-29]

I could see Bedard eventually winning in the 2028-29 season, but McDavid is likely to have 7+ Art Ross trophies by then, so Bedard is going to have to do a LOT of hardware winning to eventually be on McD's level.

Don't get me wrong, I think Bedard is an amazing prospect with the potential to be a top 5 player in the league, year-in-year-out. For me, that's still a level below McD, who is (imo) a top 3 player of all time.
McDavid isn’t top 3 all time.

And yes I fully expect you Bedard to be competing with McDavid and at times beating him some of those years.
 

GermanSpitfire

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One thing of note for Fantilli is that he is an ‘04 for this tournament - he is absolutely underpreforming expectations.

It would similar if Mason McTavish put up 1 point through the first 2 games last year - it would have been disappointing.

Also - the WJC is such a big scouting event because you get to see where these kids are at In a best on best format. Want to know what else is a best on best format? The NHL.

Don’t go overboard one way or another in player but it is very important for player evaluation for an ‘04 like Fantilli for sure.
 

stevo61

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One thing of note for Fantilli is that he is an ‘04 for this tournament - he is absolutely underpreforming expectations.

It would similar if Mason McTavish put up 1 point through the first 2 games last year - it would have been disappointing.

Also - the WJC is such a big scouting event because you get to see where these kids are at In a best on best format. Want to know what else is a best on best format? The NHL.

Don’t go overboard one way or another in player but it is very important for player evaluation for an ‘04 like Fantilli for sure.
Eh its only very important to guys like Craig Button. A couple weeks of hockey helps but doesnt undo years of scouting. MacKinnon's 0G 1A didnt change too much or Dubois and his disappointing performance.
 

vildurson

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This just tells me how ready you are for big show and how comfortable you are against bigger older and faster guys. All I am reading from this is that Fantilli is probably at least one year away from the big show as productive center in NHL.
 

SmytheKing

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Well that's relative as to what people's expectations are.

If Byfield comes out of the A as a career 45 point player, yeah that's good. In a bubble. But is it really what you want out of a second overall pick?
Why are you moving the goalposts? You responded to someone saying a PPG player as a 20 year old in the AHL is good (who was responding to someone saying he isn't very good) and now you're talking about potential career projections based entirely on speculation to support a point you're defending that no one is making.

If you want to say you think Stutzle was, and will continue to be, the correct pick, go for it. I'd agree. That has nothing to do with what the poster was saying though.
 

nbwingsfan

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Eh its only very important to guys like Craig Button. A couple weeks of hockey helps but doesnt undo years of scouting. MacKinnon's 0G 1A didnt change too much or Dubois and his disappointing performance.
Pierre Luc Dubois? He didn’t play in his draft year and wasn’t even bad the year he did play after being drafted ?

Why are you moving the goalposts? You responded to someone saying a PPG player as a 20 year old in the AHL is good (who was responding to someone saying he isn't very good) and now you're talking about potential career projections based entirely on speculation to support a point you're defending that no one is making.

If you want to say you think Stutzle was, and will continue to be, the correct pick, go for it. I'd agree. That has nothing to do with what the poster was saying though.
Well you’d hope a 2nd overall pick would be making a half decent NHL impact by his D+3
 

stevo61

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Pierre Luc Dubois? He didn’t play in his draft year and wasn’t even bad the year he did play after being drafted ?


Well you’d hope a 2nd overall pick would be making a half decent NHL impact by his D+3
? The entire talk about Dubois after that tournament was about being a bust and what top prospect ever had such a poor showing
 

QJL

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Fantilli with a big time second assist. This is the moment for Fantilli 1st overall truthers to pounce.
 

nbwingsfan

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? The entire talk about Dubois after that tournament was about being a bust and what top prospect ever had such a poor showing
Once again, how would PLD performance have anything to do with his draft position when he was as already drafted?

I’m not sure who the hell you were talking to about him, but 5pts in 7games playing a defensive 3rd line role is far from “what top prospect has ever been that bad” territory?
 

stevo61

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Once again, how would PLD performance have anything to do with his draft position when he was as already drafted?

I’m not sure who the hell you were talking to about him, but 5pts in 7games playing a defensive 3rd line role is far from “what top prospect has ever been that bad” territory?
Not draft position but peoples opinions of a prospect in general. A short tournament turned a lot of peoples opinions on him. A 3rd overall pick should be an offensive leader not a defensive role player and people took that and ran. Doesnt matter if its pre or post draft, I think people let the WJC sway their opinions of a player too much both good and bad.
 

nbwingsfan

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Dec 13, 2009
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Not draft position but peoples opinions of a prospect in general. A short tournament turned a lot of peoples opinions on him. A 3rd overall pick should be an offensive leader not a defensive role player and people took that and ran. Doesnt matter if its pre or post draft, I think people let the WJC sway their opinions of a player too much both good and bad.
I’m pretty sure his 6G/18pts in 20 games in the QMJHL prior to trade were what people were complaining about, saying he shouldn’t even be on the team.

His play at the WJC was quite good
 

SmytheKing

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Well you’d hope a 2nd overall pick would be making a half decent NHL impact by his D+3
You'd also hope the team that drafted him wouldn't sign a guy who plays his same position to a 5-year deal as a FA the year after he was drafted and allow him to actually play more than 10-12 minutes a game with talented players too.
 

nbwingsfan

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You'd also hope the team that drafted him wouldn't sign a guy who plays his same position to a 5-year deal as a FA the year after he was drafted and allow him to actually play more than 10-12 minutes a game with talented players too.
If he was good enough he would be playing more than 10mins. He hasn’t really been very good in the NHL that can’t be debated.

But I’m not going to talk about Byfield any more in this thread
 
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