Player Discussion Dustin Wolf

[Ace Rimmer]

Once again the Flames did not pull out the red carpet for their young stars and once again they’ll probably lose him in FA.

They literally traded their "star" goalie to make room for him on the roster.

That carpet may not be red, but maybe a shade of crimson.

 

[Figgy44]

Wolf will definitely stay for the next contract. RFAs that have a chance to make life changing money never give that up. Harder to say beyond that, I could still see him being a tad bitter about not getting more opportunity earlier down the road. Once again the Flames did not pull out the red carpet for their young stars and once again they’ll probably lose him in FA.

They literally traded their "star" goalie to make room for him on the roster.

That carpet may not be red, but maybe a shade of crimson.

Yeah, I'm going to have to agree with @Ace Rimmer on this one. Some of the forwards and dmen I can see an argument for, but Wolf, I do not fully agree with you there was no red carpet or that it was reactionary. Markstrom was sent out. Conroy also didn't pick up obvious goalies (young, stopgap or otherwise) that could take the slot back (thus pressuring Wolf) in a sort of, "We need a back up in case you fail." We have Cooley and Ignatjew on the Wranglers, Vladar in front of him and little else. Cooley is low key perfect, not just age, potential ability, but also back ground.

Other guys like Levi/Knight/Askarov are/were in tandems where there's a young goalie with longer term commitment (ie: UPL, Bob, Saros/Vancek/Blackwood etc.). I personally would have felt better with a better back up plan to Wolf in case something happened, but Conroy hasn't done that, even if many other teams with similar young guys have been doing that. In hindsight, it quietly shows a lot more confidence in Wolf while still putting in the appropriate pieces in play to appropriately ease him in vs just straight up sink or swim that certain other goalies have had to deal with.

Negotiations take time and we know that there were rumors of a deal months before the TDL. It just so happens that rumors were that the deal also fell through. I don't believe that Wolf would be upset by that. The rumors show that Conroy and co had attempted to give him a full time NHL roster role almost half a season earlier (same time as a comparable like Levi). It just got delayed to the start of this season because of circumstances outside of Conroy's control (ie: NJD's situation/trade falling through).

I think Wolf and his family are good character individuals. I don't think they'd blame Conroy that the red carpet wasn't there earlier, especially if it could be argued that the delay was due to the red carpet being on a truck, that got caught in traffic and delivered later than expected.

IIRC, when I was looking into some of the time line for Wolf vs Saros, I think Saros got a little more earlier, but had slightly better circumstances (ie: No covid, no NJD deal fall through). However, I also think that Wolf is getting the full confidence from management a little earlier than Saros? But I think Saros always had Rinne as a fall back option for longer (which Wolf doesn't have because Vladar and Cooley).

 

[Mobiandi]

A large part of why the Flames lost Gaudreau was Treliving squeezing him under the Gio cap. Gave up precious term there with negotiations going into training camp. Then Treliving said no to a supposed 8x8 the summer before UFA.

Relationships are more often damaged in negotiations, not in ice time. If they give Wolf a good offer, he’ll stay.

Under Treliving, the Flames routinely made the mistake of treating strangers better than homegrown RFAs. Look no further than Kadri/Huberdeau being the highest paid players in Flames history before having played a single minute for us. Other ridiculous contracts like Brouwer and Neal vs squeezing guys like Bennett. Frolik for Tkachuk as mentioned

Moral of the story: look after your own first

 

[Kahvi]

IIRC, when I was looking into some of the time line for Wolf vs Saros, I think Saros got a little more earlier, but had slightly better circumstances (ie: No covid, no NJD deal fall through). However, I also think that Wolf is getting the full confidence from management a little earlier than Saros? But I think Saros always had Rinne as a fall back option for longer (which Wolf doesn't have because Vladar and Cooley).

I quickly looked at goalies like Spencer, Wallstedt, Levi, Luukkonen, and maybe some other, and the timelines from draft to continue in juniors, to first AHL games, to split time between AHL and NHL, and full-time NHL:er. Nothing really stood out, Wolf is playing where he is expected.

If there are examples of the opposite, I'd be happy to see them.

 

[Figgy44]

I quickly looked at goalies like Spencer, Wallstedt, Levi, Luukkonen, and maybe some other, and the timelines from draft to continue in juniors, to first AHL games, to split time between AHL and NHL, and full-time NHL:er. Nothing really stood out, Wolf is playing where he is expected.

If there are examples of the opposite, I'd be happy to see them.

Keep in mind that Wolf's timeline at approximately the same age, is still slightly earlier due to what happened during the pandemic. The legwork to allow him to be on the NHL roster full time started last year, probably a few months before the TDL.

Levi was rushed IMO. But I think Askarov is the concern that certain other posters have.

Wolf's current situation IMO might be closer to someone like UPL, Otter, Demko, Knight etc. situation. So as you mentioned, where he is expected, nothing super late, not sure why he'd be upset about being unnecessarily held back. As mentioned, if anything, I'd even say that management is showing they're willing to put their trust into him slightly earlier than those guys (vs late) based on the circumstances that happened from the time leading up to Wolf's drafting to current.

