Friedman: Dylan Larkin requests trade

[dgibb10]

I mean if Desnoyers is the holdup but But would be acceptable, I don't think you'd get too many Wings fans arguing against that. If you want to recreate the ROR to St. Louis deal, But is the most apples to apples guy to Thompson to fill that spot in the trade.

As a neutral fan, Carcone, Tanev, But, a 1st and 2nd for Larkin looks totally solid to me if Utah would bite on that.

This entire argument has been wings fans refusing to accept players of Buts caliber as centerpieces. Have you missed that?

 

[Grinner]

So now Larkin is the Toyota Corolla of NHL Centers…

A Toyota is Detroit's finest?

 

[Empoleon8771]

This entire argument has been wings fans refusing to accept players of Buts caliber as centerpieces. Have you missed that?

Maybe I have but I have no clue why Wings fans would say no to that

 

[dgibb10]

Maybe I have but I have no clue why Wings fans would say no to that

Because they think they will get centerpieces of the caliber that is never traded without a trade request.

That is the whole point of what I am trying to explain to them here. That these types of assets (desnoyers) and players don't get traded.

 

[rynryn]

I truly with no snark, sarcasm, or facetiousness want Larkin to open up his list because now I'm dying of curiosity to see what his worth is.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Because they think they will get centerpieces of the caliber that is never traded without a trade request.

That is the whole point of what I am trying to explain to them here. That these types of assets (desnoyers) and players don't get traded.

Yeah I think you and I aren't in much disagreement then. If Detroit got offered Hayton, But and a 1st for Larkin, I think they'd be absolutely insane to not take that. That's a great deal for Detroit IMO.

 

[SirloinUB]

He was 44th in forward total TOI and 29th in total TOI/game.

96th in PK TOI/game this season. 98th in PK TOI/game over the last 3 seasons.

What he's doing is fine. It's the same thing O'Reilly was asked to do and he did it notably better.

I'm not saying Larkin is an "F" defensive forward. I'm just saying he's less than O'Reilly was by probably about the same as O'Reilly was less than Larkin is offensively.

Neither of these things are true.

Larkin is 97th among forwards in PK time the last 2 years. so a 3rd or 4th forward on PK2. He's also not really a great PK guy either considering his results aren't particularly good there. He is a 2nd unit PK guy on a bad PK (the red wings haven't reached an 80% PK during his entire tenure on said PK)

In terms of % of shifts starting in the dzone, that number of 13% is 116th. Nothing to sneeze at but not some crazy deployment (and about 12% over the last 5 years). Both Compher and Copp on the same team have a higher share of dzone starts over the last 5 years for detroit.

He plays almost exclusively with Lucas Raymond. Does lucas raymond suck?

Why are you guys lumping all forwards together? That’s an apples and oranges comparison.

Hockey fans know Centers have to skate more, play in the hardest areas of the ice and most importantly, have the most responsibility.

Larkin is 17th among centers in atoi. Only 3 of the 16 centers ahead of him in atoi also played more pk minutes. Only one of those 16 players, only one started more shifts in the Dzone.

 

[robbieboy3686]

Murphy's Hockey Law: Source: Ducks Pushing Hard For Larkin; McTavish 'Very Likely Involved' - The Sick Podcast

According to a well-placed source, the Anaheim Ducks are one of the teams pushing hardest to acquire the current big fish on the NHL trade market in Detroit

thesickpodcast.com

 

[SirloinUB]

I mean if Desnoyers is the holdup but But would be acceptable, I don't think you'd get too many Wings fans arguing against that. If you want to recreate the ROR to St. Louis deal, But is the most apples to apples guy to Thompson to fill that spot in the trade.

As a neutral fan, Carcone, Tanev, But, a 1st and 2nd for Larkin looks totally solid to me if Utah would bite on that.

Carcone and Tanev have no value to Detroit. But, 1st and a 2nd is a steal for a top 20 center on a fantastic contract. Even the Wild can beat that offer

 

[Empoleon8771]

Carcone and Tanev have no value to Detroit. But a 1st and a 2nd is a steal for a top 20 center on a fantastic contract. Even the Wild can beat that offer

Yes, they're contract dumps in the deal. Did you just ignore But in the deal?

Carcone, Tanev, But, a 1st and 2nd is recreating the ROR to Buffalo deal, which was Berglund, Sobotka, Thompson, a 1st and 2nd.

 

[hamzarocks]

Yes, they're contract dumps in the deal. Did you just ignore But in the deal?

Carcone, Tanev, But, a 1st and 2nd is recreating the ROR to Buffalo deal, which was Berglund, Sobotka, Thompson, a 1st and 2nd.

