Player Discussion Evan Bouchard

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

We can't do that pay and its not commensurate. Needs to be around 5-6 and even bridge to do that. Beyond McDrai window nothing really matters. At this point in our compete now window we get him at what we can afford to pay and even if limited term.

Cap potentially going up to around 85 million next season. Over 2 million dead cap and all of our LTIRs off the books leaving only 2 million in dead cap for Neal. A little over 74 million committed to 16 players. Get rid of Yamamoto/Foegele/Kulak and you're down to 65 million for 13, with 17 million to distribute between ~10 other players. 7 million for Bouchard, 1.5 million for each of Kostin+McLeod. Then 7 players at veterans minimum/ELC (probably looks something like a Holloway/Lavoie/Niemelainen promotion, a Nick Bjugstad discount re-sign, a Derek Ryan paycut, and 2 reclamation project depth players. Even if cap only goes up to 83.5 million we can probably just run a 22 man roster and make it work. That's completely manageable even without getting rid of the biggest albatross on the team. We also need to be doing whatever we can to get Campbell off the books ASAP but that's obviously a lot more difficult.

Beyond the McDrai years absolutely matters. Ovechkin never won during his prime and instead lifted the cup at age 33 when Washington's "window" was supposedly already over. Unless you think they're leaving, which I don't, we still need to consider a contention window when they're on the next contracts.

 

[Hemsky4pm2]

I think the Oilers will be buying out Yamamoto (1/3 buyout) to make space this summer to add years to a Bouchard contract.

 

[jeblers]

Cap potentially going up to around 85 million next season. Over 2 million dead cap and all of our LTIRs off the books leaving only 2 million in dead cap for Neal. A little over 74 million committed to 16 players. Get rid of Yamamoto/Foegele/Kulak and you're down to 65 million for 13, with 17 million to distribute between ~10 other players. 7 million for Bouchard, 1.5 million for each of Kostin+McLeod. Then 7 players at veterans minimum/ELC (probably looks something like a Holloway/Lavoie/Niemelainen promotion, a Nick Bjugstad discount re-sign, a Derek Ryan paycut, and 2 reclamation project depth players. Even if cap only goes up to 83.5 million we can probably just run a 22 man roster and make it work. That's completely manageable even without getting rid of the biggest albatross on the team. We also need to be doing whatever we can to get Campbell off the books ASAP but that's obviously a lot more difficult.

Beyond the McDrai years absolutely matters. Ovechkin never won during his prime and instead lifted the cup at age 33 when Washington's "window" was supposedly already over. Unless you think they're leaving, which I don't, we still need to consider a contention window when they're on the next contracts.

I love Bouchard put 7 million on a long term contract is quite steep for the sample size that we have, he is just finishing his ELC. Before the TDL I guarantee nobody would have considered anywhere close to that.

Quinn Hughes was drafted 3 spots before Bouchard, made the NHL his in his 1st year. Was a Calder finalist, only losing to Makar and is at least in Norris conversations. He is signed at 7.85 million.

He is not that player yet. He needs to be paired with the right defenseman to succeed, whereas the comparables in this price range are the guys you pair a Bouchard with, if that makes sense.

Its all moot anyways, Oilers don't have the space to sign a 7 million dollar deal. It has to be a bridge deal unless we can offload our a few contracts and we all know that is easier said than done.

When I look at our back end we need depth. We can not even afford to sit Vinny d to the bench right now due to lack of depth.

 

[North Cole]

In a logical world I agree. This is the sane take and it probably happens


But most players in the NHL would take 2 million less to play on the Oilers PP.


There is a decent chance Bouchard takes a friendly deal through the cup window even though it doesn't make sense.

I think it does make sense. You take a bridge deal in 5 seconds if your Bouchard for multiple reasons:

- Cap is going nowhere this year. Locking yourself into a long term deal when you're just breaking out in a cap of 82 makes no sense when projections are an 90+ cap in a few years.
- You have a chance to win a cup and make decent money, then secure the bag later. Given there's nothing stopping you from full PP1 time and more 5on5 ice time over the next couple years, 20ish games of a hot playoff run don't increase your value as much as performing over the next 160 regular season games does.
- You sign a bridge taking you to UFA and then when it comes time to be a UFA guess what? You get to see if McDrai are still on this team because their UFA windows will have already arrived. If you won and then the team blew up and went their separate ways, you aren't locked into another 6 years of rebuild. You can also hit the market and be a merc if you want.

I'm not saying McDrai are leaving, but the flexibility is an added bonus if shit happens and they do leave.

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

I love Bouchard put 7 million on a long term contract is quite steep for the sample size that we have, he is just finishing his ELC. Before the TDL I guarantee nobody would have considered anywhere close to that.

Quinn Hughes was drafted 3 spots before Bouchard, made the NHL his in his 1st year. Was a Calder finalist, only losing to Makar and is at least in Norris conversations. He is signed at 7.85 million.

He is not that player yet. He needs to be paired with the right defenseman to succeed, whereas the comparables in this price range are the guys you pair a Bouchard with, if that makes sense.

