Speculation: Early Predictions: Who Surprises in Training Camp/Preseason?

[RAFI BOMB]

I'll personally be surprised if he isn't traded for a 5th/6th/AHL body type return by the draft, or early next season. Something like the Jarventie trade we just saw.

New management group likely doesn't have the same patience, or fondness, as the ones that brought him in, and right now he's probably battling with 6/7 other guys for a bottom 6 role in Belleville.

Ok so you have essentially written him off then.

If I remember correctly, Staios mentioned how he was impressed with Boucher's play and the impact it had on Belleville when he went down to watch the team play. I think he very much fits the identity that Staios and Poulin are trying to build and Green is trying to coach. I am not sure what Boucher did for offseason training but there was that clip earlier this summer where he was skating with Giroux.

I know he trained in Ottawa last offseason and relied on the development staff here and housed with Jorian Donovan and spoke highly of the training he received so I won't be surprised if he did it again. If he did then Matt Nichol would likely have been overseeing his offseason training and Nichol is a highly reputable performance coach.

Boucher had also stated in his end of season interview in Belleville that he housed with Zack Ostapchuk and Tyler Kleven during the season. Kleven had mentioned last offseason, in joining Grioux to train with Tony Grecco, that he felt Grecco was really pushing him athletically and intended to train with him this offseason, which he did. Therefore there is a good chance that Boucher was doing on ice training with Giroux and Kleven this offseason so that might have also helped his development.

Additionally, with Alfredsson being hired as part of the coaching staff and residing in Ottawa, there is a chance that he made himself available to players training in Ottawa and maybe Boucher was able to do video footage review with him and pick his brain about how to think the game and how to exceed as a right winger.

It is speculation at this point but I see some scenarios that could have played out that could have had a really positive impact on his offseason development.

I think the rookie tournament will show where he is at.

 

[BondraTime]

Ok so you have essentially written him off then.

If I remember correctly, Staios mentioned how he was impressed with Boucher's play and the impact it had on Belleville when he went down to watch the team play. I think he very much fits the identity that Staios and Poulin are trying to build and Green is trying to coach. I am not sure what Boucher did for offseason training but there was that clip earlier this summer where he was skating with Giroux.

I know he trained in Ottawa last offseason and relied on the development staff here and housed with Jorian Donovan and spoke highly of the training he received so I won't be surprised if he did it again. If he did then Matt Nichol would likely have been overseeing his offseason training and Nichol is a highly reputable performance coach.

Boucher had also stated in his end of season interview in Belleville that he housed with Zack Ostapchuk and Tyler Kleven during the season. Kleven had mentioned last offseason, in joining Grioux to train with Tony Grecco, that he felt Grecco was really pushing him athletically and intended to train with him this offseason, which he did. Therefore there is a good chance that Boucher was doing on ice training with Giroux and Kleven this offseason so that might have also helped his development.

Additionally, with Alfredsson being hired as part of the coaching staff and residing in Ottawa, there is a chance that he made himself available to players training in Ottawa and maybe Boucher was able to do video footage review with him and pick his brain about how to think the game and how to exceed as a right winger.

It is speculation at this point but I see some scenarios that could have played out that could have had a really positive impact on his offseason development.

I think the rookie tournament will show where he is at.

Yeah at this point him getting a cup of coffee career would be outbatting his average, hasn't looked good anywhere since being drafted, and hasn't stayed healthy. Awful combination.

Going on the 4th year of excuses and what ifs, it's time to call it for what it is

It was questionable, at best, from the get go, and has been extremely poor at every step of the way with every new development.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

Yeah at this point him getting a cup of coffee career would be outbatting his average, hasn't looked good anywhere since being drafted, and hasn't stayed healthy. Awful combination.

Going on the 4th year of excuses and what ifs, it's time to call it for what it is

It was questionable, at best, from the get go, and has been extremely poor at every step of the way with every new development.

Agreed. It's not like injuries have derailed promising seasons. He's been underwhelming to downright bad between his injuries. Before the final write off occurs I'd like to see him stay healthy for a season, though.

To me this is his last chance. If he can't stay healthy AND contribute he's done with the Sens and will likely be out of hockey within three years.

 

[RAFI BOMB]

Yeah at this point him getting a cup of coffee career would be outbatting his average, hasn't looked good anywhere since being drafted, and hasn't stayed healthy. Awful combination.

Going on the 4th year of excuses and what ifs, it's time to call it for what it is

It was questionable, at best, from the get go, and has been extremely poor at every step of the way with every new development.

Just to be clear, what would Boucher need to demonstrate in preseason and regular season for you to change your perspective?

You suggest that it is "excuses and what ifs" and feel justified writing him off so fine. How about you clearly define the criteria of what he needs to do in terms of on ice performance which would lead you to seriously reconsider your perspective.

Define what that performance criteria looks like and in the event that he somehow meets or exceeds it then we can re-evaluate the matter.

