Salary Cap: Dr Dubas Cap Thread: He wants the Nurse

[Jag68Sid87]

I know people took the things Dubas said about the defense and about hard decisions with the core as meaning that Letang will be moved, but I just don't see it.

In the playoffs, he was solid. It seems playing with a puck mover instead of a defensive type helped him. So we might decide to go in that direction moving forward. Maybe Jake Livanavage is the right partner for him. Maybe it's Owen Pickering. Maybe we make a trade for someone like Kevin Korchinski (I think there is untapped upside there). Maybe it's Owen Zellweger. Or maybe it will be Girard again for at least the start of the '26-27 season.

I think the big trio of Crosby, Malkin and Letang will all retire as Penguins. And that is probably how it should be. Maybe not all at the same time, but maybe yes. And yeah, Letang is to this trio what Jose Carreras was to the Three Tenors but whatever.

I don't think he is going anywhere, other than the third pairing (which imo is the right decision).

 

[OtherThingsILike]

I have wondered what it would be like if we went super into the puck possession game that the 2016 Penguins did. Like, if we had six puck movers on defense, what would that be like?

 

[Peat]

I still think Letang for Nurse is the deal Dubas should be going for if he’s trading for Nurse. There’s no way Edmonton pays a ton of assets to get out of Nurse’s deal with other teams (namely LA) interested in Nurse, and I don’t think it’s particularly worth adding on top of Graves to get Nurse. LA being involved basically eliminates any chance that you can get some crazy fleecing like Nurse+ for Graves.

Meanwhile I think Bowman could be blinded by Letang’s reputation and you could make the swap straight up, which IMO improves the team (Nurse is better than Letang at this point) and it makes the defense situation a lot nicer moving forward.

Urgh. Emotionally, I hate the idea of trading Letang, and honestly kinda take a level of comfort that his 10 team list probably blocks every trade...

... but this might be an exception he didn't expect and there is a case for it.

Something that gives me pause is the one big similarity between Nurse's and Letang's cards - being part of units that are outmatched from the get go. Any interest in Nurse has to come with a belief that he can be rehabilitated into an effective 2nd pairing guy but if our 2nd pairing guy has been struggling with a similar issue, how are we gonna do it? Who's gonna be the steady puck moving RHD that allows Nurse to be a but of a buccaneer? Do we want him with Harrison Brunicke?

LA, if they can sort the money, makes some sense. Doughty is still their first pairing guy and taking some tough minutes. They have a spot on their second pairing next to Brandt Clarke that's taking more offensive minutes than Doughty. They can plug Nurse in there and expect success.

I don't see that spot on the Pens. As such, I think I'm against Nurse.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Urgh. Emotionally, I hate the idea of trading Letang, and honestly kinda take a level of comfort that his 10 team list probably blocks every trade...

... but this might be an exception he didn't expect and there is a case for it.

Something that gives me pause is the one big similarity between Nurse's and Letang's cards - being part of units that are outmatched from the get go. Any interest in Nurse has to come with a belief that he can be rehabilitated into an effective 2nd pairing guy but if our 2nd pairing guy has been struggling with a similar issue, how are we gonna do it? Who's gonna be the steady puck moving RHD that allows Nurse to be a but of a buccaneer? Do we want him with Harrison Brunicke?

LA, if they can sort the money, makes some sense. Doughty is still their first pairing guy and taking some tough minutes. They have a spot on their second pairing next to Brandt Clarke that's taking more offensive minutes than Doughty. They can plug Nurse in there and expect success.

I don't see that spot on the Pens. As such, I think I'm against Nurse.

I think LA makes far more sense for Nurse because he can just slide into their 2nd pair and push either Edmundson or Dumoulin out. They’d be left with:

Anderson-Doughty
Nurse-Ceci
Dumoulin/Edmundson-Clarke

I think the most logical deal with Nurse is to LA for Edmundson/Dumoulin and picks/prospects. With the Penguins, it’s a bit more awkward of a fit and I think you’d want to trade for a guy like Kesselring to pair with Nurse. I think this defense could work really well if they’d go that route:

Wotherspoon-Karlsson
Nurse-Kesselring
Shea-Brunicke

But it does require extra moves and it’s not as straightforward as LA.

 

[Koivunsons]

I’m not really super interested in acquiring Nurse overall, but Dubas would be literally insane to say no to Letang for Nurse if that deal could work.

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Letang has been ass for years and he’s only going to get worse. Nurse had a bad year last year but he’s far younger than Letang and is significantly more likely to give you good hockey over the next 2 years than Letang.

Even if it’s just trading for Nurse to flip in 2 years or keeping Letang until he retires, it’s a complete no brainer to pick Nurse in that situation.

I think when you look at these cards you have to operate with the mindset that Nurse’s scoring effects are likely influenced by playing with McDavid and Drai.

 

[SEALBound]

Jesus, I didn't think Letang's WAR was that low year over year. I knew he wasn't great anymore but that's a bit shocking.

I feel like a Letang for Nurse swap would be similar to the Hornqvist for Matheson swap. You just absolutely cringe at it but once past it, you can see how it makes a tad bit of sense no matter how hard it is to accept.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

The team doesn't need to improve in the next 4 years. It sounds counterintuitive, but the Penguins don't have the pieces to build a contender at the moment.

So you believe the team should actively seek to add bad fits on terrible long-term deals for mediocre returns.

