Do you think this team is better or worse going into next season?

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Get out of here with the positivity.

I don't think I can disagree, I like the Tanev and OEL additions, I think the defense has been upgraded significantly, I know I'm in the Minority on OEL, I think he's going to surprise people.

My only question is goaltending, can Woll get his shit together and stay healthy? If he can this team is REALLY good.

and with Haakanpaa looking like he's not a leaf, they have 1.2 million in cap space that will grow as the season goes along and if they are as good as I except them to be they will have the space to add a big piece if they want.

 

[hamzarocks]

I don't think I can disagree, I like the Tanev and OEL additions, I think the defense has been upgraded significantly, I know I'm in the Minority on OEL, I think he's going to surprise people.

My only question is goaltending, can Woll get his shit together and stay healthy? If he can this team is REALLY good.

and with Haakanpaa looking like he's not a leaf, they have 1.2 million in cap space that will grow as the season goes along and if they are as good as I except them to be they will have the space to add a big piece if they want.

Going to be tough to add a big piece without a 1st in 2025 (unless its bottom 10 at which pt we would be sellers and keeping it)

Have a 2nd and minten but that isnt a great offer for most good UFAs let alone a big piece

Cowan assumed to be off the table,

robertson untradeable if he doesnt sign this year,

knies not moved unless for a high end piece which is big LT need (1LW or 1R)

All the other prospects in the system wouldnt get much back and have to prove themselves in the AHL or juniors to up their value as of now

We most likely go smaller adds again like this TDL next year if we're a similar legel team and then reassess 2025 summer if we have space and flexability based on cowan + grebenkin tracjectories, Knies remaining upside, & Marner + Tavares signings if they do go through

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Going to be tough to add a big piece without a 1st in 2025 (unless its bottom 10 at which pt we would be sellers and keeping it)

Have a 2nd and minten but that isnt a great offer for most good UFAs let alone a big piece

Cowan assumed to be off the table,

robertson untradeable if he doesnt sign this year,

knies not moved unless for a high end piece which is big LT need (1LW or 1R)

All the other prospects in the system wouldnt get much back and have to prove themselves in the AHL or juniors to up their value as of now

We most likely go smaller adds again like this TDL next year if we're a similar legel team and then reassess 2025 summer if we have space and flexability based on cowan + grebenkin tracjectories, Knies remaining upside, & Marner + Tavares signings if they do go through

I mean this is the only year where the draft pick capital is really bad.

They still have future picks, beyond the 2025 2nd which should hold some value, They also have their 2026 1st and 3rd, and all their 2027 picks.

We have seen teams move picks 3 drafts out, Florida did it the year they added Grioux.

Toronto did it in 2023 when they added McCabe.

Just because they don't have their 2025 1st doesn't mean they couldn't add a big piece it just means they'd have to use future picks.

Will Treliving do that? who knows?

They could also add quality piece at a lower cost.

Taylor Hall or Jason Zucker come to mind.

I think both could be quality adds and I don't think either one will break the bank even at 50% retained.

Guy I will be keeping an eye on is giroux, Ullmark and Larsson.

Ullmark because I don't trust Woll to stay healthy.

Larsson would be a strong defensive add.

Giroux could be the missing piece on offense.

The dream add would be Yanni Gourde.

 

[NJG]

What's the return for Holmberg, Robertson, Jarnkrok, Kampf and Dewar? You have a lot of unproven rookies taking the spots of veterans that require waivers.

Also, Knies and McMann are top nine and I don't think McMann is a centre.

Draft picks. A lot of un proven rookies? Two is a lot? Minten can handle being a 3C or Even a 4C, plus he needs to learn from real centres and Tavares while we still have him for another year. Grebyonkin has already been playing against men for a while now and did pretty well, he has the offensive flair we're lacking right now on LW so I think he has a a good chance of making the team. Cowan don't really need to go into detail, he's a beast.

McMann was originally a centre...

 

[conFABulator]

Draft picks. A lot of un proven rookies? Two is a lot? Minten can handle being a 3C or Even a 4C, plus he needs to learn from real centres and Tavares while we still have him for another year. Grebyonkin has already been playing against men for a while now and did pretty well, he has the offensive flair we're lacking right now on LW so I think he has a a good chance of making the team. Cowan don't really need to go into detail, he's a beast.

McMann was originally a centre...