 

[BondraTime]

Just to be clear, what would Boucher need to demonstrate in preseason and regular season for you to change your perspective?

You suggest that it is "excuses and what ifs" and feel justified writing him off so fine. How about you clearly define the criteria of what he needs to do in terms of on ice performance which would lead you to seriously reconsider your perspective.

Define what that performance criteria looks like and in the event that he somehow meets or exceeds it then we can re-evaluate the matter.

I don’t think there’s much he can realistically do to change my perspective, we have seen the kind of player he is and what he brings, a player just “getting it” doesn’t happen very often

He’d basically need to have huge developments in his vision, puck handling, decision making, among other facets, to go along with health.

I’d be pleasantly surprised if he were able to put up 25 points in the AHL while being a full time player, and that doesn’t exactly scream NHL prospect.

In preseason, there is really nothing he can do, it’s a dress rehearsal and he isn’t in a position to be proving anything, he needs to show he can become an everyday AHL player in Belleville for a season.

 

[RAFI BOMB]

I don’t think there’s much he can realistically do to change my perspective, we have seen the kind of player he is and what he brings, and it isn’t

He’d basically need to have huge developments in his vision, puck handling, decision making, among other facets, to go along with health.

I

For sake of discussion, how about point totals? We could start with preseason if you prefer. All we are doing is defining the threshold at this point.

The Senators are set to play 7 preseason games. I would think that a serious bubble player would play something like 5 games. So hypothetically, let's say he plays 5 games. What is the minimum goal, assist and point totals where you begin to think that maybe there is something to him?

I know points aren't everything and production (particularly in preseason) can be misleading and distort what a players actually ability is. But a lot of the criteria you mentioned is qualitative and as a result difficult to find consensus around. So what is the quantitative criteria for you?

You can even rank order it if you want. You can set a bare minimum threshold where you starting to think there might be something there and you can create another threshold where your confidence that there is something there is heightened.

The criteria would likely be the same for any player pushing for a roster spot, I would think. So it could be something like a preseason performance metric that could be applied to any player pushing for a roster spot.

Does this sound like a reasonable approach?

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I'm going to say Pinto and Perron.

Pinto is going remind everyone of the hype again and have people using the "1C" tag again.

Perron is going to have everyone thinking excellent savvy UFA top 6 pickup who meshes with team chemistry.

I'm excited to see Perron with this group, I think he matches our playing style and identity to a T.

I also think the conversation of training camp will be how good certain "pairs" play.

Especially on D with Sanderson-Zub and how well Chabot-Jensen look together.

 

[Oscar The Grouch]

I'll personally be surprised if he isn't traded for a 5th/6th/AHL body type return by the draft, or early next season. Something like the Jarventie trade we just saw.

New management group likely doesn't have the same patience, or fondness, as the ones that brought him in, and right now he's probably battling with 6/7 other guys for a bottom 6 role in Belleville.

So you're saying you'd be surprised if he won the Hart next season... Point made.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Boucher for Kaliyev.

 

[Laphroaig]

I'm thinking Jan Jenik could surprise. I had him pencilled in on the fourth line but I think the Cousins signing makes that unlikely. He's had decent AHL numbers and averaged over two points a game in his last year of Junior but he's 23 years old so it looks like a case of now or never.

 

[Tuna99]

yea but i mean that was wjc and chabot played on a stacked team against weak competition.

it would be nice but i think at this point it's fair to say that Chabot has no norris level to him.

I still think he could easily get to a point over the next 2 years where he gets Norris votes. I doubt he ever wins it but he has another level to get to IMO

 

[Cosmix]

Just to be clear, what would Boucher need to demonstrate in preseason and regular season for you to change your perspective?

You suggest that it is "excuses and what ifs" and feel justified writing him off so fine. How about you clearly define the criteria of what he needs to do in terms of on ice performance which would lead you to seriously reconsider your perspective.

Define what that performance criteria looks like and in the event that he somehow meets or exceeds it then we can re-evaluate the matter.

In my view Boucher will have to score some points, play a strong physical body-checking game, play his position well when the team does not have the puck, and not get injured while doing it.

He needs to prove he can play the game at the AHL level before being promoted to the Ottawa Senators. He has not done that yet so I expect t that at best he will be playing in Belleville or lower league.

 

[dumbdick]

Crooked, obviously.

AHL all star. Belleville's leading scorer.

Kid is a f***ing gem. Others are just kids.

 

[SensFactor]

+1 for Crookers, I had him ahead of Kelly last year. I think he will have a sneaky good season.

 

[Xspyrit]

I'm going with Tyler Boucher

I think he'll beat his highs in terms of games played, goals and points since being drafted. OK it's going to be in the ECHL but big surprise nonetheless

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

+1 for Crookers, I had him ahead of Kelly last year. I think he will have a sneaky good season.

