Olympics: Enjoy it, Canadian fans, while we can...

[JackSlater]

I believe that was the point I was making... and churning out 5 of the Top 10 prospects is the least I'm expecting, given the resources this country puts into it...being in the drivers seat to win the Olympics once every 4 years while ignoring all the others besides the WJHC is a flawed strategy imo.

I'd like the CHL to rework its sched. so that the U18 team is a little better prepared and manned for the April tournament...this would then filter up to the U20 team. Can't do much about the NHL cradle-robbing practices of junior players...it is what it is...

And of course you've read enough of my posts to know what I think of HC's approach to the WHC..and that needs to be reworked....

but I loved HC's record from 2002-09 on all levels. from 2010-present day not so much when you look at the big picture. There are just too many tournaments without a medal.. and HC needs to start answering for that.

As long as Canada is producing great players, the important results will generally take care of themselves. That has been demonstrated over time. Hockey in Canada historically has been about producing great players as opposed to winning tournaments, and fortunately the former often leads to the latter. If they start talking about rearranging league schedules just to win some tournament the IIHF puts on, I would have a problem with that.

It would be great if Canada won every tournament, but I think it's more important to focus on the players coming out of the system. Just because the IIHF puts on a tournament doesn't mean it's overly important. Hockey Canada has issues with some of their personnel, but I would not support large changes to the system just to achieve better results in tournaments that are organized in a way that limits Canada.

 

[1Gold Standard]

As long as Canada is producing great players, the important results will generally take care of themselves. That has been demonstrated over time. Hockey in Canada historically has been about producing great players as opposed to winning tournaments, and fortunately the former often leads to the latter. If they start talking about rearranging league schedules just to win some tournament the IIHF puts on, I would have a problem with that.

It would be great if Canada won every tournament, but I think it's more important to focus on the players coming out of the system. Just because the IIHF puts on a tournament doesn't mean it's overly important. Hockey Canada has issues with some of their personnel, but I would not support large changes to the system just to achieve better results in tournaments that are organized in a way that limits Canada.

I'm not talking about a complete overhaul, but just some minor adjustments, start the CHL season a bit sooner, play a few less games, incorporate a little bit more practice time. A better balance is what I want... I don't think the CHL operating like a mini NHL will prove to be the best developmental model going forward. There's no need to be playing 68 and 72 game scheds. 58 games for junior players is more than plenty + with a couple of breaks worked in for more practice time, off-ice training, NT development programs, i.e. the Subway Series.

 

[DethOfDragnz]

It is true that Canada will not stay dominant forever but I think if a country like Sweden with roughly 5 million people in it can be a World contender then Canada will too. USA has gained so much momentum since the 1990s it is crazy. I think the 90s is where they really started stepping up making it to the finals of the 1991 Canada Cup, winning the 1996 World Cup Of Hockey. They have just got better and better every year every decade. However I think if Canada could stay competitive with the Russian juggernaut (140 million people) who are hockey crazy like we are, we should be able to be competitive in hockey with the USA. The Gap will close more but I think Canada will still be seen as a potential threat to win most hockey tournaments and championships even a few decades into the future. It'll be a little more of a coin flip between Canada, Usa, Russia, and Sweden but I do not see these 4 teams losing their stature as the 4 most dominant countries in hockey.

 

[JackSlater]

It is true that Canada will not stay dominant forever but I think if a country like Sweden with roughly 5 million people in it can be a World contender then Canada will too. USA has gained so much momentum since the 1990s it is crazy. I think the 90s is where they really started stepping up making it to the finals of the 1991 Canada Cup, winning the 1996 World Cup Of Hockey. They have just got better and better every year every decade. However I think if Canada could stay competitive with the Russian juggernaut (140 million people) who are hockey crazy like we are, we should be able to be competitive in hockey with the USA. The Gap will close more but I think Canada will still be seen as a potential threat to win most hockey tournaments and championships even a few decades into the future. It'll be a little more of a coin flip between Canada, Usa, Russia, and Sweden but I do not see these 4 teams losing their stature as the 4 most dominant countries in hockey.