 

[Empoleon8771]

My Letang hot take is that he shouldn’t be put in the same category as Crosby and Malkin, and if they were willing to trade Guentzel, then they should be willing to trade Letang.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

So you believe the team should actively seek to add bad fits on terrible long-term deals for mediocre returns.

No, but the Penguins shouldn't be afraid of bad contracts at this point, especially since Nurse has only 4 years left. They don't have anyone to give that money to, and since the Penguins don't have any players who could be part of a future contending core, and won't for at least another year, Nurse's contract won't block anything.

 

[DessertPenguin]

My Letang hot take is that he shouldn’t be put in the same category as Crosby and Malkin, and if they were willing to trade Guentzel, then they should be willing to trade Letang.

If the org. is going to treat Rust as a core member and refuse to trade him despite his trade value, I don't see much chance they trade Letang unless he requests it.

 

[Peat]

My Letang hot take is that he shouldn’t be put in the same category as Crosby and Malkin, and if they were willing to trade Guentzel, then they should be willing to trade Letang.

Emotionally, Letang having been here from the beginning makes it a different story to Guentzel. But the here from the beginning comp is Flower, and they traded him.

Practically speaking, given his results vs his pay and his ability to block most teams, it's very hard to imagine a deal that moves him to the Penguins' benefit. A Nurse for Letang deal is one of the few things that maybe works, but that's still a considerable gamble that could turn out to be far worse than just letting Letang play out his contract.

 

[SEALBound]

If the org. is going to treat Rust as a core member and refuse to trade him despite his trade value, I don't see much chance they trade Letang unless he requests it.

Fair point but I think Rust is still providing a decent level of play compared to Letang.

I think Dubas's comments in the post-season presser were him saying, without saying, that he'd be willing to ship Letang out.

 

[Factorial]

Only reason to get nurse is for prospects or picks coming our way. Giving up anything of value including letang is insane to me.

I highly doubt Letang wants to go to Edm after 20 years in Pgh.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

My Letang hot take is that he shouldn’t be put in the same category as Crosby and Malkin, and if they were willing to trade Guentzel, then they should be willing to trade Letang.

That is not steeped in reality, though. Whatever we think of Letang, that is not how this organization thinks of him, or how our icons think about him.

That matters.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Fair point but I think Rust is still providing a decent level of play compared to Letang.

I think Dubas's comments in the post-season presser were him saying, without saying, that he'd be willing to ship Letang out.

I will be pleasantly surprised if his press conference had anything to do with Letang.

 

[eXile3]

Jesus, I didn't think Letang's WAR was that low year over year. I knew he wasn't great anymore but that's a bit shocking.

I feel like a Letang for Nurse swap would be similar to the Hornqvist for Matheson swap. You just absolutely cringe at it but once past it, you can see how it makes a tad bit of sense no matter how hard it is to accept.

Mike Matheson was 25. This would be like, trading for Mike Matheson now.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If the org. is going to treat Rust as a core member and refuse to trade him despite his trade value, I don't see much chance they trade Letang unless he requests it.

The Penguins are going to trade Rust in the future, though. Just because they haven’t traded him yet doesn’t mean they won’t trade him.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I rest my case....

Oh, trading the future captain is not allowed. But good luck with that.... future.

 

[Koivunsons]

My Letang hot take is that he shouldn’t be put in the same category as Crosby and Malkin, and if they were willing to trade Guentzel, then they should be willing to trade Letang.

Why? He’s the best defenseman in franchise history and has literally given his entire body to this team.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I highly doubt Letang wants to go to Edm after 20 years in Pgh.

I mean is there anything to base that on? He has 2 years left in his career and Edmonton is one of the top contenders in hockey. If Letang wants to win another cup, it would be bizarre for him to not include Edmonton as an option of him to be traded to.

He’ll have a 10 team allowable trade list starting July 1sts. We have no idea what his intentions would be with that list, but if he’s focused on winning another cup, excluding Edmonton from that list would be ridiculous.

 

[thevelvetfog]

This is what it comes down to for me. I absolutely see a scenario where Dubas is interested in Nurse. I just don’t see any scenario where his offer is the best offer for Nurse. I think Dubas would make a move for Nurse, but it’s almost definitely going to be something like the Kulak/Girard swap where the Penguins are getting assets to take on the bigger/longer contract. I can still see that happening, with something like Nurse and a 2nd for Girard feeling fair, but that’s the kind of deal I feel Dubas would be shooting for.

The fact that we can take on Nurse's full contract without sending any salary back is the best offer for Nurse.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The fact that we can take on Nurse's full contract without sending any salary back is the best offer for Nurse.

No it isn’t? What if Ken Holland is offering actual value?

 

[Ugene Magic]

Edmonton "was" a top contender.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Edm is one Mike Babcock hiring away from being the LEAST desirable destination in the league.

 

[DessertPenguin]

I mean is there anything to base that on? He has 2 years left in his career and Edmonton is one of the top contenders in hockey. If Letang wants to win another cup, it would be bizarre for him to not include Edmonton as an option of him to be traded to.

He’ll have a 10 team allowable trade list starting July 1sts. We have no idea what his intentions would be with that list, but if he’s focused on winning another cup, excluding Edmonton from that list would be ridiculous.

He's got two SCs already. Doubt his focus is on winning another. If anything Karl and not Letang is the one that will likely leave to a contender.