Id opt for Simashev instead of Butt if Im the wings but otherwise its a fair and reasonable deal

 

[SirloinUB]

Yes, they're contract dumps in the deal. Did you just ignore But in the deal?

Carcone, Tanev, But, a 1st and 2nd is recreating the ROR to Buffalo deal, which was Berglund, Sobotka, Thompson, a 1st and 2nd.

No, he is in my post. I missed placing a comma in there but (not the name this time lol) if you re-read it you will see he is in there. My bad.

For clarity I’ll repeat myself with better punctuation/formatting:

But + 1st + 2nd + dumps is a STEAL for a top 20 center

 

[Empoleon8771]

No, he is in my post. I missed placing a comma in there but if you re-read it you will see he is in there.

For clarity I’ll repeat myself with better punctuation/formatting:

But + 1st + 2nd + dumps is a STEAl for a top 20 center

I thought you meant "but a 1st and 2nd for a top 20 center is a steal", sorry I misread that

 

[SirloinUB]

I thought you meant "but a 1st and 2nd for a top 20 center is a steal", sorry I misread that

All good, I was the one who got the punctuation wrong haha

 

[Leo2Cutter]

So now Larkin is the Toyota Corolla of NHL Centers…

More like an 81 Honda

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Why are you guys lumping all forwards together? That’s an apples and oranges comparison.

Hockey fans know Centers have to skate more, play in the hardest areas of the ice and most importantly, have the most responsibility.

Larkin is 17th among centers in atoi. Only 3 of the 16 centers ahead of him in atoi also played more pk minutes. Only one of those 16 players, only one started more shifts in the Dzone.

I could swing at a hundred pitches, but if I don't hit any, I'm probably not very good.

 

[FriendlyGhost92]

I could swing at a hundred pitches, but if I don't hit any, I'm probably not very good.

Don't bother. I tried with the "Doesn't matter if I run 90 yards when I keep dropping it in the last 10" analogy and it didn't register lol.

 

[SirloinUB]

I could swing at a hundred pitches, but if I don't hit any, I'm probably not very good.

this metaphor doesn’t work.

Every position player swings at 100 pitches.

My point, is that only a few players who are asked to carry a team in all facets of the game the way Larkin is.

The more accurate version of your metaphor is Larkin getting fewer pitches to swing at (less offensive opportunities) and they’re against better pitchers (elite quality of competition).

 

[Tatar Shots]

Yes, they're contract dumps in the deal. Did you just ignore But in the deal?

Carcone, Tanev, But, a 1st and 2nd is recreating the ROR to Buffalo deal, which was Berglund, Sobotka, Thompson, a 1st and 2nd.

Along similar lines, I’d probably reluctantly agree to Hayton, Simashev, Beaudoin, a 1st and Tanev. I suspect But would not be an Yzerman target.

 

[FriendlyGhost92]

this metaphor doesn’t work.

Plenty of working things don't work if you don't want them to.

 

[FiveTacos]

Desnoyers will never be anything close to Suzuki.

To be fair, at the same age people thought *Suzuki* wasn't likely to be anything close to what he is now either.

I wouldn't take the bet, but I wouldn't say "never" either.

 

[dgibb10]

To be fair, at the same age people thought *Suzuki* wasn't likely to be anything close to what he is now either.

I wouldn't take the bet, but I wouldn't say "never" either.

Also I was comparing Suzuki to 25 year old Mike Richards, not Desnoyers.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

this metaphor doesn’t work.

Every position player swings at 100 pitches.

My point, is that only a few players who are asked to carry a team in all facets of the game the way Larkin is.

The more accurate version of your metaphor is Larkin getting fewer pitches to swing at (less offensive opportunities) and they’re against better pitchers (elite quality of competition).

What's more plausible, that his defensive game has been universally ignored the last 10 years, or that it's not as good as you're saying it is.

I'm not one to put complete blind faith in the voters, but you'd think he'd at least have 1 season where all of the stuff that you're saying is more noticed.

 

[dgibb10]

What's more plausible, that his defensive game has been universally ignored the last 10 years, or that it's not as good as you're saying it is.

I'm not one to put complete blind faith in the voters, but you'd think he'd at least have 1 season where all of the stuff that you're saying is more noticed.

You'd also think he'd give up less than 3 goals/60 5v5 while on the ice during the last half decade

 

[Empoleon8771]

Along similar lines, I’d probably reluctantly agree to Hayton, Simashev, Beaudoin, a 1st and Tanev. I suspect But would not be an Yzerman target.

I mean that's not "along similar lines", you're increasing the value of basically every piece there towards the Red Wings. Hayton is more valuable than Carcone, Beaudoin is more valuable than a 2nd and Simashev is more valuable than But. And you'd only "reluctantly" agree to that?