Ehlers why Didnt We Trade Him

[kanadalainen]

Just curious…how did this become the Pionk, Samberg, Heinola thread?

A common phenomenon of lost focus of the main thread, tangents taken/developed and the inevitable devolution of the main topic to the usual smorgasbord of cold meats.

 

[Jets 31]

Just curious…how did this become the Pionk, Samberg, Heinola thread?

Here i will get it back on the subject, i like Ehlers....

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Pionk's pretty much only been good with Samberg...but they are good together. It's just that you have to always keep them together to get peak Pionk.

Samberg seems to make every partner look good.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

How long before you think Salmon is a 1RHD?

It could be 2-3 years, even 4. But DeMelo has never been a 1RHD either. Salo could fill the role much sooner paired with Morrissey. In 3-4 years he could possibly carry the pairing with a lesser partner or an aging Morrissey.

There is a lot of projection there for a player who hasn't played an NHL game yet. But I think that is what his development arc indicates.

 

[10Ducky10]

I think Salmon will be a 1RHD the season after next or the latest in 3 years.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

My guess is he will likely get one last shot next year with Schenn as a partner for a run of games.

If he doesn't do anything he's waived.

It's a shame as he plays with a lot of spunk and is good at d at the AHL level but he just doesn't have the confidence and/or ability to play that way at the NHL level.

He's at an age where he has to earn a longer leash by juat playing his game.

He's likely a player who should have been moved years ago while he still had some value.

Or given a little rope to develop. On a non-PO team he might have turned into a very good player. Jets couldn't give the rope to both Heinola and Stanley. Injuries played a role but they decided to give the rope to Stan. Heinola? No soup rope for you!

 

[Flair Hay]

Or given a little rope to develop. On a non-PO team he might have turned into a very good player. Jets couldn't give the rope to both Heinola and Stanley. Injuries played a role but they decided to give the rope to Stan. Heinola? No rope for you!

Yeah it's nothing the team has done wrong, just haven't found the right ecosystem for him to excel. Prospects don't always get that luxury though.

A 3rd pair role with Schenn next year would be a really good fit. But he will have to beat out Stanley and/or Fleury for that too. Hasn't been able to do that long with injuries and his inconsistent play.

As @voyageur has mentioned before, there is a lot of value in keeping Morrissey PK mins low over an 82+ game season, and that's not Ville's strong suit.

 

[WolfHouse]

Here i will get it back on the subject, i like Ehlers....

Aaaaand... immediately its derailed ha

 

[Hunter368]

Hoping we can resign him

 

[GNP]

Hoping we can resign him

I would think if we make a deep playoff push, and Nik plays well, he’d want to stay on team that’s first overall in the NHL.

It will all come down to money $$$, re Ehlers. I really hope the Jets can sign him, and we’re pretty much set, for our second line.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Yeah it's nothing the team has done wrong, just haven't found the right ecosystem for him to excel. Prospects don't always get that luxury though.

A 3rd pair role with Schenn next year would be a really good fit. But he will have to beat out Stanley and/or Fleury for that too. Hasn't been able to do that long with injuries and his inconsistent play.

As @voyageur has mentioned before, there is a lot of value in keeping Morrissey PK mins low over an 82+ game season, and that's not Ville's strong suit.

He doesn’t really need to beat other needs to just be a better fit. They will build the pairing around shenn. Since he will be the physical half maybe they compliment him with someone faster like fleury or Heinola.

 

[Hunter368]

I would think if we make a deep playoff push, and Nik plays well, he’d want to stay on team that’s first overall in the NHL.

It will all come down to money $$$, re Ehlers. I really hope the Jets can sign him, and we’re pretty much set, for our second line.

Agreed

I mean Ehlers is replaceable but it would take the team to adjust from his elite entries and puck control. He’s a good guy, likeable, fast, elite entries and puck control. There’s a cost to that but also replaceable if we must. We’ll see how it turns out.

 

[WolfHouse]

Im honestly not seeing what player replaces ehlers zone entries or his ability to confuse opposing D...

I dont see anyone waiting in the wings to fill his shoes... was hoping lambert but hes hot and cold

Think the jets need ehlers to help establish yager as our 2C in a year or two

 

[AnonoJet]

Agreed

I mean Ehlers is replaceable but it would take the team to adjust from his elite entries and puck control. He’s a good guy, likeable, fast, elite entries and puck control. There’s a cost to that but also replaceable if we must. We’ll see how it turns out.

Replaceable with what? That is not a huge downgrade? Free agents that would meet that criteria are not coming here.

 

[Hunter368]

Replaceable with what? That is not a huge downgrade? Free agents that would meet that criteria are not coming here.

Internal, FA, trade, all the above. I’m saying I love Ehlers but that doesn’t mean he’s worth any cap hit. Hopefully it works out.

 

[Howard Chuck]

I see both sides of the argument in heinolas case:

He hasn't really done himself any favors when he's played, outside a couple strong efforts
But
He hasn't really had a run of games to really get comfortable and work out the kinks

Then you add his terrible luck with injuries, and the fact the the Jets were hell bent on making Stanley a regular.

At the end of the day, the Jets were probably one of the worst orgs for Heinola to be in at this time.

Being a true contender the last couple of years, and having a D makeup of smaller guys and lack of physicality made it hard to add another small, non physical guy to the lineup.

I think the org was really trying to make Stanley into a schenn, but this season it became obvious that is just not him as a player.

The proof of that is, they actually went out and got the real Schenn, and when we were healthy, Stan was out.

I think playoffs are going to reinforce that Stanley will never be what the org wanted him to be, and maybe, JUST MAYBE, the org will start fresh in TC with a plan to play Ville and Luke together.