A large part of why the Flames lost Gaudreau was Treliving squeezing him under the Gio cap. Gave up precious term there with negotiations going into training camp. Then Treliving said no to a supposed 8x8 the summer before UFA.

Relationships are more often damaged in negotiations, not in ice time. If they give Wolf a good offer, he’ll stay.

Under Treliving, the Flames routinely made the mistake of treating strangers better than homegrown RFAs. Look no further than Kadri/Huberdeau being the highest paid players in Flames history before having played a single minute for us. Other ridiculous contracts like Brouwer and Neal vs squeezing guys like Bennett. Frolik for Tkachuk as mentioned

Moral of the story: look after your own first

Yeah I can agree to this. Until you pointed it out, I didn't realize that we could technically summarize it as management and ownership treating strangers better than home grown and loyal roster players. Once these young guys realized the loyalty wasn't reciprocated, they decided to do the same. I think the next contracts negotiated by Conroy are key in determining whether the whole thing will be a non-issue, or if this issue may continue.

I'm not saying that the situation has to turn into bending to the player like the Swayman issue, but something that feels very fair for both sides and continues to foster an excellent relationship would be key in perhaps reducing or completely eliminating the flight risk concerns.

 

[Backlund]

A large part of why the Flames lost Gaudreau was Treliving squeezing him under the Gio cap. Gave up precious term there with negotiations going into training camp. Then Treliving said no to a supposed 8x8 the summer before UFA.

Relationships are more often damaged in negotiations, not in ice time. If they give Wolf a good offer, he’ll stay.

Under Treliving, the Flames routinely made the mistake of treating strangers better than homegrown RFAs. Look no further than Kadri/Huberdeau being the highest paid players in Flames history before having played a single minute for us. Other ridiculous contracts like Brouwer and Neal vs squeezing guys like Bennett. Frolik for Tkachuk as mentioned

Moral of the story: look after your own first

That's more to do with how Treliving handled RFA negotiations vs UFA ones. He squeezed hard when he could so he had the room to spend elsewhere. He made some questionable decisions at times and some of them backfired but he had the right idea just the wrong execution.

 

[JPeeper]

A large part of why the Flames lost Gaudreau was Treliving squeezing him under the Gio cap. Gave up precious term there with negotiations going into training camp. Then Treliving said no to a supposed 8x8 the summer before UFA.

Relationships are more often damaged in negotiations, not in ice time. If they give Wolf a good offer, he’ll stay.

Under Treliving, the Flames routinely made the mistake of treating strangers better than homegrown RFAs. Look no further than Kadri/Huberdeau being the highest paid players in Flames history before having played a single minute for us. Other ridiculous contracts like Brouwer and Neal vs squeezing guys like Bennett. Frolik for Tkachuk as mentioned

Moral of the story: look after your own first

Different sport, but look at how Jerry Jones runs the Cowboys in regards to guys he drafted, he overpays all of them because he is loyal to his guys (Dak is barely a top 10 QB yet is the highest paid, Lamb getting nearly the highest for WR, the Zeke contract from years back, D-Law, etc.. One of the most popular teams in all of North American sports overpays guys out of loyalty, not to attract guys.

Then you have the Flames like you mentioned who overpay free agents like muppet ass Neal or grinder Brower, and penny pinch young studs like Gaudreau, Chucky, Bennett.

Hopefully we see Conroy look after the young guys better. I'd rather overpay Zary then chase free agents and overpay for them when they're usually just strong depth guys and not core pieces.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Zary plays one shift at C and looks better than anything we saw from Popsicle or Sharon

Hopefully Hubey is okay

For the most part I love Huska but taking this long to put Zary at C was strange.

Oops wrong thread

 

[JPeeper]

Wolf with the shutout improves his stats to:
.921 sv %
2.53 GAA
6-2-1

Flames won't be picking top 10 with Wolf in net, he's too good.

 

[super6646]

He’s a true star goalie in the making. That save he made on Stamkos was Quick-esk. Taking away the bottom of the net and leaving no angle for Stamkos. What a beast.

 

[TheAppleCorps]

Love to see a Silvertips alum doing well in the NHL. Really wish the 2019-2020 WHL season could have seen thru to completion, because that Tips team could have won a Mem Cup.

Since I have no evidence either way, I also hope he's not an absolute d-bag like that last NHL-drafted goalie to come out of Everett...

 

[Iggys Dome]

Give him 8 years x whatever he wants

 

[ESH]

Different sport, but look at how Jerry Jones runs the Cowboys in regards to guys he drafted, he overpays all of them because he is loyal to his guys (Dak is barely a top 10 QB yet is the highest paid, Lamb getting nearly the highest for WR, the Zeke contract from years back, D-Law, etc.. One of the most popular teams in all of North American sports overpays guys out of loyalty, not to attract guys.

Then you have the Flames like you mentioned who overpay free agents like muppet ass Neal or grinder Brower, and penny pinch young studs like Gaudreau, Chucky, Bennett.

