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Draft and UDFA Thread 2018-19: Part VIII (No Kakko/Hughes Talk)

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True Blue said:
Nots sure that is the right analogy. But second guessing yourself when you have the first overall pick can get you fired. Shero will be ok if he takes Hughes but Kakko turns out to be a better player. However, that does not hold true if he takes Kakko and Hughes turns out ot be better.

Frankly I believe that Hughes will be better at some point. Kakko's size allows him to be more NHL immediately ready and he may appear to be the better player for a few years. But eventually Hughes will overtake him.

And again it bears noting that neither is generational (a term used with far too much ease around these parts) but both can be franchise cornerstones.
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Well I stole that quote from another NYHF poster, so take that as you will....

I don't think I've ever made the assumption that they're generational talents. I firmly believe that they can be franchise altering. If development continues to make progress, then maybe we could have a debate on the whole generational thing later on.

What is interesting, though, is that most don't think Hughes or Kakko are generational, but still broke records in their respective leagues!! Records held by current generational talents in the NHL!!
 
Joey Bones said:
Don't trade Kreider unless you get a Hayes-like return, maybe more....
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I have the unpopular opinion of not trading him at all. Good GM's get deals done. Gorton I think can sign him at an affordable number that doesn't put the team out in Harms way. Team has plenty of room to keep him around. He is a solid guy, no antics, not a party guy, keeps himself in excellent shape.

Looking down the road, i think the Rangers could potentially give teams a really hard time containing the future top 6 of this club. They are big, can skate, and if Kakko comes to NY would have at least a pair of players that can play both a skilled game, but a heavier game as well. Kravtsov Zibanejad Buchnevich, Kreider, Kakko (maybe)...Maybe Chytil?
 
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I an not seeing the game, but Seider scorer a nice goal on a break away in Germany’s game.

I doubt he drops, but who knows...
 
Ola said:
I an not seeing the game, but Seider scorer a nice goal on a break away in Germany’s game.

I doubt he drops, but who knows...
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I love what the Bobfather said last year prior to the draft. He did a whole piece where he basically touched base on how certain players could fall and nobody believed they were there when they were. In his simplistic information he spoke about how once a certain team has "their guy" they don't stray from that. So who knows? Maybe Florida Loves Suzuki? Maybe Dallas loves Kayilev? Maybe Ott loves Tomasino or Heinola?

Plus, Seider wasn't even on most top 15's prior to this tourney. He's having a really good showing so far. That combined with the size factor probably will move him up a bit. Lots of so called "experts" have him very well in our range though.

Sportsnet (Cosentino) - #24
ESPN (Peters) - #17
The Athletic (Wheeler) - Not in his first round
ISS - #22
McKeens - #26
TSN (Button) - #30
TSN (McKenzie) - #21
 
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Lion Hound said:
I love what the Bobfather said last year prior to the draft. He did a whole piece where he basically touched base on how certain players could fall and nobody believed they were there when they were. In his simplistic information he spoke about how once a certain team has "their guy" they don't stray from that. So who knows? Maybe Florida Loves Suzuki? Maybe Dallas loves Kayilev? Maybe Ott loves Tomasino or Heinola?

Plus, Seider wasn't even on most top 15's prior to this tourney. He's having a really good showing so far. That combined with the size factor probably will move him up a bit. Lots of so called "experts" have him very well in our range though.

Sportsnet (Cosentino) - #24
ESPN (Peters) - #17
The Athletic (Wheeler) - Not in his first round
ISS - #22
McKeens - #26
TSN (Button) - #30
TSN (McKenzie) - #21
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The truth is you could have a guy who is much higher on many lists, but ends up sliding because most teams have one or two guys ahead of him (for one reason or another).

That's why it's not uncommon for a guy to be ranked 15th by a number of teams, only to find himself still sitting in the crowd as we get into the 20s.
 
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Edge said:
The truth is you could have a guy who is much higher on many lists, but ends up sliding because most teams have one or two guys ahead of him (for one reason or another).

That's why it's not uncommon for a guy to be ranked 15th by a number of teams, only to find himself still sitting in the crowd as we get into the 20s.
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My biggest issue with players falling or rising is the labeling of those players.

A reach (picked higher than expected) is always considered as a negative, while a steal (picked lower than expected) is always considered a positive.

