Ehlers why Didnt We Trade Him

Yes, most core players would be very hard to replace that’s why they’re core players.

I question your mentioning his replaceability though. He will be replaced by someone in that his roster spot will be filled. But there is no replacement for his contributions in sight and no path to replace him is in sight. It will most likely require getting extremely lucky in the draft or dropping way down in the standings to draft top 10 several times.
 
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It’s so important they sign Nik. It gives that second line veteran leadership and scoring.

If they can sign Nik, the team relatively stays the same, and would have a great year again, next season.

Chevy - sign Ehlers please !!
I feel like there are a lot of comparisons between Trouba and Ehlers with the fanbase, in the sense that analytically they were seen as irreplaceable. I can not quote the poster, but I remember reading that the Jets should trade Byfuglien to keep Trouba, All costs. In terms of trades it was never thought that Pionk could fill Trouba's skates, or foreseen that his contract would become an albatross. Part of the equation was geography, which made Pionk feel closer to home.

Part of that equation was Kevin Hayes too, it's probable that Chevy dealt that pick to the Rangers knowing he'd get it back in a trade. But Hayes didn't fit the team, threw off it's balance. Ehlers-Hayes-Laine did not last long.

The last game I attended we were talking about favourite players, and I asked my friend's son who is your favourite, and he said Ehlers, he's the Jets best player. And you can't refute the skill level, the skating ability, or the talent to play the puck soccer style with his skates with a player like Ehlers. In that game he was the Jets best player. Talent wise he may be the Jets best player. Josh Morrissey would still get my vote. Of all the good European players the Jets have had Hedberg, Nilsson, Nilsson, Steen, I could say Ehlers is probably the best I've seen other than Selanne, who I forgot, my god (Moose, Duck).

If Ehlers chooses to move on from Winnipeg because he is ready for a change of scenery in his life, you have to wish him the best. Because unlike Trouba you know Ehlers will give his best until the very last game. And that's why Chevy didn't trade him.
 
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Heinola’s best AHL season is only 37 points, that like Chisholm good or a little better than Gwanke.

I just don’t get it. People are pining over a defenseman who is really bad defensively and offensively he is pretty meh. TThis isn’t a guy you have the team revolve around. He makes himself useful or he doesn’t. That’s on him, not the Jets.

If I’m doing his exit interview this year I start with…
View attachment 1010636
Morrissey only got 22 points on the Moose?
 
If he was good enough he would be good enough.

The idea that the Jets are just letting all this potential die on the vine while watching him for 6 years is just myth perpetuated by his draft day scouting.

He’s an offensive defenseman who the only time he looks offensive is when he is playing defense. To that point is he really even great enough offensively? I don’t see a way he will ever be as good as Pionk in that regard.

Even his AHL offense is just alright. A looking at Salomonsson and Heinola as 20 year olds Salomonsson seems to have an edge in offense leading the Moose in scoring until he got injured. Heinola wasn’t even top 3 on the Moose defense. Salomonsson’s offense isn’t even what he is known for.

Heinola’s best AHL season is only 37 points, that like Chisholm good or a little better than Gwanke.

I just don’t get it. People are pining over a defenseman who is really bad defensively and offensively he is pretty meh. TThis isn’t a guy you have the team revolve around. He makes himself useful or he doesn’t. That’s on him, not the Jets.

If I’m doing his exit interview this year I start with…
View attachment 1010636

I don't agree. I don't think that he is as bad defensively as you say and I think he is better offensively too. That doesn't mean that Jets are just letting him die on the vine. I think it has been a combination of circumstances.

His injuries came at the most inopportune times. The Jets are not just a PO team, they are a contending team. That limits their room to give rope to a struggling prospect. Heinola simply has not been a good fit on the Jets. They wanted a more physical D man so they continued to give the available opportunity to Stanley. They acquired Schenn. They also needed a D who could PK. Again, not Heinola.

I think Heinola's time has come and gone. I doubt any other team will want him, or be able to develop him at this stage of things. I expect him to go to Europe next season or the one after.

Sometimes players just slips through the cracks. The line between success and failure at this level is very fine. It doesn't take much not quite working out for a player to come down on the wrong side of that line.
 