Its all moot anyways, Oilers don't have the space to sign a 7 million dollar deal. It has to be a bridge deal unless we can offload our a few contracts and we all know that is easier said than done.

When I look at our back end we need depth. We can not even afford to sit Vinny d to the bench right now due to lack of depth.

Quinn Hughes also needs to be "paired with the right defenseman to succeed" as well (look at how much he was flamed by Canucks fans during the lockout season). And for the record Bouchard has done great with every defenseman he's been paired with except Brett Kulak (who needs to be traded away regardless of whether Bouchard gets a LTD or a bridge). Even when paired with a fellow rookie in Broberg they were killing it. People give credit to Ekholm for taking his game to the next level and rightfully so, but the reality is he was already playing great prior to the trade and his "struggles" were largely Kulak related, just as Nurse's "struggles" were largely Ceci related.

Bouchard also actually produced at a similar pace to Hughes at even strength for the past 2 seasons, the difference in totals between them the past 2 seasons was mostly powerplay related and the second Bouchard and the team was finally unshackled of the dead weight that was Tyson Barrie, he started producing at a point per game pace just like Hughes and the team started doing better across the board. While the Oilers powerplay is historic, it's not as if Hughes is working with chumps over in Vancouver with Petterson/Miller/Boeser etc. Now of course Hughes has a larger sample size and therefore should command a bigger salary but I think you're greatly overexaggerating the difference between them.

We do need more depth on the blueline. You fix that by getting rid of the players who aren't worth their contracts at their current roles (Yamamoto/Foegele/Kulak) rather than the best performing Oilers dman in the playoffs since Pronger.

 

[AM]

With all due respect, you're not watching Bouchard closely enough if you think he's just a PP merchant. He drives offense at a really high level at even strength and his defense has improved significantly since the Ekholm acquisition. Yes, Ekholm has something to do with that but this is a guy that is blossoming into a really good overall Dman.

I would wager that he has very significant trade value should the Oilers be dumb enough to trade him. He has to prove that he can do this for a few more years before he establishes himself but the arrows are pointing way up.

I agree, there’s lots of good indicators. Just like Yamamoto a couple years back.

 

[Stoneman89]

Haven't seen a lot of Bouch jerseys, but I suspect sales are picking up a bit.

 

[McSuper]

Don't see an open player discussion thread so I'll start one myself. I know he can be frustrating to watch sometimes with his defensive brainfarts but he is absolutely killing it offensively in his rookie season. This is a player worth the patience and worth investing in. He's valuable even if the defense never comes along and if he can become even league average defensively he's gonna be a force.

Turning into a stud right before our eyes.

I am awaiting my crow feeding as I wanted to trade him earlier this season. Will I be the only one to admit it is the question.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

I love Bouchard put 7 million on a long term contract is quite steep for the sample size that we have, he is just finishing his ELC. Before the TDL I guarantee nobody would have considered anywhere close to that.

Quinn Hughes was drafted 3 spots before Bouchard, made the NHL his in his 1st year. Was a Calder finalist, only losing to Makar and is at least in Norris conversations. He is signed at 7.85 million.

He is not that player yet. He needs to be paired with the right defenseman to succeed, whereas the comparables in this price range are the guys you pair a Bouchard with, if that makes sense.

Its all moot anyways, Oilers don't have the space to sign a 7 million dollar deal. It has to be a bridge deal unless we can offload our a few contracts and we all know that is easier said than done.

When I look at our back end we need depth. We can not even afford to sit Vinny d to the bench right now due to lack of depth.

Hughes played 5 games in the NHL his first year after being drafted

Bouchard played 7 games in the NHL his first year after being drafted

 

[JustNapalmIt]

He’s playing, uh, not so good tonight.
Might be about the worst defensive game I have ever seen a decent NHL D man play.

 

[harpoon]

He’s playing, uh, not so good tonight.
Might be about the worst defensive game I have ever seen a decent NHL D man play.

And that’s the thing. People saying Bouchard ‘deserves’ 7-8 million just aren’t being realistic imo. He’s tightened up his defensive game a bit since Ekholm came over but it’s hasn’t been long since he was an absolute nightmare in his own zone. He completely reverted to that scattered own zone play tonight. He certainly wasn’t alone, but that was a terrible performance.

 

[JustNapalmIt]

And that’s the thing. People saying Bouchard ‘deserves’ 7-8 million just aren’t being realistic imo. He’s tightened up his defensive game a bit since Ekholm came over but it’s hasn’t been long since he was an absolute nightmare in his own zone. He completely reverted to that scattered own zone play tonight. He certainly wasn’t alone, but that was a terrible performance.

I don’t hate the guy. You take the good with the bad.
But seriously. That was the worst f’ing display I have ever seen an NHL Dman play.

 

[harpoon]

I don’t hate the guy. You take the good with the bad.
But seriously. That was the worst f’ing display I have ever seen an NHL Dman play.

I dunno man. Did you see Ceci?

 

[Gunnersaurus Rex]

Quite honestly, I can't stand this player. Terrible defensively. Always cheating for offense and bolts the zone too soon. No urgency in his game. It doesn't take an offensive wizard to play point on that PP. He benefits greatly from that and thus his stats are inflated.