In the end, it will be up to Heinola to make that last chance count. He's going to have to train like he never has before and finally show the promise that made him a first round draft puck.

Great post. I agree.

 

[10Ducky10]

Im honestly not seeing what player replaces ehlers zone entries or his ability to confuse opposing D...

I dont see anyone waiting in the wings to fill his shoes... was hoping lambert but hes hot and cold

Think the jets need ehlers to help establish yager as our 2C in a year or two

I think we leave the first line as it is now and have...
Perfetti Volare Ehlers
Nino Lowry Tanev
Names Barron Apples

I remember reading Oilers' fans saying they were glad Volare and Iafallo were moving out of the division because they were so hard to play against in the playoffs when they were with LA.

JMo DD
Sammy Pionk
Fleury/Stan Schenn

 

[GNP]

Think the jets need ehlers to help establish yager as our 2C in a year or two

Agree with this, as Ehlers provides a good veteran presence for Perfetti, and will be good for Yager down the road.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Agreed

I mean Ehlers is replaceable but it would take the team to adjust from his elite entries and puck control. He’s a good guy, likeable, fast, elite entries and puck control. There’s a cost to that but also replaceable if we must. We’ll see how it turns out.

Ultimately everybody is replaceable but replacing Ehlers won't be easy. Might take years.

 

[Hunter368]

Ultimately everybody is replaceable but replacing Ehlers won't be easy. Might take years.

Yes, most core players would be very hard to replace that’s why they’re core players.

 

[Gm0ney]

Yes, most core players would be very hard to replace that’s why they’re core players.

The Jets can't trade him for his own replacement like they were able to do with Laine, PLD and Trouba.

The Jets won't be able to sign an equivalent UFA because they're in Winnipeg.

So they can only replace him via the draft. And the Jets have been drafting late in the first, where it gets much harder to find a guy with Ehlers' impact.

The only thing that makes Ehlers replaceable is that he's been deployed as a secondary piece. Although having an unequivocal top line player on your 2nd line is quite an advantage in itself.

 

[Hunter368]

The Jets can't trade him for his own replacement like they were able to do with Laine, PLD and Trouba.

The Jets won't be able to sign an equivalent UFA because they're in Winnipeg.

So they can only replace him via the draft. And the Jets have been drafting late in the first, where it gets much harder to find a guy with Ehlers' impact.

The only thing that makes Ehlers replaceable is that he's been deployed as a secondary piece. Although having an unequivocal top line player on your 2nd line is quite an advantage in itself.

Don’t disagree, never said otherwise. He would be replaced over time via various ways over time and cap allocation

 

[TS Quint]

Or given a little rope to develop. On a non-PO team he might have turned into a very good player. Jets couldn't give the rope to both Heinola and Stanley. Injuries played a role but they decided to give the rope to Stan. Heinola? No soup rope for you!

If he was good enough he would be good enough.

The idea that the Jets are just letting all this potential die on the vine while watching him for 6 years is just myth perpetuated by his draft day scouting.

He’s an offensive defenseman who the only time he looks offensive is when he is playing defense. To that point is he really even great enough offensively? I don’t see a way he will ever be as good as Pionk in that regard.

Even his AHL offense is just alright. A looking at Salomonsson and Heinola as 20 year olds Salomonsson seems to have an edge in offense leading the Moose in scoring until he got injured. Heinola wasn’t even top 3 on the Moose defense. Salomonsson’s offense isn’t even what he is known for.

Heinola’s best AHL season is only 37 points, that like Chisholm good or a little better than Gwanke.

I just don’t get it. People are pining over a defenseman who is really bad defensively and offensively he is pretty meh. TThis isn’t a guy you have the team revolve around. He makes himself useful or he doesn’t. That’s on him, not the Jets.

If I’m doing his exit interview this year I start with…

 

[voyageur]

The Jets can't trade him for his own replacement like they were able to do with Laine, PLD and Trouba.

The Jets won't be able to sign an equivalent UFA because they're in Winnipeg.

So they can only replace him via the draft. And the Jets have been drafting late in the first, where it gets much harder to find a guy with Ehlers' impact.

The only thing that makes Ehlers replaceable is that he's been deployed as a secondary piece. Although having an unequivocal top line player on your 2nd line is quite an advantage in itself.

I think the fact Iafallo stepped up on the top line makes it easier. Where it isn't a skill guy needed to play with your two best shooters, but a greasy player. If Iafallo re-signs I think it's with an understanding he's not a 4th line player anymore.

Perfetti has taken steps to become independently good without Ehlers, so I don't think his career is hinging on Nik either. Namestnikov is holding down the spot Yager will eventually fill. If it's Vilardi replacing Ehlers, the absence doesn't look so great. You still have your top line scorers together, but with a better defensive result because of a better defensive player complementing them (I think this was a big issue). You add more size to the 2nd line. Able to grind more than scissor cycle, as Arniel described their play. Increased possession time is a possible outcome.

3rd line has a lot of options.

Barron should be re-signed, he's in his prime now. Kupari will likely get another chance to use his speed effectively.

Probably room for one rookie to have an impact, with Chibrikov, Lambert and Ford all competing around the lineup.

PP would hinge on Perfetti's growth, but if he spends his offseason training and practicing with Scheif there's a good chance he'll be ready.

I think Ehlers probable departure is going to signify a team that gets bigger and greasier, drives the net harder.

Will it be as successful as this team? Maybe not. But this team did improve by replacing Dillon in the lineup with Stanley, so that's an indication of how a team works.

 

[TS Quint]

hopefully they find a way to keep ehlers