He can bring more offense .. a bit more. Kelly brings everything else.
Not sure where Crooker will slot .. maybe he can push MacEwen down to and grab 13th


Boucher would not qualify as a "surprise" it would be an utter shock to see him make opening day.

He will go out and fly around and probably lay a hit or two and might even make a play but he is being sent down without question. He needs the time to define a game he can be effective at and execute it with some consistency. Who would he be replacing at this point?

I'd be pleasantly surprised if he can establish a top 9 in Belleville and show effectiveness

 

[dumbdick]

Derp

 

[Xspyrit]

Cole Reinhardt is a better prospect than Tyler Boucher outside of the fact that he's 3 years older but he has done much more at the AHL level and has shown his defensive play was good enough.

I also think that Jan Jenik and/or Xavier Bourgault figuring it out and playing NHL games is much more likely than Boucher too.

If Boucher ends up as a NHL player, it will be nothing short of a miracle at this point.

 

[Joeyjoejoe]

Boucher is gonna surprise everyone and be healthy for training camp. Beyond that I don’t know.

 

[Good in Osgoode]

Of note, Gaudette, Highmore, MacEwen & Hamonic were all teammates in Vancouver in 20-21 when Green was the HC.

As it stands now, it looks like there is basically one 4th-line spot open with multiple players fighting for that spot.
That battle is going to be interesting because you have as many as 10 players legitimately battling for that one spot.

I think Ostapchuk, Jenik & Crookshank would be considered the favorites going into camp but there is definitely going to be others out of
Gaudette, Highmore, Halliday, Bourgault, Reinhardt, Petterson, Boucher, etc. group, that will stand out in camp and then preseason.

I wonder if Gaudette & Highmore have a bit of an advantage out of that second tier, with knowing Green and what he is like as a coach.
Then again, I don't see those 2 players as 4th line kind of players.

All things considered, it is going to be interesting to see how camp unfolds with a new coach, a bunch of new players and this battle in particular.
I think it bodes well for Belleville as well as it looks like they are going to have a good team this year, with lots of depth.

 

[Golden_Jet]

I’d just like to see Boucher, have an injury free season, must be so frustrating for him.

 

[bert]

Agreed. It's not like injuries have derailed promising seasons. He's been underwhelming to downright bad between his injuries. Before the final write off occurs I'd like to see him stay healthy for a season, though.

To me this is his last chance. If he can't stay healthy AND contribute he's done with the Sens and will likely be out of hockey within three years.

I cant tell if the first bolded statement is serious. Takes time to get your rhythm when you are hurt all the time to expect a player to just fit in doesnt seem very realistic. For someone that played 40 years of hockey did you ever get injured? Adjusting to the pro game when you are never healthy for any player is not easy. My expectations are low however injuries are a real thing, he should never have been picked 10th OA but the context here is shocking.

Bouchers package is still better than players like Reinhardt he has transferable skills to the NHL level but if he never plays or is always hurt he cant develop. Totally get why people are down on him but some of these takes about what he could be are tough.

 

[bert]

Of note, Gaudette, Highmore, MacEwen & Hamonic were all teammates in Vancouver in 20-21 when Green was the HC.

As it stands now, it looks like there is basically one 4th-line spot open with multiple players fighting for that spot.
That battle is going to be interesting because you have as many as 10 players legitimately battling for that one spot.

I think Ostapchuk, Jenik & Crookshank would be considered the favorites going into camp but there is definitely going to be others out of
Gaudette, Highmore, Halliday, Bourgault, Reinhardt, Petterson, Boucher, etc. group, that will stand out in camp and then preseason.

I wonder if Gaudette & Highmore have a bit of an advantage out of that second tier, with knowing Green and what he is like as a coach.
Then again, I don't see those 2 players as 4th line kind of players.

All things considered, it is going to be interesting to see how camp unfolds with a new coach, a bunch of new players and this battle in particular.
I think it bodes well for Belleville as well as it looks like they are going to have a good team this year, with lots of depth.

So Green had all these players when the Canucks were bad and had no depth. I dont think that means they have a leg up on players other than familiarity.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

I cant tell if the first bolded statement is serious. Takes time to get your rhythm when you are hurt all the time to expect a player to just fit in doesnt seem very realistic. For someone that played 40 years of hockey did you ever get injured? Adjusting to the pro game when you are never healthy for any player is not easy. My expectations are low however injuries are a real thing, he should never have been picked 10th OA but the context here is shocking.

Bouchers package is still better than players like Reinhardt he has transferable skills to the NHL level but if he never plays or is always hurt he cant develop. Totally get why people are down on him but some of these takes about what he could be are tough.

He came into junior/college camps healthy and still was subpar. Getting injured doesn't help but it happens to literally every player at some point. Boucher has had his opportunity limited but he's done next to nothing with those chances.

Very very few players have had 18-22 age seasons like his and gone onto amount to anything. That's fact. It'd be great if he bucked thar trend but it's unlikely.

 

[Stylizer1]

Why?

Someone didn't stick with the program.