I don't think that USA is better now than in the mid 1990s. Better depth overall and trending in a positive direction though.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

It is true that Canada will not stay dominant forever but I think if a country like Sweden with roughly 5 million people in it can be a World contender then Canada will too. USA has gained so much momentum since the 1990s it is crazy. I think the 90s is where they really started stepping up making it to the finals of the 1991 Canada Cup, winning the 1996 World Cup Of Hockey. They have just got better and better every year every decade. However I think if Canada could stay competitive with the Russian juggernaut (140 million people) who are hockey crazy like we are, we should be able to be competitive in hockey with the USA. The Gap will close more but I think Canada will still be seen as a potential threat to win most hockey tournaments and championships even a few decades into the future. It'll be a little more of a coin flip between Canada, Usa, Russia, and Sweden but I do not see these 4 teams losing their stature as the 4 most dominant countries in hockey.

I don't think that USA is better now than in the mid 1990s. Better depth overall and trending in a positive direction though.

I agree with JS, DOD. And a lot of your post is off base.

 

[Get North]

I honestly see us winning for a long time and I mean 10 years from now because it's like every year a very talented Canadian is getting drafted. RNH, MacKinnon, Sam Reinhart/Ekblad, McDavid, Day/Chychurn. That's excluding all of the other great Canadian talents in each draft. Every Olympics you can inject a couple other great hockey players into the roster, it's great and eventually a talent like Crosby will break out then here we go again.

 

[YMCMBYOLO]

As long as Canada is producing great players, the important results will generally take care of themselves. That has been demonstrated over time. Hockey in Canada historically has been about producing great players as opposed to winning tournaments, and fortunately the former often leads to the latter. If they start talking about rearranging league schedules just to win some tournament the IIHF puts on, I would have a problem with that.

It would be great if Canada won every tournament, but I think it's more important to focus on the players coming out of the system. Just because the IIHF puts on a tournament doesn't mean it's overly important. Hockey Canada has issues with some of their personnel, but I would not support large changes to the system just to achieve better results in tournaments that are organized in a way that limits Canada.

're you talking about the CHL or NHL? I would love it if the NHL started a bit later/ended earlier if therewere NT training camps.

 

[Urbanskog]

It is true that Canada will not stay dominant forever but I think if a country like Sweden with roughly 5 million people in it can be a World contender then Canada will too. USA has gained so much momentum since the 1990s it is crazy. I think the 90s is where they really started stepping up making it to the finals of the 1991 Canada Cup, winning the 1996 World Cup Of Hockey. They have just got better and better every year every decade. However I think if Canada could stay competitive with the Russian juggernaut (140 million people) who are hockey crazy like we are, we should be able to be competitive in hockey with the USA. The Gap will close more but I think Canada will still be seen as a potential threat to win most hockey tournaments and championships even a few decades into the future. It'll be a little more of a coin flip between Canada, Usa, Russia, and Sweden but I do not see these 4 teams losing their stature as the 4 most dominant countries in hockey.

Excuse me?

 

[JackSlater]

're you talking about the chl or nhl? I would love it if the nhl started a bit later/ended earlier if therewere nt training camps.

chl.

 

[xxxx]

Excuse me?

Yeah.

The population in Sweden is 9.6 milion. Finland has 5.4, the Czech republic 10.5, Slovakia 5.4, and Switzerland 8.

 

[Frank the Tank]

What I enjoy the most about the Sochi gold medal victory is that it was the bullet that killed all the lingering Canadian Olympic criticisms:

• Canada can't win on "true" European ice dimensions (because those few less feet in Salt Lake City really would have been the difference, but I digress...)
• Canada can't win in outside of North America (not only did we win, but we won in Russia)
• Canada can't go undefeated to win the Olympics, needs lucky match-ups to win, etc... (how about never trailing in a game en route to gold?)