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I think the fact Iafallo stepped up on the top line makes it easier. Where it isn't a skill guy needed to play with your two best shooters, but a greasy player. If Iafallo re-signs I think it's with an understanding he's not a 4th line player anymore.

Perfetti has taken steps to become independently good without Ehlers, so I don't think his career is hinging on Nik either. Namestnikov is holding down the spot Yager will eventually fill. If it's Vilardi replacing Ehlers, the absence doesn't look so great. You still have your top line scorers together, but with a better defensive result because of a better defensive player complementing them (I think this was a big issue). You add more size to the 2nd line. Able to grind more than scissor cycle, as Arniel described their play. Increased possession time is a possible outcome.

3rd line has a lot of options.

Barron should be re-signed, he's in his prime now. Kupari will likely get another chance to use his speed effectively.

Probably room for one rookie to have an impact, with Chibrikov, Lambert and Ford all competing around the lineup.

PP would hinge on Perfetti's growth, but if he spends his offseason training and practicing with Scheif there's a good chance he'll be ready.

I think Ehlers probable departure is going to signify a team that gets bigger and greasier, drives the net harder.

Will it be as successful as this team? Maybe not. But this team did improve by replacing Dillon in the lineup with Stanley, so that's an indication of how a team works.

That doesn't replace Ehlers, but it does get along without him.

I think the weakness in that plan goes back to 2C. Namestnikov has been adequate there with Nik and Perfetti. I'm not sure he continues to be adequate with Gabe and Perfetti.

That said, I can't be certain that Names is inadequate with Gabe and Perfetti either. He remains a question mark regardless of the Ehlers situation. What happens if he starts next season at 2C again but is even slightly less effective than he has been this year? He has been just barely adequate this year. A small regression and he is no longer adequate at all.

If we could somehow acquire a better solution at 2C, losing Ehlers becomes much less of a problem.

KC - Scheif - Iafallo
Perfetti - xxx - Vilardi
Is still a strong top 6 and maybe more balanced than what we have now. I like the top line with better defense and I like the 2nd line with more size.
 
I question your mentioning his replaceability though. He will be replaced by someone in that his roster spot will be filled. But there is no replacement for his contributions in sight and no path to replace him is in sight. It will most likely require getting extremely lucky in the draft or dropping way down in the standings to draft top 10 several times.

Everyone will be replaced eventually this is normal process and evolution in all teams. His spot & cap would be relaxed via multi ways no single way.
 
I feel like there are a lot of comparisons between Trouba and Ehlers with the fanbase, in the sense that analytically they were seen as irreplaceable. I can not quote the poster, but I remember reading that the Jets should trade Byfuglien to keep Trouba, All costs. In terms of trades it was never thought that Pionk could fill Trouba's skates, or foreseen that his contract would become an albatross. Part of the equation was geography, which made Pionk feel closer to home.

Part of that equation was Kevin Hayes too, it's probable that Chevy dealt that pick to the Rangers knowing he'd get it back in a trade. But Hayes didn't fit the team, threw off it's balance. Ehlers-Hayes-Laine did not last long.

The last game I attended we were talking about favourite players, and I asked my friend's son who is your favourite, and he said Ehlers, he's the Jets best player. And you can't refute the skill level, the skating ability, or the talent to play the puck soccer style with his skates with a player like Ehlers. In that game he was the Jets best player. Talent wise he may be the Jets best player. Josh Morrissey would still get my vote. Of all the good European players the Jets have had Hedberg, Nilsson, Nilsson, Steen, I could say Ehlers is probably the best I've seen other than Selanne, who I forgot, my god (Moose, Duck).

If chooses to move on from Winnipeg because he is ready for a change of scenery in his life, you have to wish him the best. Because unlike Trouba you know Ehlers will give his best until the very last game. And that's why Chevy didn't trade him.

I mostly like this post but there was never any sign of Trouba not giving his best in game. Long after he had made known his intention to leave Wpg he continued to play to the best of his ability. That's why NYR wanted him. He was demonstrably good.

I wondered at the link between Ehlers and Trouba but I see your point about the perceived need to keep each of them, despite the probable cost.

