Elias Pettersson vs. Auston Matthews

[CloutierForVezina]

I already made that same hypothetical argument.

And it's just as bad now as it was back then.

The gap between regular season Matthews vs. regular season Pettersson is small. Matthews has a clear edge in production, but not a large edge in production.

The gap between playoff Pettersson vs. playoff Matthews is large, and is large enough to close that regular season gap between them or even put Pettersson ahead.

The gap between regular season McDavid vs. regular season Pettersson is f***ing gargantuan. McDavid has such a huge edge in regular season production that nothing outside of multiple Conn Smythes and Selkes could ever hope to bridge that gap.

Let's look at D+2 and D+3 years for all 3 players, to keep it fair age-wise.

Matthews D+2: 63P in 62 GP | 2P in 7 GP
Matthews D+3: 73p in 68 GP | 6P in 6 GP
Matthews combined: 144P in 144 games played (1.00 ppg)

Pettersson D+2: 66P in 71 GP | 0P in 0 GP
Pettersson D+3: 66P in 68 GP | 18P in 15 GP
Pettersson combined: 150P in 154 games played (0.974 ppg)

McDavid D+2: 100P in 82 GP | 9P in 13 G
McDavid D+3: 108P in 82 GP | 0P in 0 GP
McDavid combined: 217P in 177 games played (1.23 ppg)

McDavid >>>>> Matthews ~= Pettersson

If you value size and goal scoring highest, take Matthews. If you value playmaking, defensive play, and playoff production highest, take Pettersson.

The only wrong choice is taking Petey or Matthews over McDavid.

 

[wreckless]

Ones humble and mature beyond his years, ones a cocky frat boy.

Ones hasn’t put on his man size / strength yet, one has.

One scores more goals, one is (arguably) more complete.

I believe currently the argument for either is very close, but will turn towards advantage Pettersson as time goes on.

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

But Pettersson scores goals at a much higher rate than Marner, so why shift to points now? So when it’s Matthews vs Pettersson it’s about goals, Marner vs Laine it’s about assists, and Marner vs Pettersson it’s total points. I’m going to have to start writing this down.

Im starting to question your ability to have a convo or understand words.

Matthews > Petey = Marner

Do you understand that?

 

[Canuck Luck]

Blues were worst team in the bubble (large in part due to goal tending) and Vegas is absolutely dominating the Canucks. Would have been over in 4 barring two amazing goal tending performances.

You're contradicting yourself by saying STL was the worst team in the bubble due to ONLY goaltending whilst discrediting Vancouver as a team saying they ONLY have goaltending. So how can STL be bad because of goaltending but VAN be bad despite goaltending?

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Vegas yes I 100% agree. They are dominating the series it is ridiculous the canucks are alive. Much credit to the canucks goal tending.

The Bruins and the caps both were amazing teams. This isn't excuses. I am merely saying it is really tough to compare playoffs as different quality of competition occcurs. That is why you compare regular season because generally all things are equal over time.

I disagree. The Canucks have had an extremely tough road to this point. The Stanley Cup champs and top team in the West and now the Knights. At least as tough and probably tougher than the Leafs opponents in prior years and obviously tougher than Columbus. And one of the main reasons they are alive is their young star in only his second season who was second in playoff scoring. I think players who step up in the playoffs are more valuable. I also prefer EP’s better two way game to Matthews as I think the all round centers become more valuable in the tight checking playoffs. No slight to Matthews though who I have ranked just behind Pettersson.
So in summary. Pettersson better defensively and a better playmaker and Matthews the better goal scorer.

 

[Canuck Luck]

I said I value goal scoring more than assists did you even read what I said? However, Laine doesn't score goals at the same rate Marner produces assists. I said it is close when both players are on their game as both have had consistency problems.

Marner produces assists at a better rate than Petey. That is why I am saying Marner is a better person to compare Petey with than Matthews as they are both playmakers.

Is Marner better than Petterssen? Point wise its an easy yes imo.

So Marner > Matthews since Matthews doesnt score goals at the same rate Marner produces assists? The arguments you keep making contradict themselves without better clarification.

To put things in perspective:
Marner over his 300 games averages to 22 goals and 69 assists per season.
Pettersson over his 139 games averages 32 goals and 55 assists per season.

If you weight goals more than assists is 10 goals worth 14 assists?

This doesn't even take into account playoff stats where Petey has as many goals and only 5 less assists than Marner in 10 less games played.

 

[CherryToke]

The Leafs would have lost to the Wild in the play-in round. There is no data to suggest otherwise.

 

[Dache]

Im starting to question your ability to have a convo or understand words.

Matthews > Petey = Marner

Do you understand that?

I never once asked about Petey and Marner. Yet I’m the one that has a hard time understanding? Your criteria to judge a player seems to be all over the map yet somehow coincides with whatever leaf player you’re talking about.

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

I never once asked about Petey and Marner. Yet I’m the one that has a hard time understanding? Your criteria to judge a player seems to be all over the map yet somehow coincides with whatever leaf player you’re talking about.

You don't have a critera. You haven't provided any points or stats.

I said Matthews = better goal scoring, points and defensive stats. Better on the draw, more take aways, better plus minus.

Petey = marginally better assists.

Your only point is he has more playoff points.

Eye test and stats test Matthews is better.

This whole discussion started when I said "Why are canucks fans obsessed with comparing Petey to Matthews."

I suggest comparing him to Marner who is a more similar player and more similar stats. Both small and undersized. Marner is the better playmaker and petey is the better goal scorer. I'd have them tied or Petey slightly ahead.