 

[JackSlater]

What I enjoy the most about the Sochi gold medal victory is that it was the bullet that killed all the lingering Canadian Olympic criticisms:

• Canada can't win on "true" European ice dimensions (because those few less feet in Salt Lake City really would have been the difference, but I digress...)
• Canada can't win in outside of North America (not only did we win, but we won in Russia)
• Canada can't go undefeated to win the Olympics, needs lucky match-ups to win, etc... (how about never trailing in a game en route to gold?)

Too bad Canada needs Canadian referees to win.

 

[The Bad Guy*]

Too bad Canada needs Canadian referees to win.

Nah, that isn't the biggest problem.You forgot Canada didn't score enough goals, did not win every game 8-1, not dominant enough for them.

Doubled everyone in shots, never trailed for a second, and shutout both opponents in the semi and final game. But it wasn't a convincing performance, not enough goals, that is all that matters.

We still have a lot to prove.

 

[helax]

A lot of self distance in this thread

We all know you guys are good, although if one player has a bad day or vice versa the final stand can shift a lot (Belarus 2002....). The top five teams are good, they can all win, it all depends on the how the team handels the ups and down during the tournaments and to some level injuries.

Canada will always be a force, i just hope we can beat you from time to time, just so we can wipe of the smile on your faces on this borad

XOXO

 

[Jonimaus]

Canada has close to 10x as many hockey players as Sweden. It has more than every country in the world combined except USA.

Canada will always be number 1, simply due to numbers. Not taking anything away from Canada. The only other country which cares even close to as much about hockey as Canada is Finland, and Canada has 6x Finlands population.

 

[The Bad Guy*]

I don't think the numbers thing plays out as completely as people think it does.

I'm sure Brazil has more football players then pretty much any other country in the world but they hardly are the best all the time.

 

[Jonimaus]

I don't think the numbers thing plays out as completely as people think it does.

I'm sure Brazil has more football players then pretty much any other country in the world but they hardly are the best all the time.

But they have rivals. The only country which comes close to having as many hockey players is USA.

In football there are many countries which has a TON of players.

 

[The Bad Guy*]

But they have rivals. The only country which comes close to having as many hockey players is USA.

In football there are many countries which has a TON of players.

Sure, but as many as them?

Brazil has a huge population and football is a sport that is like a religion there and is cheap to play, very accessible. According to the numbers game they should probably win even more often then they do.

It is not like rivals don't exist for Canada in hockey.Other countries take it seriously too and put a lot of effort and resources into being good at it,just because Canada has more players playing it does not mean they are going to be number one all the time.Numbers can't always account for dominance, you have to take into account passion and the ingenuity in development countries with lesser populations may possess from time to time.Also, hockey is a pretty tough sport to dominate just with higher amounts of skill,it is not like basketball where the elite star players are able to have control over the implement of play(the basketball) for much longer periods of time and are able to have play time for much longer, there are no 45 second shifts in basketball,the stars have the ball a lot and don't come up against obstacles like a 6 foot stick trying to take it away from them . Even a superior goaltender like a Hasek can even the odds out in a sport like hockey such as they cannot do in football or basketball for example.

Just look at the last olympics in which Canada played, game dominance such as the latvia game but a 2-1 win basically on the shoulders of the Latvian goalie and collapse defense.In terms of control of play Canada should probably have won by 3-4 goals but the goalie and nature of the tactics you can employ in hockey made it a razor thin win on the scoreboard that could have gone the other way on another day. Hockey is not a sport that always lends itself to more stars=more wins as much as other sports.

It's tough to dominate in hockey even with a bigger population base.

 

[Jonimaus]

Sure, but as many as them?

Brazil has a huge population and football is a sport that is like a religion there and is cheap to play, very accessible. According to the numbers game they should probably win even more often then they do.