But the reason to trade Trouba vs keeping Ehlers to the end is the Jets ability to compete, or lack of it, at the 2 times involved. There was much less value to Trouba as an own rental at that time.
 
Everyone will be replaced eventually this is normal process and evolution in all teams. His spot & cap would be relaxed via multi ways no single way.

Sure, every spot gets filled. There is more than that to replacing though.
 
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One Ehlers.
One Ehlers.
Production-wise (over their careers), 2 Iafallos > 1 Ehlers... and Ehlers has had better linemates and usage than Iafallo for the vast majority of their careers

How about this... would you rather have a generic 60 point winger, or two generic 40 point wingers?

I sense there could be some emotional attachment to Ehlers, which would be completely normal and understanding
 
Production-wise (over their careers), 2 Iafallos > 1 Ehlers... and Ehlers has had better linemates and usage than Iafallo for the vast majority of their careers

How about this... would you rather have a generic 60 point winger, or two generic 40 point wingers?

I sense there could be some emotional attachment to Ehlers, which would be completely normal and understanding
A generic 60 point player who is capable of driving the play, or a 40 point player who is a good complimentary piece, but, isn't driving the play, but, can Pk.
Ehlers usually creates his own goals. Iafallo's last goal was from being at the net when the focus was on Connor. We also have Nino and Apple who while not as good as Iafallo can do what he does. The only players who can do what Ehlers does is Connor and Perfetti.
 
A generic 60 point player who is capable of driving the play, or a 40 point player who is a good complimentary piece, but, isn't driving the play, but, can Pk.
How do you define and measure "driving play"? Zone exits/entries?

I'm by no means anti-Ehlers and would love to see him retire as a Jet. My point is that he is replaceable, or at least his production is.

Chevy's biggest challenge is to increase the talent ceiling on the forward group. Since that's something that's largely out of his control, he's done the next best thing - increased the talent floor. If he could find two really good middle six forwards somehow, I think that the group as a whole wouldn't take as much of a step back as people think they would if Nik walks
 
Or, how about one Ehlers, one Iafallo, one Barron? I mean, the Jets can afford all three of them under the cap.
That would be ideal, but I'm working under the idea that Ehlers walks. Again, not my preference, but it's a problem that's solvable
 
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How do you define and measure "driving play"? Zone exits/entries?

I'm by no means anti-Ehlers and would love to see him retire as a Jet. My point is that he is replaceable, or at least his production is.

Chevy's biggest challenge is to increase the talent ceiling on the forward group. Since that's something that's largely our of his control, he's done the next best thing - increased the talent floor. If he could find two really good middle six forwards somehow, I think that the group as a whole wouldn't take as much of a step back as people think they would if Nik walks
Good question. Who is the focus on the other team shutting down. When Ehlers is on Perfetti and Names will always look for him instead of look for their own offense foremost.
I think Schief this year has also been defering a lot to Connor to create. In the past, Connor wasn't the driver he was the guy you pass it to and it's on and off his stick as quickly as possible as he was there to finish the play. Villardi and Iafallo will often look first to see what KC and Schief are doing before seeing if they need to create their own play. Their offense comes from doing corner work, rebounds, but, they rarely create the play.
 
Or, how about one Ehlers, one Iafallo, one Barron? I mean, the Jets can afford all three of them under the cap.
Doesn't that depend on how much Ehlers wants? I mean what you can afford if he asks for 8 is different than what you can do if he asks for 9.5.
 
This season, but not historically
I was just kidding...my spreadsheets don't calculate the Moneyball aggregate thing. I don't think that necessarily works for hockey anyway.

Would you rather have 2 Andrew Copps or 1 Mark Scheifele? 2 Seth Joneses or 1 Josh Morrissey? The points add up!
 
I was just kidding...my spreadsheets don't calculate the Moneyball aggregate thing. I don't think that necessarily works for hockey anyway.

Would you rather have 2 Andrew Copps or 1 Mark Scheifele? 2 Seth Joneses or 1 Josh Morrissey? The points add up!
Two Andrew Copps don't out-produce one Mark Schiefele by 10% historically though. How about a Brayden Schenn and Kotkaniemi?
 

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