You have more than two, you defend three in your post actually. Cowan, Minten and Grebyonkin are all absolutely rookies. Yes, that is too many for a contending team to integrate into full time roles in the same year. I add A. Nylander to this list too....though technically not a rookie, he is absolutely unproven.

I am all four getting kids into the lineup and I include Robertson and Holmberg on this list. I would like to see 250 to 300 or so games shared by Robertson, Holmberg, Minten, Grebyonkin, Cowan, Nylander, and Steeves this year.

McMann at C seems like square peg and round hole. He just started to find his NHL way last year and is a big, fast winger. He should be playing wing in the top nine.

Knies Matthews Domi
XXXX Nylander Marner
XXXX Tavares McMann
Dewar Kampf Jarnkrok

The XXXX's and injury fill ins is where the kids should get their chance this year.

 

[Torontonian]

Goaltending is the same (with chance of being better then last season if Woll stays healthy)
D-core is way better then last year
Forward group is same (with chance of being a lot better with rookies/younger players taking a step such as Robertson/Knies/Cowan etc)



All in all, the team has a chance of being better then last years team due to the potential of internal improvement from the younger guys. There wasn't really any anomaly's last year apart from Matthews scoring 69 goals lol.. Other then that every forward preformed as is, or slightly under preformed.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Draft picks. A lot of un proven rookies? Two is a lot? Minten can handle being a 3C or Even a 4C, plus he needs to learn from real centres and Tavares while we still have him for another year. Grebyonkin has already been playing against men for a while now and did pretty well, he has the offensive flair we're lacking right now on LW so I think he has a a good chance of making the team. Cowan don't really need to go into detail, he's a beast.

McMann was originally a centre...

It doesn't matter if McMann was originally a center, so was William Nylander, so was Phil Kessel, that doesn't make them centers now.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

You have more than two, you defend three in your post actually. Cowan, Minten and Grebyonkin are all absolutely rookies. Yes, that is too many for a contending team to integrate into full time roles in the same year. I add A. Nylander to this list too....though technically not a rookie, he is absolutely unproven.

I am all four getting kids into the lineup and I include Robertson and Holmberg on this list. I would like to see 250 to 300 or so games shared by Robertson, Holmberg, Minten, Grebyonkin, Cowan, Nylander, and Steeves this year.

McMann at C seems like square peg and round hole. He just started to find his NHL way last year and is a big, fast winger. He should be playing wing in the top nine.

Knies Matthews Domi
XXXX Nylander Marner
XXXX Tavares McMann
Dewar Kampf Jarnkrok

The XXXX's and injury fill ins is where the kids should get their chance this year.

The square peg in the round hole is Nylander at center, it's been tried several times as recently as last year it fails EVERY time because he's not a center

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Goaltending is the same (with chance of being better then last season if Woll stays healthy)
D-core is way better then last year
Forward group is same (with chance of being a lot better with rookies/younger players taking a step such as Robertson/Knies/Cowan etc)



All in all, the team has a chance of being better then last years team due to the potential of internal improvement from the younger guys. There wasn't really any anomaly's last year apart from Matthews scoring 69 goals lol.. Other then that every forward preformed as is, or slightly under preformed.

Is that an anomaly? Are you sure? I never thought I'd see 60 again and certainly not 2 years later.

But 2 years later he did it again but this time he scored 69.

 

[Torontonian]

Is that an anomaly? Are you sure? I never thought I'd see 60 again and certainly not 2 years later.

But 2 years later he did it again but this time he scored 69.

I could see Matthews scoring 70 goals again in his career.. but I would probably pencil him in for 55g yearly.

 

[conFABulator]

The square peg in the round hole is Nylander at center, it's been tried several times as recently as last year it fails EVERY time because he's not a center

Has it been tried several times though? It has been talked about. Our new GM got here and right away said that we should try Nylander at C. It was tried for about 10 days and maybe not even any games in pre-season.

Let's see what happens with a new coach. Also Willy plays C for Sweden at performs well.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Has it been tried several times though? It has been talked about. Our new GM got here and right away said that we should try Nylander at C. It was tried for about 10 days and maybe not even any games in pre-season.

Let's see what happens with a new coach. Also Willy plays C for Sweden at performs well.

It doesn't matter what Willy plays for Sweden, he could play goal for Sweden I still wouldn't want to see him in the Leafs net.

Playing center for a couple games for Sweden isn't the same as doing it for 82 games at the NHL level.