It is not like rivals don't exist for Canada in hockey.Other countries take it seriously too and put a lot of effort and resources into being good at it,just because Canada has more players playing it does not mean they are going to be number one all the time.Numbers can't always account for dominance, you have to take into account passion and the ingenuity in development countries with lesser populations may possess from time to time.Also, hockey is a pretty tough sport to dominate just with higher amounts of skill,it is not like basketball where the elite star players are able to have control over the implement of play(the basketball) for much longer periods of time and are able to have play time for much longer, there are no 45 second shifts in basketball,the stars have the ball a lot and don't come up against obstacles like a 6 foot stick trying to take it away from them . Even a superior goaltender like a Hasek can even the odds out in a sport like hockey such as they cannot do in football or basketball for example.

Just look at the last olympics in which Canada played, game dominance such as the latvia game but a 2-1 win basically on the shoulders of the Latvian goalie and collapse defense.In terms of control of play Canada should probably have won by 3-4 goals but the goalie and nature of the tactics you can employ in hockey made it a razor thin win on the scoreboard that could have gone the other way on another day. Hockey is not a sport that always lends itself to more stars=more wins as much as other sports.

It's tough to dominate in hockey even with a bigger population base.

No country comes close to the hockey passion if Canada.

Let's take Sweden as an example. This olympics we fielded one of the weaker teams we've ever had, and on top of that we had injuries on 2 of our best players, and we have nothing to replace them with. Canada could potentially field 3 teams with good medal shots.

Being the best is not always guaranteed gold, but Canada will always be favourites to win, and that is due to sheer number and hockey culture.

 

[The Bad Guy*]

No country comes close to the hockey passion if Canada.

Let's take Sweden as an example. This olympics we fielded one of the weaker teams we've ever had, and on top of that we had injuries on 2 of our best players, and we have nothing to replace them with. Canada could potentially field 3 teams with good medal shots.

Being the best is not always guaranteed gold, but Canada will always be favourites to win, and that is due to sheer number and hockey culture.

Canada has it's advantages there is no doubt abut that and passion is one of them.

But high passion for hockey exists elsewhere, not just in Canada and there are a lot of factors that exist in hockey that can account for wins in short tournaments,passion and numbers being only 2 of many.

It is not as simple as numbers and passion.

 

[YMCMBYOLO]

Canada has close to 10x as many hockey players as Sweden. It has more than every country in the world combined except USA.

Canada will always be number 1, simply due to numbers. Not taking anything away from Canada. The only other country which cares even close to as much about hockey as Canada is Finland, and Canada has 6x Finlands population.

Man, I gotta say, that's so weird to think of considering Canada isn't a big population country and USA has 10x the population of Canada! But yes, you are right.

 

[Urbanskog]

The only other country which cares even close to as much about hockey as Canada is Finland, and Canada has 6x Finlands population.

You have some weird obsession to harp how no one cares about hockey. What are you even still doing here, go watch the Premier League already.

 

[Jonimaus]

You have some weird obsession to harp how no one cares about hockey. What are you even still doing here, go watch the Premier League already.

Oh, I'm wrong? Can you name any of the other relevant hockey countries which has hockey as it's number 1 sport? Let alone by far?

 

[Urbanskog]

Oh, I'm wrong? Can you name any of the other relevant hockey countries which has hockey as it's number 1 sport? Let alone by far?

What is the definition of a "relevant hockey country"?

 

[Jonimaus]

What is the definition of a "relevant hockey country"?

I would say the ones that can medal without hell freezing over, so Canada, Sweden, Finland, Russia, USA, Czech, Switzerland, Slovakia. Can add Germany to the mix I guess. But we could also take the countries that regularly play in the A tournaments if you want more countries.

But I'm sure I've got 2300 posts on a hockey forum with all of them stating how no one cares about hockey.