Hopefully we see Conroy look after the young guys better. I'd rather overpay Zary then chase free agents and overpay for them when they're usually just strong depth guys and not core pieces.

Kind of a weird example to give, considering the Cowboys are pretty terrible right now. Overpaying their guys hasn’t brought them success

 

[JPeeper]

Kind of a weird example to give, considering the Cowboys are pretty terrible right now. Overpaying their guys hasn’t brought them success

The Cowboys are terrible for a multitude of reasons, Jerry paying his draft picks isn't one of them (ok maybe overpaying Dak, but he's only $5-10 mil overpaid in a $250+ mil cap). He paid all the O-lineman he drafted, which for a decade was a top 3 o-line. Jerry's unwillingness to spend on free agents is a huge reason why they suck, he's literally the opposite of Tre.

Then the one guy he doesn't pay this off season, Tony Pollard, leaves for Tennessee and the Cowboys run game is non-existent.

Then we got Mike McCarthy who is a D-tier coach.

 

[SI90]

Isles fan coming in peace.

I’ve followed Wolf as I do most American prospects and I’m so impressed with him and the way Calgary has let him develop. I wrote this on the main boards but I figured if share here as well.


Goalie Development Done Right!




Dustin Wolf.



We all know the old adage that the draft is a crapshoot, especially for Goalies. Most of the top goalies aren’t high draft picks but there are few exceptions.

Either way, when you draft a goalie and you map out their development path ; you dream of it being exactly what Calgary has gotten with Dustin Wolf.



I’m an avid follower of Junior hockey but particularly American Prospects. Wolf chose to play major Junior hockey in the WHL. He was dominant for 3 seasons including his draft year. He fell to the 7th round to Calgary because he was considered undersized at 6’0.



He made the 2020 World Junior for team USA. While Spencer Knight but the starter and played the bulk of the games, many including myself thought Wolf looked better when he played.



Wolf went on to win Goalie of the year in juniors before turning pro.



Hes played 3 years of Pro in the AHL where he won goalie of the year twice and league MVP!



In the offseason Calgary traded their veteran starter (Markstrom) and committed to Wolf.



At just 23 years old Wolf is off to a tremendous start in his first season as a starter for CGY. Yes, it’s early but I’m so impressed with his development path and play. He looks so poised and sound in the net. Just like he did for team USA, WHL, and the AHL.



Hard not to root for a guy like that but also hats off to the Flames for not rushing him when it might have been tempting. It’s going to be fun to watch how his career turns out.

 

[herashak]

I hope they don’t “rush” into a 7/8 year deal now though, a bridge contract with a smaller cap hit should also ease him into a #1. So he won’t have to worry about his contract like Price did

 

[Volica]

Then the one guy he doesn't pay this off season, Tony Pollard, leaves for Tennessee and the Cowboys run game is non-existent.

Then we got Mike McCarthy who is a D-tier coach.

Who could've seen old man Zeke, a dwarf and an undrafted, very average college career RB who's already on the backend of his career would turn out to be a tire fire?

 

[JPeeper]

7-2-1

GAA 2.36
SV% .925

Guy is legitimate a top goalie in the league already. Once again the Flames find gold in picking a guy who is better than his peers but gets passed on because he is undersized.

 

[Figgy44]

7-2-1

GAA 2.36
SV% .925

Guy is legitimate a top goalie in the league already. Once again the Flames find gold in picking a guy who is better than his peers but gets passed on because he is undersized.

If he develops into a legit starter, then he'd be one of two home grown legit starters the flames have developed. The other also <6'0 in Vernon.

If that happens, sign all the short undrafted goalies as free agents. They're the only home grown ones destined to succeed in Calgary.

 

[SI90]

If he develops into a legit starter, then he'd be one of two home grown legit starters the flames have developed. The other also <6'0 in Vernon.

If that happens, sign all the short undrafted goalies as free agents. They're the only home grown ones destined to succeed in Calgary.

I always forget Kipprusoff started out with SJ.

 

[sabresfan129103]

If anyone wants to see textbook goalie development it's right here. Flames did an amazing job letting him cook in the AHL. Wish more teams had this kind of patience.

 

[Bounces R Way]

If anyone wants to see textbook goalie development it's right here. Flames did an amazing job letting him cook in the AHL. Wish more teams had this kind of patience.

Comes from 30+ years of doing the wrong thing.



this is wild tho
He's already 4th all time

 

[Yepthatsme]

Comes from 30+ years of doing the wrong thing.



this is wild tho
He's already 4th all time

In all fairness, there was also some terrible luck involved in the last decade and a half. I’ll die on the hill that both Jon Gillies and especially Tyler Parsons were going to be good to very good NHL goalies until they both got absolutely ravaged by injuries. The rest… not so much.

 

[Mobiandi]

Jon Gillies sucked. A lazy Ben Bishop with worse lateral movement than Stu Skinner

 

[Yepthatsme]

Jon Gillies sucked. A lazy Ben Bishop with worse lateral movement than Stu Skinner

Multiple hip surgeries has a nasty habit of doing that