 

[bobbythebrain]

I don’t hate the guy. You take the good with the bad.
But seriously. That was the worst f’ing display I have ever seen an NHL Dman play.

Lmao. Talk about bs. Darnell was definitely worse this game

 

[JustNapalmIt]

Lmao. Talk about bs. Darnell was definitely worse this game

Not a f'in chance. Not even close. Seriously, watch. Start by watching the disallowed goal. It is comical what Bouchard does there. Its so him.
I dont even give a shit about the one where he fell. Shit happens.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Not a f'in chance. Not even close. Seriously, watch. Start by watching the disallowed goal. It is comical what Bouchard does there. Its so him.
I dont even give a shit about the one where he fell. Shit happens.

Well then you have blinders on. Bouchard played bad on some coverage. 100%

Nurse however was blowing coverage and throwing the puck away with needless lazer and suacer passes.

You're taking a couple absolutely horrible defensive reads by Bouch and saying they trump the countless and headscratching decisions Darnell made all nite. Simply not true

 

[dustrock]

Would not at all be shocked if Bouch got his bell rung by the cross-check. He was fantastic last game and horrible last night after the cross-check, even if he wasn't hurt, I think it got in his head.

 

[LTIR]

Quinn Hughes also needs to be "paired with the right defenseman to succeed" as well (look at how much he was flamed by Canucks fans during the lockout season). And for the record Bouchard has done great with every defenseman he's been paired with except Brett Kulak (who needs to be traded away regardless of whether Bouchard gets a LTD or a bridge). Even when paired with a fellow rookie in Broberg they were killing it. People give credit to Ekholm for taking his game to the next level and rightfully so, but the reality is he was already playing great prior to the trade and his "struggles" were largely Kulak related, just as Nurse's "struggles" were largely Ceci related.

Bouchard also actually produced at a similar pace to Hughes at even strength for the past 2 seasons, the difference in totals between them the past 2 seasons was mostly powerplay related and the second Bouchard and the team was finally unshackled of the dead weight that was Tyson Barrie, he started producing at a point per game pace just like Hughes and the team started doing better across the board. While the Oilers powerplay is historic, it's not as if Hughes is working with chumps over in Vancouver with Petterson/Miller/Boeser etc. Now of course Hughes has a larger sample size and therefore should command a bigger salary but I think you're greatly overexaggerating the difference between them.

We do need more depth on the blueline. You fix that by getting rid of the players who aren't worth their contracts at their current roles (Yamamoto/Foegele/Kulak) rather than the best performing Oilers dman in the playoffs since Pronger.

There is a lot more to a Dman than offense. Hughes is a lot more complete than Bouchard who is defensively not a top 4 Dman yet.

Best performing since Pronger is a huge reach . The man is a minus player if that means anything..Eye test doesn't pass...he is not an upgrade over Kulak defensively ..

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Lmao one bad game and he’s in the doghouse with some people.

 

[JustNapalmIt]

Lmao one bad game and he’s in the doghouse with some people.

Is this satire?

Well then you have blinders on. Bouchard played bad on some coverage. 100%

Nurse however was blowing coverage and throwing the puck away with needless lazer and suacer passes.

You're taking a couple absolutely horrible defensive reads by Bouch and saying they trump the countless and headscratching decisions Darnell made all nite. Simply not true

You are waaaay off on this.
Bouchard made a ton of bad reads. But that was not even the most egregious. It was his total lack of effort on the disallowed goal and then is comically bad effort on I think it was the fifth goal.
Beyond that, he was OK.

 

[JustNapalmIt]

Would not at all be shocked if Bouch got his bell rung by the cross-check. He was fantastic last game and horrible last night after the cross-check, even if he wasn't hurt, I think it got in his head.

That could be. Cause he looked even less engaged defensively than normal.

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

The degree to which you guys will go to smear campaign a young defenseman who has 14 points in 9 playoff games is beyond absurd. A Yakupov level defensive forward who produces like that would still be a hugely positive asset, let alone a dman whose not as bad defensively as you guys are making him out to be. It's one game. Literally every single Oiler involved in last night's game was shit from McDrai to the assistant coaches, but yeah lets point our fingers at Bouchard (and to a lesser extent Nurse).

I'm holding my Bouchard stocks to the moon. He's 2019 Tesla and those of you flaming him and advocating to trade him are the ones who sold during the 2020 COVID crash.

 

[bobbythebrain]

That could be. Cause he looked even less engaged defensively than normal.

Your posts are the only thing bad. He's been very good all over the ice since Ekholm, and in these playoffs. Yesterday was a bad game tho

Acting like he hasn't been engaged regularly and several times these playoffs is just flat out lying and i guarantee you can't find proof otherwise

 

[LTIR]

Lmao one bad game and he’s in the doghouse with some people.

One good offensive game and we put him on the iron throne as well..
It's just some fans and knee jerks.

Most here have been even keel .. Bouchard has his warts but is also very promising.

He isn't Desharnais bad but he is no Pronger either.

He will be bridged for under 5Mil