Player Discussion Elias Pettersson Talk | Also Chiropractors, the Medical Staff, and You

[Vector]

Thank you, @Kryten.

 

[hlrsr]

I wanted to believe the issue was an injury too, but when he brought it up in the presser it really did sound like something he was hiding behind. And Tocchet didn't sound too sympathetic about it either. Ditto management.

Even take Elliot's thoughts on it a few posts above -- when analyzing his poor play, he doesn't really say anything about an injury.

It's weird watching him when he's in these slumps. It almost makes you wonder what he did before that made him so good. I buy that he doesn't show his emotions the same as other players, and it does look like he's "trying", but whether you "like" him or not, something is going on with this player mentally.

 

[Hyzer]

To me, it's almost like hes trying not to make a mistake, almost overthinking things and scared of too many options so to speak. It's getting pretty concerning at this point in time.

And my god is this thread wild. I don't think anyone hates petey but damn I don't like Petey like I dont enjoy a shitty coworker - absolutely hate to work with him but outside of work hes chill and okay to hangout with. Man's got the bag and its time to deliver now

 

[Hodgy]

Im guessing you were one of those posters.

I called it was either a hip or a knee injury.

And then the folks who said he was healthy either now down play the injury or ignore it happened completely.

I get it.

Admitting you were wrong can be really difficult for some people.

Playing for months with that injury is not a small thing.

I know you cling on some info you read about how it affects some office workers and refuse to acknowledge how different it is for a pro athlete to keep doing competetive contact sports through the injury.

I think he has had two injuries that cause significant chronic pain and that is something that has caused two of his slumps.

To think its a coincidence is driven by an agenda...

Most of the time.

I've already been over this with you and will not reiterate the points I made previously.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

There's a reason why teams conduct interviews, so they can weed out the snowflakes.

Unfortunately it seems like EP is a snowflake. Kid is a top 5 talent in the NHL, but mentally he's soft. He's honestly alot like Markus Naslund. When he's on, he's a top 5 player in the NHL, but man does he suck when his confidence is shot.

Hughes is making an impact no matter if he's producing or not, kid is mentally tough, and there's a reason he was chosen to be captain. Super disappointed in EP.

 

[Ernie]

Pettersson's Struggles:
-start to show a little bit against Philly
-theorizes that he is wired differently that Miller and Hughes; not as emotional as them
-thinks he is one of those guys that is aware of everything that is said about him and it's something he going to have to move past
-Hughes knows what matters and what doesn't
-Miller has got a lot better at "riding the line" emotionally
-Boeser has improved at remaining calm
-Friedman's constructive criticism of Pettersson is he needs to figure out how to ignore the noise

I think he's "wired differently" than most athletes, not just Hughes and Miller - we see that come out in his media interactions etc. He's very different than the type of personality you see in a pro athlete - he's got the arrogance down, but otherwise you would almost expect him to be an astrophysicist type person from his demeanour. He's not called "the alien" for nothing.

He's a special player and I think it's probably hard for the coaches to know what buttons to push. Too bad there is so much stigma around neuroatypical people, particularly in this context, because that may be the key to getting him the kind of psychological support he needs.

 

[Jay26]

I don't even care as much about the body language. It's the not pushing the play that gets me. Like I get if that's just his personality. As long as he's trying to make things happen on the ice and making use of his talent then he has every right to be who he is and exhibit whatever body language comes naturally (though good body language is generally just better, especially in a team environment). But he doesn't. His play, while intelligent and responsible, is just so vanilla offensively.

I said it last season during the playoffs: I think it's actually more simple than we all think. The guy just needs to get stronger. He's lacking confidence to impose himself out there and I honestly think something as simple as getting stronger, staying on his skates and being better able to hold on to the puck and cut to the middle and bulldoze through or around defenders would help his confidence tremendously. The floodgates would open. That's how confidence works.

I genuinely feel for him if all the noise is getting to him. It's a tough situation because it's not as if the market is being unfair either (talking in general, obviously there are always idiots out there who say terrible things). I just hope he can be assured that the entire city is pulling for him and has his back. Hell, that should be abundantly clear after the playoffs when the fans tried to get him going. Like, the market is quite aware of exactly how he's struggling (mentally) and tried to give him a pick me up.

He really doesn't have many excuses. He's just got to figure it out fast. And the organization should be helping him in any possible way they can.

 

[Peter Griffin]

Playing for months with that injury is not a small thing.

I know you cling on some info you read about how it affects some office workers and refuse to acknowledge how different it is for a pro athlete to keep doing competetive contact sports through the injury.

And yet the coach , management and the player himself don’t see it as an excuse for his poor performance, but PuckMunchkin does?

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

We want this EP40 Back!

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I've already been over this with you and will not reiterate the points I made previously.

You keep stating your uneducated opinnion on Peteys injury as a fact.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

And yet the coach , management and the player himself don’t see it as an excuse for his poor performance, but PuckMunchkin does?

Not excuse.

A Key reason.

Let me guess. You were also one of the posters who insisted he was playing healthy last season.

 

[Peter Griffin]

Not excuse.

A Key reason.

Let me guess. You were also one of the posters who insisted he was playing healthy last season.

Nope. Because every player is battling something over an 82 game schedule.

 

[sandwichbird2023]

I don't even care as much about the body language. It's the not pushing the play that gets me. Like I get if that's just his personality. As long as he's trying to make things happen on the ice and making use of his talent then he has every right to be who he is and exhibit whatever body language comes naturally (though good body language is generally just better, especially in a team environment). But he doesn't. His play, while intelligent and responsible, is just so vanilla offensively.