And yes it has been tried several times by both Babcock and Keefe it never works

 

[RunItBackAgain]

It doesn't matter what Willy plays for Sweden, he could play goal for Sweden I still wouldn't want to see him in the Leafs net.

Playing center for a couple games for Sweden isn't the same as doing it for 82 games at the NHL level.

And yes it has been tried several times by both Babcock and Keefe it never works

You know what else doesn’t work? John Tavares at 2C. But if you’re excited to see another year of that then good on you.

 

[Aashir Mallik]

You know what else doesn’t work? John Tavares at 2C. But if you’re excited to see another year of that then good on you.

Don’t bother, he thinks Tavares is still a good 2C, even though reality suggests the last year and a half have really caught up to him

He literally had to play with a 120 point nylander to be ppg this season…

 

[BlackAdam]

As long as they keep playing ryan reaves, it doesn't matter.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

You know what else doesn’t work? John Tavares at 2C. But if you’re excited to see another year of that then good on you.

There is no better option at 2C.

I'd be all for making Tavares the 3C if there was another legitimate option.

There simply isn't

 

[saffronleaf]

getting worse year by year

 

[notDatsyuk]

There is no better option at 2C.

I'd be all for making Tavares the 3C if there was another legitimate option.

There simply isn't

And yet you aren't willing to even try the player who may well be a better option.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

And yet you aren't willing to even try the player who may well be a better option.

Because I know he's not because I've seen it tried by both Babcock and Keefe it never works.

He was drafted 10 years ago,if he was going to be a center in the NHL he would be by now.

 

[Captain Crunch]

You have more than two, you defend three in your post actually. Cowan, Minten and Grebyonkin are all absolutely rookies. Yes, that is too many for a contending team to integrate into full time roles in the same year. I add A. Nylander to this list too....though technically not a rookie, he is absolutely unproven.

I am all four getting kids into the lineup and I include Robertson and Holmberg on this list. I would like to see 250 to 300 or so games shared by Robertson, Holmberg, Minten, Grebyonkin, Cowan, Nylander, and Steeves this year.

McMann at C seems like square peg and round hole. He just started to find his NHL way last year and is a big, fast winger. He should be playing wing in the top nine.

Knies Matthews Domi
XXXX Nylander Marner
XXXX Tavares McMann
Dewar Kampf Jarnkrok

The XXXX's and injury fill ins is where the kids should get their chance this year.

I like L1, but I would probably put McMann on L2 and move the rookie down to L4. That would be a lot of pressure on any of the rookies to start them on L2. Unfortunately it would also weaken L3.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Because I know he's not because I've seen it tried by both Babcock and Keefe it never works.

He was drafted 10 years ago,if he was going to be a center in the NHL he would be by now.

He likely would have been playing centre the last few years if not for the Tavares hiring.

He's been tried for one or two games a couple of times in the regular season and a whopping great four games in preseason. He hasn't looked terrible in any.

In your opinion you think it won't work. I think it will, and Berube seems to want to try it.

 

[NJG]

It doesn't matter if McMann was originally a center, so was William Nylander, so was Phil Kessel, that doesn't make them centers now.

And the same applies the other way around, just because they are used as wingers now doesn't mean they can't be centers... You're comparing two offensive forwards with no defensive game to McMann who is a two way forward who's style suits a center role while Nylander and Kessel's style do not suit a center role because they are horrible defensively.

 

[conFABulator]

I like L1, but I would probably put McMann on L2 and move the rookie down to L4. That would be a lot of pressure on any of the rookies to start them on L2. Unfortunately it would also weaken L3.

Fair, it depends who the rookie is though. I don't really like putting a too six forward prospect on the bottom line. I would rather see that player develop as a top six on the Marlies.

Minten, Quillan, Steeves, Tverberg, Hirvonen could all play on the fourth line. I think Cowan and Grebyonkin need to be too nine.

I put McMann on the third line, because I like him and think he can carry a line a bit and I don't see big ice time differences between L2 and L3.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

He likely would have been playing centre the last few years if not for the Tavares hiring.

He's been tried for one or two games a couple of times in the regular season and a whopping great four games in preseason. He hasn't looked terrible in any.

In your opinion you think it won't work. I think it will, and Berube seems to want to try it.

Where have you gotten any indication Berube wants to try it?

 

[notDatsyuk]

Where have you gotten any indication Berube wants to try it?

It has been mentioned in these threads that he said he would try it.