Now make a point and prove me wrong. You just nit pick dumb stuff and can't prove a point without whining about someone.

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

So Marner > Matthews since Matthews doesnt score goals at the same rate Marner produces assists? The arguments you keep making contradict themselves without better clarification.

To put things in perspective:
Marner over his 300 games averages to 22 goals and 69 assists per season.
Pettersson over his 139 games averages 32 goals and 55 assists per season.

If you weight goals more than assists is 10 goals worth 14 assists?

This doesn't even take into account playoff stats where Petey has as many goals and only 5 less assists than Marner in 10 less games played.

There ya go you found a player that is more comparable than Matthews. Congratulations it's starting to click!

 

[WetcoastOrca]

There ya go you found a player that is more comparable than Matthews. Congratulations it's starting to click!

Agreed. I’d have it:
Pettersson>Matthews>>Marner

 

[Dache]

You don't have a critera. You haven't provided any points or stats.

I said Matthews = better goal scoring, points and defensive stats. Better on the draw, more take aways, better plus minus.

Petey = marginally better assists.

Your only point is he has more playoff points.

Eye test and stats test Matthews is better.

This whole discussion started when I said "Why are canucks fans obsessed with comparing Petey to Matthews."

I suggest comparing him to Marner who is a more similar player and more similar stats. Both small and undersized. Marner is the better playmaker and petey is the better goal scorer. I'd have them tied or Petey slightly ahead.

Now make a point and prove me wrong. You just nit pick dumb stuff and can't prove a point without whining about someone.

No this conversation started when you said you value goal scorers more than playmakers. Something that changed as you were avoiding when I asked you if that mean Laine > Marner. You are right that you were the one complaining about fans of other teams, yet somehow you’re telling me I’m wining? Maybe you mean to say winning.

 

[Canuck Luck]

There ya go you found a player that is more comparable than Matthews. Congratulations it's starting to click!

What does this have anything to do with what I posted? Starting to click? Lol that’s my 2nd response to one of your posts and your first response to one of mine. Do you even read what you or anyone posts?

 

[SillyRabbit]

I view them as being in the same tier right now.

However, Pettersson is over two years younger.

Pettersson now vs the Matthews of two years ago would be Pettersson in a landslide.

I would put good money on Pettersson in two years being clearly better than Matthews currently.

So I would take Pettersson going forward, because I think he has more room to improve as a player.

 

[BB06]

@Papi 4 Hart Where's Matthews?

 

[JAK]

only 52 Leafs fans voted in this poll?

Sounds likes lots of Leafs fans are voting as neutral here.

 

[bobholly39]

only 52 Leafs fans voted in this poll?

Sounds likes lots of Leafs fans are voting as neutral here.

I know what the hell

Close to 100 Canuck fans voted but only 50 Leaf fans? Thats the most shocking part of results to me lol

You'd think there would be so many more Leaf fans

 

[Dion TheFluff]

I view them as being in the same tier right now.

However, Pettersson is over two years younger.

Pettersson now vs the Matthews of two years ago would be Pettersson in a landslide.

I would put good money on Pettersson in two years being clearly better than Matthews currently.

So I would take Pettersson going forward, because I think he has more room to improve as a player.

Matthews is only 14 months older than Pettersson. Might want to check your math again.

 

[Stamkos4life]

Look, the victim gaslight doesn't work on me. don't waste the keystrokes.

Quit playing the victim card then.

 

[Stamkos4life]

You don't have a critera. You haven't provided any points or stats.

I said Matthews = better goal scoring, points and defensive stats. Better on the draw, more take aways, better plus minus.

Petey = marginally better assists.

Your only point is he has more playoff points.

Eye test and stats test Matthews is better.

This whole discussion started when I said "Why are canucks fans obsessed with comparing Petey to Matthews."

I suggest comparing him to Marner who is a more similar player and more similar stats. Both small and undersized. Marner is the better playmaker and petey is the better goal scorer. I'd have them tied or Petey slightly ahead.

Now make a point and prove me wrong. You just nit pick dumb stuff and can't prove a point without whining about someone.

Please stop. You are embarrasing leaf Nation.

 

[SotasicA]

Why do Leaf fans vote for the "neutral fan voting Matthews" option?

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Why do Leaf fans vote for the "neutral fan voting Matthews" option?

I’m not sure. Insecurity?
Poll is pretty much a tie if you take out the usual homers voting as neutrals.
Which is pretty accurate as these two are very close.

 

[Petrus]

The Leafs would have lost to the Wild in the play-in round. There is no data to suggest otherwise.

What data are you referring to that suggest “Leafs would have lost to the Wild”?

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

No this conversation started when you said you value goal scorers more than playmakers. Something that changed as you were avoiding when I asked you if that mean Laine > Marner. You are right that you were the one complaining about fans of other teams, yet somehow you’re telling me I’m wining? Maybe you mean to say winning.

Yeah but we arent comparing same points 40 goals - 20 to 40 goals 70 points - 20 goals 94 points.

Use your brain.

Once again I asked you to show me any evidence that petey is better besides one playoffs. You can't i'll just take it you are a big fan and won't let it go. It's ok this is what Leafs fans look like comparing Matthews to Mcdavid. I understand.

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

I’m not sure. Insecurity?
Poll is pretty much a tie if you take out the usual homers voting as neutrals.
Which is pretty accurate as these two are very close.

Well you can tell by the amount more of canucks fans voting why these polls are usually skewed. How many canucks fans voted neutral fan for petey?