I said it last season during the playoffs: I think it's actually more simple than we all think. The guy just needs to get stronger. He's lacking confidence to impose himself out there and I honestly think something as simple as getting stronger, staying on his skates and being better able to hold on to the puck and cut to the middle and bulldoze through or around defenders would help his confidence tremendously. The floodgates would open. That's how confidence works.

I genuinely feel for him if all the noise is getting to him. It's a tough situation because it's not as if the market is being unfair either (talking in general, obviously there are always idiots out there who say terrible things). I just hope he can be assured that the entire city is pulling for him and has his back. Hell, that should be abundantly clear after the playoffs when the fans tried to get him going. Like, the market is quite aware of exactly how he's struggling (mentally) and tried to give him a pick me up.

He really doesn't have many excuses. He's just got to figure it out fast. And the organization should be helping him in any possible way they can.

In theory he should be much stronger than his rookie season, yet his rookie season blew away his last 50ish games, so no, the strength thing doesn't hold water imo.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

Nope.

Just ti be clear. You were not a poster who claimed he wasnt injured (or something similar)?

Because every player is battling something over an 82 game schedule.

Yup.

A fact that does not change a damn thing about the topic at hand.

 

[Kryten]

Its Lupus

 

[Jay26]

In theory he should be much stronger than his rookie season, yet his rookie season blew away his last 50ish games, so no, the strength thing doesn't hold water imo.

I'm not taking a guess here. I can see with my own eyes that he's not strong enough out there.

 

[Peter Griffin]

Yup.

A fact that does not change a damn thing about the topic at hand.

Sure it does when you consider you don’t see the majority of players, especially stars, see their production drop by over 50% for extended stretches(40 games +) for injuries that are deemed by everyone involved, to not necessitate any time off.

 

[sandwichbird2023]

During the playoffs you said occams razor is that he is not injured and almost immediately after his injury came out you were questioning it before any accompanying information was out there.

I don't have any issue with how you've phrased the bolded paragraph btw. From the beginning I've said that I don't mind people believing certain factors are more influential than others and its okay to disagree on what order those fall in.

What I have disliked are the few posters who aggressively reject any possible explanation for his play other than his mental state or perceived "effort", and then acting like a victim or pretending to be shocked when other people continue to believe there are multiple contributing factors instead of dogmatically believing there's only one cause.

As for MS, he's right up in that Bobby tier where it's borderline whether it is or isn't trolling when it comes to EP.



I'll give you credit for at least acknowledging the linemates issue which is more than others have done. It was funny watching our boards reject it during the playoffs at the same time that the Oilers were raging about one bad winger causing McDavid to go scoreless, but otherwise I haven't seen anything new in these exchanges in almost 6 months.



You're the OG of selectively ignoring parts of posts in arguments and going on a rant, as I have learned repeatedly.

Interesting that you chose to ignore that no one else he is supposed to be comparable with gets two 4th line wingers and 2nd pair d deployment, which is what he got during his slump last year.

Maybe I just missed it where in all of your detailed statistical analysis you pointed out where other 100+ point players got two 4th line wingers and second pair d deployment for half a season and kept up their 100 point pace?

As I have said from the beginning, how much his injury played into his struggles is unknown. There are other factors too. However, the dogmatic insistence that his injury was not a factor and that it's all about his perceived effort and perceived body language is meme worthy.

How else is "EP's injury had no significant impact" supposed to be interpreted other than "no leeway should be given due to injury"?

At least you're consistent in injury denial. Dogmatic insistence that the season he sat out for 56 games he wasn't injured until the minute he sat out his first game.

21-22 was a complete anomaly for the entire team and if you don't acknowledge that you're trolling. Not everyone can flip a switch like some of the team did during the Bruce bump, a lesson that every contender trying to coast through a season preparing for playoffs eventually learns.

About the linemate thing, he was briefly reunited on the lotto line at various points in the 2023-24 seasons. I seem to remember he was pretty ineffective on that line down the stretch (ie: from February onwards). He was (and still is) also very ineffective on the PP which was loaded with the team's best players.

Maybe like you said he isn't someone that can just flip the switch? But it is kind of interesting to me that his quality of linemates didn't change much last season (Kuzmenko was bad when he was here last season), yet the result is vastly different from the first half to the second half, and even the PP and lotto line couldn't pull him out of it.

To me the most logical conclusion is an injury was holding him back. I think both side agreed that something was bothering him physically, what we disagree on is how severe that injury is, and should that injury (which didn't cause him to sit out any games, not even the final game where some regulars sat out), should be a reason for him to struggle that much in the final 40ish games? Nobody knows how severe it was except Petey himself, we are all just speculating. I do believe that Petey will eventually bounce back, he is too good not to.

 

[tyhee]

...

As for MS, he's right up in that Bobby tier where it's borderline whether it is or isn't trolling when it comes to EP.

...

Disagree and criticize his views as much as you wish, but calling someone who is clearly intelligent and explains his views in rational ways a troll suggests a degree of emotion that doesn't enhance the discussion.

 

[Vector]

This thread no longer holds any value. It's gotten childish and several posters that I once had respect for have made me reconsider that take.
I want to see some introspection. If you disagree with me, please reach out via DM.

As such I will be locking this thread and there will be no successor until everyone has calmed down and shown the ability to discuss this as an adult. If this spills into other threads, which I am already seeing, I will be issuing warnings and thread bans.