Reach: Mark Scheifele, Chris Kreider, Filip Chytil, Tomas Hertl, Ryan Johansen, Brandon Saad, Vitali Kravtsov
Steal: Matt Puempel, Joe Veleno, Mikhail Grigorenko, Matt Finn, Lawson Crouse
 
Players I am fairly certain will be gone (1-12):
Hughes
Kakko
Turcotte
Byram
Newhook
Cozens
Dach
Podkolzin
Boldy
Caufield
Zegras
Broberg

Players that I hope will be gone, that I also think are likely to be picked before 20, but I can’t rule out that they might call a bit(13-16):
Knight
York
Söderström
Krebs

Players I hope will be there are 20:
Seider
Rees
Korzcak
Lavoie

Jack-pot for us if any of these guys goes before 20 and that I wouldn’t rule out that teams are high on:
Kaliyev
Nikolayev
Brink
Heinola
Dorofeyev
Harley
Beecher

Top 20 seems high, but you never know players:
Suzuki
Matt Robertson
Vlasic
Björnfot

There should be a good player there at 20. But I don’t think it would be horrible to either move up OR down 5-10 spots. Of course depending on who is available.

Best shot at jack-pot seem to be Seider from my POV.

Boom/bust pick is probably Brink.
 
One of the players I would love to target in the 2nd round is Patrik Puistola. A goal-scorer who seems to always find a way to get pucks in the back of the net. Had an interesting season with a better than expected production, and then showed up big in the u18s with 5 goals in 5 games. Great skater who finds open ice easily and a great shot.
 
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Amazing Kreiderman said:
My biggest issue with players falling or rising is the labeling of those players.

A reach (picked higher than expected) is always considered as a negative, while a steal (picked lower than expected) is always considered a positive.

Reach: Mark Scheifele, Chris Kreider, Filip Chytil, Tomas Hertl, Ryan Johansen, Brandon Saad, Vitali Kravtsov
Steal: Matt Puempel, Joe Veleno, Mikhail Grigorenko, Matt Finn, Lawson Crouse
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Kreider wasn't a reach at all where the Rangers took him. He could have gone 3 to 5 spots earlier easily. There was a ton of buzz about him--the thing that worried some teams was he'd only played prep school hockey but even so I was nervous that he wasn't going to reach us. I remember Montreal picking right before us and I thought for sure they'd take him but they took a French Canadian who busted. Kreider was my guy in that draft and I think there were a bunch of others here that really wanted him too.

Johansson and Saad weren't reaches either. Saad was a faller actually. He should have been a 1st rounder. Kravtsov was a mild reach if anything. When it was the Rangers turn last year it came down to three players for me Dobson, Kravtsov and Wahlstrom. I would have probably taken Dobson but I was more than happy with Kravtsov--he was picked about where he should have been.
 
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eco's bones said:
Kreider wasn't a reach at all where the Rangers took him. He could have gone 3 to 5 spots earlier easily. There was a ton of buzz about him--the thing that worried some teams was he'd only played prep school hockey but even so I was nervous that he wasn't going to reach us. I remember Montreal picking right before us and I thought for sure they'd take him but they took a French Canadian who busted. Kreider was my guy in that draft and I think there were a bunch of others here that really wanted him too.

Johansson and Saad weren't reaches either. Saad was a faller actually. He should have been a 1st rounder. Kravtsov was a mild reach if anything. When it was the Rangers turn last year it came down to three players for me Dobson, Kravtsov and Wahlstrom. I would have probably taken Dobson but I was more than happy with Kravtsov--he was picked about where he should have been.
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Saad was once viewed as a top 10, if not top 5 pick.
 
Ola said:
Players I am fairly certain will be gone (1-12):
Hughes
Kakko
Turcotte
Byram
Newhook
Cozens
Dach
Podkolzin
Boldy
Caufield
Zegras
Broberg

Players that I hope will be gone, that I also think are likely to be picked before 20, but I can’t rule out that they might call a bit(13-16):
Knight
York
Söderström
Krebs

Players I hope will be there are 20:
Seider
Rees
Korzcak
Lavoie

Jack-pot for us if any of these guys goes before 20 and that I wouldn’t rule out that teams are high on:
Kaliyev
Nikolayev
Brink
Heinola
Dorofeyev
Harley
Beecher

Top 20 seems high, but you never know players:
Suzuki
Matt Robertson
Vlasic
Björnfot

There should be a good player there at 20. But I don’t think it would be horrible to either move up OR down 5-10 spots. Of course depending on who is available.

Best shot at jack-pot seem to be Seider from my POV.

Boom/bust pick is probably Brink.
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I really don't think Seider is going to be around at 20 Ola. He was a bit of a reach to be there before the WC's--now I think there's about a 1% chance.
 
KooKooForKakko said:
You’ve sold me big time on Poulin, he’s definitely my favorite in the 20 range at the moment.
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Jamie Benn clone but he actually plays with heart. Maybe not as much upside but who knows, Benn was a 5th rounder himself
 
Amazing Kreiderman said:
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